RDS Posted September 23, 2015 Share Posted September 23, 2015 Does anyone else have this problem. The first time I operate any of my points, the Track Layout part of the display flashes on and off rapidly many times. It flashes so quickly I cannot keep up to count them but I am suspecting that it is around 25 times. I have 32 sets of points. This has only happened since I 'upgraded' RailMaster to v1.62 This only occurs once and the next time I operate any of my points, it all works perfectly. However, if I shut down RailMaster and start again, the same thing occurs again and the layout part of the screen flashes. It is as if it is constantly redrawing the image. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chrissaf Posted September 24, 2015 Share Posted September 24, 2015 Doesn't happen on my 1.62 version. I have noticed however that HRMS still seem to be tinkering with the 1.62 release. Out of curiosity I downloaded 1.62 setup.exe from the RM forum link last night and compared the file properties to the one I installed a few days ago. The file size was different even though the file version was shown the same. My installed version that doesn't exhibit your described behaviour is 69,293,175 bytes..EDIT; Still on Win 8.1 by the way, not Win10 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RDS Posted September 24, 2015 Author Share Posted September 24, 2015 Thanks Chris. I am guessing that it has not happened to anyone else otherwise I imagine it would have been reported before.I have commented on the configuration control aspects of RailMaster before. Every change to the software should have a unique sub version number, like 1.62.1, 1.62.2 etc, before going to a new version of 1.6 or 1.7 and then finally a new issue number 2.0 or 3.0 etc etc. To have to note when you downloaded it is not acceptable in my view when trying to describe the version you are running. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teedoubleudee Posted September 24, 2015 Share Posted September 24, 2015 You are right RDS. It is standard practice throughout the software industry that ANY change of code, even only one line, should be issued with a different ascending sub release identification number in the manner you describe. Additionally each release should be issued with release notes identifying changes to previous releases no matter how small. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
96RAF Posted September 24, 2015 Share Posted September 24, 2015 No flashing on my latest revision - the one with the cog wheel running Am-Pack on Win 8.1. I was just about to start a new thread on exactly the same subject of configuration control. Some of you may remember I had a go about this as long ago as last year and was not well received for my comments. So without any further malice or critiscism from me would HRMS please like to consider this suggestion: Some software organisations, especially open source e.g.:Rocrail (Model Railway Control) - see here .. http://rocrail.net/software/rocrail-snapshot/ and Kodi (Android Smart Internet TV box) - and here... http://kodi.tv/download/ offer a link - not direct to a download of the latest software version - but to a webpage where there is listed for each supported platform operating system the choice of downloading the last and usually all previous stable versions of the software, as well as the current beta version and in some cases even the next developement version. I know open source beta/next versions are put out there so that proficient people can make their own contribution to the collective effort but it could help HRMS by way of intelligent user feedback. Users could pick whichever revision level they were happy with rather than having to rely upon either an automatic download from within the application or by way of picking up clues such as the recent cog-wheel in the Help dialogue box (good idea by the way). If a download was available and noted by RM at startup it could raise a flag asking if the user wanted to go for it, as many software packages already do. Those users who wanted to try out the latest fixes at increasing risk could opt for the beta or developement versions knowing they could easily revert to the stable version if it all went wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RDS Posted September 24, 2015 Author Share Posted September 24, 2015 Hi RAF96, I do think you should start your new thread regarding Configuration Control and I will contribute.However, I am not in favour of having the 'option' to decide whether to download a particular version and I imagine that HRMS are not either. The problem with that scenario is even more complicated that a normal software update because follow on software versions then have to be able to be applied to different baselines.At the present time, I exercise my own option regarding updates. For example, my Elite is still running v1.41 because I am perfectly happy with that version and I am aware from the forum of some users having problems with 1.42.I do recognise though that if a newer version comes out in the future containing some aspects that I really want on my Elite, that I would then have to take 1.42 first. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PJ_model_trains Posted September 24, 2015 Share Posted September 24, 2015 Have you got your system set so that it doesn't set points on start up. I thought I have shared this in the forum, maybe it was when I was chatting to Ray off the forum. If you haven't got RM set to set the points when starting RM, the first time you click your points it will flash, it seems it is trying to add the grey direction line in the points for every point you have. Check you have the box ticked to set points at start up then re-start RM. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RDS Posted September 24, 2015 Author Share Posted September 24, 2015 Hi PJI have not got the points to set at start up because I did not want that option but I don't want the diagram to redraw itself 20 odd times either. This looks like another 'unwanted' feature of v1.62. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PJ_model_trains Posted September 24, 2015 Share Posted September 24, 2015 Hi RDS I understand what you are saying, neither do I. Please test it though to confirm it only happens when the box is unticked and is the same problem you are experiencing. HRMS want us to set points everytime, they have more or less said that earlier in the year. It looks like they have tried another method to get us to set all points at start up of RM. I think their theory is, RM cannot know what points are set at unless it sets them itself at start up. My view would be RM knows what points are set at if I manually set them before a journey or use in a program to set before the train starts up which I tend to do anyway. I may not want my points set a certain way everytime I start RM, I certainly don't see the point in starting RM to find I run a program and reset them again a different way. Wear and Tear on the points is excessive. Changing broken points isnt easy with lots of droppers for the DCC Bus and will be worse if we have LD sensors in the track as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RDS Posted September 24, 2015 Author Share Posted September 24, 2015 ... Changing broken points isnt easy ... Tell me about it!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RDS Posted September 24, 2015 Author Share Posted September 24, 2015 .. Please test it though to confirm it only happens when the box is unticked ... Thanks PJ, that has fixed it. I have ticked the relevant box in the settings window to 'set points at start up' and even though I have not slected any of the points to actually change, the screen no longer flashes. In addition, it does now draw the blue lines to indicate direction, which presumably is based upon the direction I have as the default for each individual point, even though if I have previously moved any points, these blue lines are unlikely to display the actual point direction. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PJ_model_trains Posted September 25, 2015 Share Posted September 25, 2015 ... Changing broken points isnt easy ... Tell me about it!!! Now this could be a long story LOL My concern is wear and tear on points causing us to have to change them. It is bad enough now as I have droppers on every other rail but with LD sensors as well it will be something we want to try avoid. I can understand why HRMS want to have us set points at start up, especially when there are so many niggly issues to sort with signals (of which points could be programmed to) but for me I prefer not to have them set at start up. The reason I don't is because I don't start with the same train, in the same position every time. I don't run the same program every time in the same order. Therefore more times than not RM sets the points and then the train journey, program or manual changes the points to suit its route. With programs I only tend to change a small number of points ahead of the loco, usually to a branch ahead or linking with my asssigned blocks between signals.As the loco moves ahead on its route points and signals are changed just one block ahead each time. So in that sense I feel RM does know what signals are set at even if not set at the start up of RM. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PJ_model_trains Posted September 25, 2015 Share Posted September 25, 2015 .. Please test it though to confirm it only happens when the box is unticked ... Thanks PJ, that has fixed it. I have ticked the relevant box in the settings window to 'set points at start up' and even though I have not slected any of the points to actually change, the screen no longer flashes. In addition, it does now draw the blue lines to indicate direction, which presumably is based upon the direction I have as the default for each individual point, even though if I have previously moved any points, these blue lines are unlikely to display the actual point direction. The screen will only flash, if you have not clicked the box to set points at start up. It will only flash when you click 'your first' point If the box is ticked, all points should set and grey/blue point direction bar should show. If the box is not ticked, points will not set, direction bars in points will not show, when you click your first point, as said yesterday, 'it is as though it is trying to set all points'. But it only sets the one clicked and only puts direction bar in point you clicked. That was my experience if others found anything else please confirm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PJ_model_trains Posted September 25, 2015 Share Posted September 25, 2015 @HRMS I think it would be helpful if HRMS would add a comment on here stating from their prospective why they feel the points should be set everytime RM is started. They may have a really important reason for doing this that we are not aware of. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PJ_model_trains Posted September 25, 2015 Share Posted September 25, 2015 Another consideration comes to mind here. We run RM and have our trains moving around the layout, a couple of programs are running guiding our trains on their journeys. We have an issue, everything stops and we have to restart RM... last thing we want is for RM to reset points to start up positions. Maybe at a later date RM will keep in memory the state of play but it doesn't at the moment and is not, as far as we know, even being considered for the system in the near future. RM advancements and improvements are on going, so maybe in time this will be included. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
96RAF Posted September 25, 2015 Share Posted September 25, 2015 As there is no feedback from point motor to RM (yes I realise some acc decoders afford this facility - but not Hornby ones) it would be impossible for RM to do anything but remember the last known selection it made. If like me you have the facility to change points manually, as well as by RM then it is entirely possible for my points to be out of synch with RM's version of state. Setting points at startup is RMs only present way of establishing a known baseline. Failing this you would be reliant upon checking your points manually or using route setting buttons or programs to make safe way before any loco despatch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PJ_model_trains Posted September 25, 2015 Share Posted September 25, 2015 HI RAF I am sure HRMS want us to set points at start up for the reason you have stated, especially whilst there are bugs but, I find many points are set at start up and changed manually or with programs. I use programs to control points in the block ahead whilst the train is in the current block, this is done at the same time as setting signals controlling what happens in the next block, this allows the train to run smoothly on its journey unless of course a red aspect signal is set to stop the loco. But I only change points and signals for the block ahead as changing them to far ahead can affect another train on another route that may be branching on or off the line at some stage ahead. Therefore points are set as needed for each trains route not as RM wants them on start up, we need to keep the option to set them or not set them but the flashing screen seems to be a bit OTT. I don't think the flashing screen is needed if we don't use set points and signals at start up. A pop up would do the job just as well saying something like, 'Your Points and Signals were not setwhen RM started'. Changing points over and over again when not necessary adds greatly to the wear and tear of the points. Constantly restarting RM for testing signals and points has been a nightmare. One final comment, I always have points set at start up when testing points or signals, and always restart RM for each test to ensure RM is in the right condition for testing, or as HRMS would be doing. But this is only for fault testing. Other than this I want to plan my routes so will always use programs and or manual for setting points and signals for each trains journey. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RDS Posted September 25, 2015 Author Share Posted September 25, 2015 ... the flashing screen seems to be a bit OTT ... Yes, it may be but it certainly made me want to do something about it and having the 'set points at start up' box ticked in the setting screen seems an easy way forward, especially now that we can set up which order, or which points we want to reset (in my case none). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PJ_model_trains Posted September 25, 2015 Share Posted September 25, 2015 Hi RDS, That is the important thing to remember with RM and our layouts, they are different and we will all run things differently to suit our layouts. Those may be the main reasons our hobby is so fascinating. The option to set or not to set the points when starting RM must always be the users choice, I just think the flashing to let people know they have not set the points is a bit excessive, HRMS could have easily got round the situation with a pop up window. Under Health and Safety in the UK, the TV programs now have to warn viewers when flashing of cameras or flashing screens may occur, this is for all age groups, but many of us older people do not have the eye sight we used to have! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
St1ngr4y Posted September 25, 2015 Share Posted September 25, 2015 Hi guys,Have we established that the flashing display is an intentional feature? With Propack, you can specify, for each point, the direction for initial setting, and also the sequence number that this point should be set on startup. If you leave the latter field blank, but still enter the point direction, then if you are allowing "set points on startup", only those points which have a sequence number are fired at startup. BUT once this has finished, ALL points on your diagram will have the blue direction indicators set to the directions configured. AND the screen doesn't flash. So a compromise for those who don't want to set points at startup is to have only ONE point on the layout configured with a sequence number (maybe one in a siding somewhere), and all the others blank. This way if "set points on startup" is allowed, then it will only be this one point, and hopefully it will prevent the flashing screen.Ray Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PJ_model_trains Posted September 25, 2015 Share Posted September 25, 2015 @St1ingR4ySo a compromise for those who don't want to set points at startup is to have only ONE point on the layout configured with a sequence number (maybe one in a siding somewhere), and all the others blank. This way if "set points on startup" is allowed, then it will only be this one point, and hopefully it will prevent the flashing screen.Ray Excellent Ray, thank you ;o) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PJ_model_trains Posted September 25, 2015 Share Posted September 25, 2015 This then leaves a question...Why the need for the point button/screen to flash it the set points button isn't ticked. Unless HRMS didn't realise there was a way round it at the time they included it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RDS Posted September 25, 2015 Author Share Posted September 25, 2015 ... compromise for those who don't want to set points at startup is to have only ONE point on the layout configured with a sequence number ...I am not even sure we need one, I haven't got any with a sequence number and the problem has gone away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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