Serious stalling issues with Hornby R165 and DCC

[garrettendi]

Hi all

 

I bought a Class 2721 0-6-0 Pannier Tank (R165-HW). While not having tested it on a DC layout (I only have DCC) it was supposedly in good running condition.

 

It has a standard Ringfield motor, and we decided to solder in the Hornby decoder. When we started we realised some of the cables were in a bit of a state, but pressed on. On running, we found it stalled on starting and later in the running, even across sections of tracks that have no fault (my other DCC locos run as expected). We were running it without the body on, and found that the only way to start it again once stalled, was to turn the wheel/cylinder inside the motor manually until it continued. This stayed the same even after an hour of attempting to run it in,

Obviously this isn't possible to do with the body on, so we've cleaned the pickups with a fibreglass pen, did the same with the wheels, made sure the pickups themselves are correctly situated. We lightly applied the fibreglass pen to the motor which also made no difference.

 

The only ideas we now have is a bit of lubrication, and possibly redo all the wiring as it was in a poor state. Does anyone have any ideas or is this possibly a lost cause?

[RDS]

If you have to physically turn the motor to get it started, once it has stopped, it sounds to me that there may be a motor problem.  Obviously lubrication is essential in the appropriate areas (using the correct type of model railway lubricant).

[garrettendi]

Thanks for your reply, RDS. If lubrication doesn't work, do you have any other suggestions as to how I fix the bad motor?

[Icurus]

I would give the ringfield motor an overhaul just to be sure :)

[garrettendi]

Would swapping out (either ourselves or through a repair shop) the Ringfield motor for a Type 7 DCC-Ready motor be viable or far too difficult? I've found one for £5.49

[2e0dtoeric]

If the motor turns easily enough by spinning it, that indicates there isn't much friction in the bearings and gear train - I'd look at the brushes and commutator, then the pick-ups.

Try the 'old' pp3 test, get a pp3 (9 volt) battery, and connect it directly to the ends of the motor brushes. If the motor runs, it is probably a pick-up problem. If you have to spin the motor to start it, it is the brushes or commutator.

[garrettendi]

If the motor turns easily enough by spinning it, that indicates there isn't much friction in the bearings and gear train - I'd look at the brushes and commutator, then the pick-ups.

Try the 'old' pp3 test, get a pp3 (9 volt) battery, and connect it directly to the ends of the motor brushes. If the motor runs, it is probably a pick-up problem. If you have to spin the motor to start it, it is the brushes or commutator.

I really need a "like" button for this. Thanks 2ed0dtoeric!

[Fishmanoz]

Just to note, there is no such thing as a DCC ready motor, only a DCC ready loco.  The motors are all the same although it is neccessary to ensure the connections to the motor brushes are isolated from chassis, a factor in converting older X03/X04 motors and particularly some ringfields.

 

However, the fact your converted ringfield is running at all shows the DCC converted wiring is correct.  If it is old though, one possibility, but unlikely, is that you have a broken wore or poor soldered joint that is losing contact intermittently.

 

And by the way, the advice to always ensure a loco is running well on DC first should now be apparent to you.

[garrettendi]

Just to note, there is no such thing as a DCC ready motor, only a DCC ready loco.  The motors are all the same although it is neccessary to ensure the connections to the motor brushes are isolated from chassis, a factor in converting older X03/X04 motors and particularly some ringfields.

 

However, the fact your converted ringfield is running at all shows the DCC converted wiring is correct.  If it is old though, one possibility, but unlikely, is that you have a broken wore or poor soldered joint that is losing contact intermittently.

 

And by the way, the advice to always ensure a loco is running well on DC first should now be apparent to you.

It very much is. As soon as I have the money, I am buying a DC controller

[choralc]

You could try something like this:

 

https://www.hornby.com/uk-en/forum/dc-from-an-elink/?p=3/#post-158445

 

That way you could check that the loco runs well before hardwiring a chip in. Note though that I use a decoder with 1 amp + and not a std R8249 in case older locos draw a higher current.

 

I have used this to test various OO and even run in some of my newly acquired N/1:148 locos.

[96RAF]

I've looked in all the usual places but can't find a service sheet for this model for reference, but if your's has a ringfield motor then the only way you will be able to fit the type 7 motor is by changing the complete chassis and there have been so many mods over the years (according to New Railway Modellers Shop and Peters Spares) that getting the correct match may be difficult.