Surface Mounted Point Motor

[The Captain90]

Because of track spacing I have one point that I cannot put an under baseboard point motor. Am looking for a good surface mounted point motor that can be wired to change frog polarity as well.

Any recommendations (Hornby or other).

[96RAF]

The standard Hornby solenoid point motor can be surface mounted on an adapter, either direct alongside the point or remotely using  a wire link, 

To add switching for frogs, etc you need a PECO click on switch either the simple PL13 or the more complex multi-contact one.

If you use the small black Hornby solenoid point motor then you can add a miniature microswitch operated by the other end of the point tie bar.

Other solenoid motors can be surface mounted with the correct adapter And some have built in switching - check manufacturers web site E.g. Gaugemaster, Seep, Peco.

[Yelrow]

All my 20 point motors are surface mounted, the small black ones, and they work fine. I was forbidden to cut holes in our Table Tennis Table, on which layout sits, in case of a future need. As it was, wiring these points became a major work of  ingenious rodding the wires  unseen. john

[Chrissaf]

AFAIK there are only two surface mounted point motors that are specifically designed for surface mounting. The Hornby R8243 and the Peco PL-11, neither of them have an inbuilt frog switch function. Other point motors (that would normally be under-board mounted) can be adapted for surface mounting via either commercial adapters, or home brewed custom arrangements. But this usually involves finding somewhere to hide what is a fairly bulky motor. Hornby produce a little trackside hut (R8015) to hide a R8014 motor when surface mounted (but the R8014 does not easily adapt to having a switch added to it, and a switch modified motor may then be too big to fit inside the R8015 hut).

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As it is only a single point in question, then I have an alternative solution. It is relatively cheap (20 AUD), very effective and simple to wire up and install. My alternative solution is to use one or other of the purpose designed surface point motors. I would suggest the Hornby R8243 as you have Hornby R8247 decoders for compatibility (the surface mount motors can sometimes be temperamental with the R8247). Then for the frog switching, use a Tam Valley Depot MFJ003U frog juicer. This is a totally electronic solution with no moving parts. The MFJ003U (Mono Frog Juicer 003U) is the single frog version. I use the DFJ (Dual Frog Juicer) version on my layout (for cross-over frogs) and rate it very highly. The only recommended requirement is that you must use the 4 amp power supply (fine if using Elite or eLink). The MFJ003U is not compatible with Hornby's 1 amp power supply. This is because the trigger current for the MFJ to perform the switching function is 1.7 amps.

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http://www.tamvalleydepot.com/products/dccfrogjuicers.html

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Online installation manual

http://www.tamvalleydepot.com/images/Mono_Frog_Juicer_Manual_v2.pdf

 

 

[96RAF]

I have R8243s with PL13switch clipped on top and they fit inside the little hut...bags of room, just run the switch wires down the side and out of the base. Using a butchered hut for illustrative purposes.

 

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[Rog RJ]

I use the Peco pl-13 switch on the Hornby R8243 motors inside the line side but, just as Raf96 does and have posted about this a few times in the past. I fix the switch to the motor wth evo stick in the same way as it would be to a Peco motor.  There is no problem fitting it into the line side hut.

[Chrissaf]

Just for clarity, RAF & Rog, I think meant to say R8014 point motors not R8243 (R8243 are the surface mount ones).

[Rog RJ]

You're right Chris.  I always get the part numbers mixed up for the point motors.

[Flashbang]

hi

There are now three UK produced specific surface point motors... Hornby R8243. Peco PL11 and Gaugemaster PM20. All fit Hornby or Peco points. (Some better than others!).

 

None have any additional switching.  Here you have a few options...

A) Fit a Peco PL13 switch to the underside of the point and use a Hornby style track pin to pass down through the points tie bar hole into the PL13. The PL13 will need careful Supergluing to the points underside to ensure the glue doesn't bond to any moving parts.  You will also have to "Dig out" some of the baseboard below the point to accommodate the switch and it's wiring!

B) Fit a micro switch to the opposite side of the point to the motor. Then the points moving tie bar operates the lever of the micro switch as the point moves over and back. Maplin in the UK are a high street retailer and their micro switch part number GW67X would be fine to use (Cheaper alternatives are available!)

C) Obtain the Gaugemaster GM500 point relay unit or the GM500D for accessory decoder operated points. This is simply wired into the three point motor wires and it then provides two totally separate outputs from the on board relay contacts.

D) Build your own twin coil latching relay board.  Needs 1 x 12v twin coil latching relay (e.g. BitsBox part No SW105) and a couple of IN4001 diodes plus a piece of stripboard to assemble the relay circuit on.  Details of this are shown here... http://www.brian-lambert.co.uk/Electrical%20page%202.html#Unable

[Chrissaf]

Yes...I concur.....the GM500D is a much cheaper and functional alternative to my Tam Valley suggestion. It is in essence a similar solution (albeit linked to the point motor wiring), but using a different product.

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I would assume that GM products are orderable in Australia where the Captain is located.

[96RAF]

Just for clarity, RAF & Rog, I think meant to say R8014 point motors not R8243 (R8243 are the surface mount ones).

A picture is worth a thousand words, especially when one of them is wrong - which is why I posted it - the picture that is. apologies for the error.

[The Captain90]

Thanks for the suggestions - much appreciated. Will most likely use Chris's suggestion (I already have the 4 amp power supply) but with a Peco surface point motor.

[Jezza62]

 As you're in the DCC section I'm assuming the points are under DCC control - you may wan to consider the DCC Concepts DCD-ADS2 Solenoid accessory decoder - which has frog switching and LED control - this is the 2 point module - about £17 and there is an 8 point module - about £60 - they can also by triggered with momentay switches if desired.