R070 Turntable Configuration in Railmaster

[St1ngr4y]

As a follow-on to the thread "R070 Hornby Turn-table to DCC including images", I have put together these notes regarding the configuration of a R070 Turntable in Railmaster, and its operation, both from the main screen and within Railmaster programs.

1.Configuration

There are two ways of configuring the R070 in Railmaster, and I would recommend that both ways are used, using the same DCC address in each case. Since the R070 is driven via a locomotive decoder, the first configuration method is simply to add it to the locomotives list as if it were a locomotive:- 

/media/tinymce_upload/35863e953643b9132c9b6b4667a4260e.png

 

By the way, the image of a turntable in the configuration above is not supplied with RM. I downloaded the large R070 image from the Hornby website shop, and reduced to a size which RM could handle. 

I placed it in the folder C:Program Files (x86)RailMasterLocosSmall where it can be found during the configuration as a loco. It’s called R070.jpg and here it is if you want it:-1.       Configuration

There are two ways of configuring the R070 in Railmaster, and I would strongly recommend that both ways are used, using the same DCC address in each case. Since the R070 is driven via a locomotive decoder, the first configuration method is simply to add it to the locomotives list as if it were a locomotive:-

[Fishmanoz]

Excellent Ray, most informative and easily understood.  Maybe it should go in a sticky thread.  Adam?

[RDS]

I agree.  Fantastic article Ray.

[RB51]

I don't have, and probably will never have, a turntable on my layout due to the space available. I have to say though that Ray's post is one of the most thoughtfully prepared, clearly expressed and easily read set of instructions on the subject I have ever seen. We are fortunate to have such experience and generosity of time and knowledge on this forum. Completely support the post being made 'sticky'. R-

[96RAF]

At the risk criticism for overload of 'red lines'...

...thanks for a superb article Ray.

 

I have a mandraulic TT on my token layout but the general methodology employed with the Hornby TT for,use in RM could well be used with any suitable motorised platform.

 

One question. You time the TT with the motor up to speed then enter this interval in the .ini file, whereas I thought you would have timed from a standstill. Is this because the TT is mostly travelling continuous between tracks, rather than stop/start track to track, on your setup.

Rob

[St1ngr4y]

Hi Rob,

Even with a stop watch, it isn't an exact science. It may be necessary to adjust the INI timer value, if you find the turntable gets out-of-sync more often than you would want. As you can see from the default setting, decimal fractions of a second are allowed. Having said that, I believe that loco motors can vary fractionally in speed from session to session, due to things like temperature variations for example, and there is nothing which can be done about that.

Ray

[Chrissaf]

Here is a link to the companion article in the DCC Section regarding the physical modification of the R070 TT for DCC use.

.

https://www.hornby.com/uk-en/forum/post/view/topic_id/16815/?p=1

[96RAF]

Thanks Ray

I know about such motor variation as is documented for calibration of non Hornby locos in RM, but unfortunately Hornby kit is all based on time, rather than distance as the Lenz decoders are when using ADCC or we may have been able to better calibrate our kit.

 

For general info my TT wiring is on the Wiring Diagrams page in my linked site,  it is in reality a DPDT switch for the bed polarity only, but showing also the outlet stubs wired to the the inlet road, which works for me and by dint of the fast switch action does not lose sound when flipping TT bed polarity. I realise my TT stereo jack power pivot system is a world away from the Hornby TT method but it allows some comparison for those able to wire their own.

Rob

[HornbyRailMasterSupport]

That it a very good article regarding implementing loco decoder driven turntables.  Can we just add a few points for clarity:-

 

1.  It is recommended that the turntable icon is used for operating turntables as there is less to worry about in terms of starting, stopping, speed, acceleration and so on.  You also do not have to keep watching it and can just click and forget.

 

2. The Hornby turntable, in particular, has a reasonable dwell period between roads.  This was designed in many years ago when it was anticipated that the turntable would be operated at full speed (and very noisily) using just a 12v power supply and switch.  RailMaster moves the turntable much more slowly (realistically) and in the process reduces the noise dramatically.  The key to consistent accuracy (avoiding the drifting-between-roads problem after much use) it to ensure the following are correct (which takes some trial-and-error):-

      a. When testing the time it takes to move from one road to another always start the operation in the centre of the dwell period and stop it in the centre of the dwell period for the next road.  This is important.

      b. Using trial-and-error set the "Turntable timer" entry in the RailMaster.ini file as accurately as possible (it worlks to two decimal places - 1/100th of a second).  You can then use the 'turntable loco' set up to manually adjust it  to see how much further, or less further it should have gone.  It is handy to have a stopwatch.

      c. There is no need to alter the "Turntable speed" in the RailMaster.ini file as this is already set for a realistic speed operation (40 DCC speed units).  In fact you should find that the Turntable timer value of 23.56s will not need much varying, just a little one way or the other for your particulr set-up.

 

3. When you click either the left or right of the turntable track icon multiple times (to let RailMaster handle the automtatic operation of moving through x number of roads without intervention) the accuracy of timings between roads is maintained because RailMaster will stop at each road (allowing deceleration) and start again (allowing acceleration) so that these factors are taken into account during multiple movements.

 

We built a test layout using the Hornby turntable and standard R8247 loco decoder and after setting the various parameters outlined above had it working so accurately that during a day's exhibition it worked flawlessly both within programs and through manual operation.  Even though, as mentioned by others, things like variances in the motor, temperature and so on can affect the accuracy of movements from road to road, the built in mechanical dwell time between roads more than makes up for this.

 

So in summary, use the turntable icon on your track plan and if desired set up a 'turntable loco' for making fine adjustments if the turntable goes out of sync or if there is for example a short circuit on your layout mid operation.

 

Just as a side note, it is possible to operate DCC accessory decoder controlled turntables within RailMaster by placing buttons around the turntable icon for each road.  The reason for the pull-down list in the turntable icon configuration in track plan design although it only has "Loco decoder" listed is for future expansion, with a more intelligent way of operating accessory decoder controlled turntables planned.

[St1ngr4y]

Hi HRMS,

Thank you for your constructive comments. However, I have two questions regarding point 2a.....

2a. When testing the time it takes to move from one road to another always start the operation in the centre of the dwell period and stop it in the centre of the dwell period for the next road.  This is important.

Firstly, why is it important, and secondly, if you are watching the turntable rotate at cruise speed with a stopwatch in your hand, how do you know when it has reached the "centre of the dwell period" for each road?

 

Ray

[HornbyRailMasterSupport]

The dwell time on a Hornby turntable running at a speed of 40 speed steps as specified in the RailMaster.ini file means that when moving from one road to the other the turntable road will pause (dwell) on each output road for around four seconds.  You can test this quite easily by using a stopwatch and watching the turntable move continuously.  Start the stopwatch when the track stops rotating then stop the stopwatch when it starts moving again.  This is the dwell time.

 

Thus, you want to position the starting point of the turntable around two seconds (half the dwell time) into the dwell time, so run the turntable manually then stop it around 1.5 seconds after it pauses on the output road.  The half a second takes into account the deceleration of the motor due to the loco decoder.  If you want to be clever you can remove any acceleration and deceleration from the loco decoder by programming them to zero (usually CV3 and CV4).  This will then be more accurate in terms of measuring as you won't have to take acceleration or deceleration into account.  The down side is that the movement of the turntable will be slightly less realistic.

 

It is important to set the starting point for movement (when testing) in the middle of the dwell time as the couple of seconds either side of this act as the buffer zone for inaccuracies when repeatedly operating the turntable clockwise and anticlockwise.  This is how you avoid the drifting of the road mentioned earlier.

 

When you have established the dwell time and the halfway point you can then measure the time it takes to move the turntable from one output road to the next using a stopwatch.  This means starting halfway into the dwell time on one output road and finishing halfway into the dwell time on the next road.  This will of course take some trial and error until you get the timing just right.  When you have measured the number of seconds for the turntable to move from one road to the next you can enter that into the RailMaster.ini file "Turntable timer".

 

Even with the old motor used in the Hornby turntable you will get good results especially as RailMaster is running the motor at a much lower speed than it was originally designed for.

 

[St1ngr4y]

But surely the time taken from the middle of the dwell time of one road to the middle of the dwell time of the next road is exactly the same as from the start of the dwell time of one road to the start of the dwell time of the next road i.e. between the arrival times at each road. Then the arrival time at each road is an event you can see to start and stop your watch by.

I would also question your figure of 4 seconds dwell time at 40 speed steps. On mine, at 40 speed steps, the dwell time is 15 seconds.

I have just finished some timings. At 40 speed steps, the time taken actually moving between two adjacent roads is 8 seconds, the dwell time is 15 seconds, the two added together give the 23 seconds which I have as the timer parameter in the INI file.

Ray

[HornbyRailMasterSupport]

In theory that is correct.  We are being pedantic and taking mechanical abberations into account.

 

Perhaps your motor is old/slow.  In any event, just measure it and take half the dwell time, or if you prefer time it from the start of motion.

[St1ngr4y]

Perhaps your motor is old/slow.  .

Yep - a bit like me  😆

[PJ_model_trains]

An excellent post Ray. 

 

Well structured, informative and easy to follow.

[Silver Shiney]

Does this issue of occasional need for recalibration happen with analogue operation as well, or is it just under DCC?  I  would prefer to operate under DCC but couldn't be bothered with this hassle.

[St1ngr4y]

The answer is No because you will be operating it "manually", i.e. you decide when to switch it off to stop it at the appropriate road. You can operate it this way using DCC too, if you have it configured as a locomotive. Just click the Cruise button to start it and the Stop when you have reached the siding you want. It is only when you have it configured as a Turntable under RM when it can fall out of sync.

 

Ray

[Silver Shiney]

Many thanks, Ray