Kistelek Posted May 2, 2020 Share Posted May 2, 2020 As small industrial locos seem popular, it would be nice to see something different in terms of wagons./media/tinymce_upload/ad1205f242bb6848bf1a271ff76ded9d.jpgThis particular one was used for treated sewage but similar or identical wagons were used by many companies for spoil movements./media/tinymce_upload/fe2a8b0e27597579687d3f4fd4d74dca.jpg/media/tinymce_upload/9d48f5b5f05902ba597216b277fb1927.jpgA prototype exists at Locomotion at Shildon. With a bit of careful design, a model could be made to function and would add "play value" to starter sets but regardless, I'd buy 20 of these tomorrow.A handy wagon for the yard shunter to push around. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chrissaf Posted May 7, 2020 Share Posted May 7, 2020 TIP: As a newbie poster on the forum, just be aware that the 'Blue Button with the White Arrow' is not a 'Reply to this post' button. If you want to reply to any of the posts, scroll down and write your reply in the reply text box at the bottom of the page and click the Green 'Reply' button..See also – further TIPs on how to get the best user experience from this forum.https://www.hornby.com/uk-en/forum/tips-on-using-the-forum/. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LCDR Posted May 9, 2020 Share Posted May 9, 2020 The 'Hudson' side tipping wagon was often used to carry colliery spoil to tip on a spoil heap, and quite a few collieries had some. They were also used for chalk and limestone, and on construction contracts to move clay and soil. The one in the photograph at the Rutland Railway Museum (Now Rocks on Rails, at Cottesmore) was a special order for Blackburn Meadows Sewage Works in Sheffield which has a longer than usual tip body and wheelbase. The other peculiarity about that particular wagon was that it was registered by British Railways to operate over the Great Central route from Ickles near Tinsley East to Thrybergh Tip at Roundwood. Apocriphal stories suggest that the drivers would try to 'snatch' the couplings through the platforms at Rotherham Central to stir up the load, much to the disgust of any passengers on the platforms. /media/tinymce_upload/e4f25bdf343c96e93da9175e587d260d.JPGHere is another picture this time of No 53 as preserved at the Middleton Railway, Leeds this time in colour. (The b&w picture posted in the OP of wagon No 50 was taken by me at Cottesmore and published in my book about Internal Industrial Wagons, copies are still available at reasonable prices from the Industrial Railway Society! This contains a lot of different and unusual wagons to be found in industrial premises) /media/tinymce_upload/ede142d2d1c5aa4a3ca258920582a4d1.JPGHudsons were not the only firm to make this kind of wagon, and narrow gauge versions were some of the most common wagons ever to be found all over the world. Old Hornby Gauge O made a version of these wagons (No1 side tipping wagon) from 1923 until 1964. They were available in McAlpine livery in grey, yellow, buff or green, and in Robert Hudson livery in blue or yellow. It finally appeared as McAlpine green in the No 50 series, 1957 to 1964. At Sheffield in later days they were confined to the Sewage works which was situated just north of the Tinsley M1 viaduct. Blackburn Meadows used Sentinel diesels like the Hornby one so there would be a ready made pairing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LCDR Posted May 9, 2020 Share Posted May 9, 2020 In case it helps here are drawings of this wagon by Peter Holmes../media/tinymce_upload/aeac943ab54a247480d80addb1291fc7.jpg/media/tinymce_upload/6fa62f0752c7a09b38ef35c7ac42755b.jpgA booklet by the Industrial Railway Society by Adrian Booth published in 1986 contains much about this system. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LCDR Posted May 9, 2020 Share Posted May 9, 2020 And here is my drawing of the 'standard' type vehicle /media/tinymce_upload/4b94f662cb5fd14aa40467810e61e924.jpg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ellocoloco Posted May 9, 2020 Share Posted May 9, 2020 @LC&DR Were these type of wagons 'knocked' to tip them and to 'reset' them or did they have some sort of hydraulic mechanism? I have seen pictures of NG wagons of this type being 'pushed over' by man power to empty but I imagine the standard gauge ones would require a lot of shoving....... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LCDR Posted May 10, 2020 Share Posted May 10, 2020 They needed a 'shove' , but did not have any hydraulics. The tipper body was finely balanced so the amount of shove was not too great. The body was secured by chains or by wedges to stop it tipping when being moved. After the load was emptied the body tended to return to upright by gravity. The shape of the skip, the position of the pivot and the weight of the load combined to make the centre of gravity high so it was top heavy when loaded. The narrow gauge wagons worked on a similar principle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kistelek Posted May 10, 2020 Author Share Posted May 10, 2020 Some great responses here. I used to live near the tip at Thrybergh and worked as a wagon repairer at the other side of the line to Ickles so know the route well. The tip at Thrybergh was on the line to SIlverwood Colliery so would make an interesting layout with passing coal trains. The ILR book on Blackburn Meadows is out of stock/out of print but Sheffield Library have one. I shall be going post lockdown. I've also booked a trip to Locomotion with the beloved when it reopens with a camera and a tape measure in my pocket. :)The wagon bodies would, like many of these, be balanced upright when empty but when filled would be top heavy so wouldn't take a lot of tipping. As pointed out, they'd be chained into the upright position to traverse the mainline. Research I've managed to do in lockdown suggests these would be moved with a Class 25 or a Class 37 twice a day.There is a kit for these which I will try once they're available again but my kit building skill may not be up to it. I do think they'd be a good prototype for an RTR model though as they wouldn't be out of place on a colliery or coking plant layout. The sewage wagons are subtly different but not so much. They are also, technically not Hudsons as they were built by Charles Roberts, but you wouldn't know unless you were close enough to read the makers plate, and who would want to stand that close to them given what they carried? :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LCDR Posted May 10, 2020 Share Posted May 10, 2020 I was sent some kits by a kit manufacturer who used my drawings, these are 4mm scale etched brass of the true Hudson type (yes I acknowledge the ones at Blackburn Meadows were Charles Roberts, and the makers plates are visible in my photographs.), unfortunately I haven't got round to build them yet./media/tinymce_upload/a4dfe57433f94a01ac5b855c89f9e04e.JPG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LCDR Posted May 11, 2020 Share Posted May 11, 2020 Industrial wagons come in all shapes and sizes. Lima used to make an HO scale multi axle hot metal torpedo wagon similar to this one which I photographed at Ravenscraig steel works near Motherwell in the 1990s. /media/tinymce_upload/a003bdbb2dea1eca6da1f781f60eb8ab.JPGLiquid iron was loaded into them from the blast furnace and carried to a casting bay where the contents were poured out into ladles which were in turn poured into moulds or into steel making furnaces. They were lined inside with firebrick and rotated by strong electric motors inside the cabin. Spectacular vehicles. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LCDR Posted May 11, 2020 Share Posted May 11, 2020 As you may have gathered I am in to industrial wagons. I have tried my hand at modelling them, not only in 4mm scale but in 7mm scale too. These are some of my more recent efforts. /media/tinymce_upload/3da3bdce07478d59d90458f4a25cf0be.JPG /media/tinymce_upload/fe1ebabc40c55e5a264e2b70638297ec.JPG/media/tinymce_upload/9746e27f18b7088aa33f36ae812994ed.JPG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LCDR Posted May 13, 2020 Share Posted May 13, 2020 And now for something completely different! /media/tinymce_upload/0ff367ab22370e3aea6e38b6d89336c8.jpg Iron Ore Dump Car/media/tinymce_upload/fc0fec508dd53aa007405db112864f51.jpg Pig Iron basket (made from bent rails) /media/tinymce_upload/b3d58c7ee2e9bb2d14f3214827f6d9d8.JPG Same again but bigger /media/tinymce_upload/9bc06907ba77a95a56fb649a258ecce0.jpg Ladle for molten iron/media/tinymce_upload/aed9f5dd6697b5425fa9c28451c64894.jpg Ingot mould car /media/tinymce_upload/548059dea072980dca04e21ac0cb2af0.JPG Hot metal (Pollock) ladle Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kistelek Posted May 17, 2020 Author Share Posted May 17, 2020 I've worked on some of those ingot bogies. At Rotherham they came in 2 sizes, x4 and x8 ingot moulds (smaller moulds than those). The x4 were literally 4 wheel bogies, no suspension, a big steel "buffer" at each end and a very low hook. The x8 were just like two little ones stuck together but with pivoting bogies at each end. Steel Peech and Tozer had some big Hunslet 0-6-0 made with extra ballast to move them, originally at Templeborough, later at Aldwarke. There is a kit for the Hunslets. I know two had their ingot bogie buffers removed, were cleaned, polished, painted maroon and sent to British Leyland in the late 80's/early 90's when I worked there as I did the replacement handrails on one.Torpedo wagons were used at the former Tinsley Park steelworks. There was a very bad, fatal accident with one where a cold torpedo was shunted into the melting shop by mistake (they were normally preheated) and teemed into. It had been outside in the rain awaiting repair and had a load of water in it. Upon the molten steel hitting the water it immediately evaporated and the torpedo exploded. I believe it killed the crane driver, shunter and loco driver.The bottom one looks more like a slag ladle than a steel ladle to me. These were used at Templeborough too to take steel slag from the melting shop, across the road at Ickles to the slag works adjacent to Brinsworth Strip Mills where it was turned into tarmac for roads. I think the slag works is still there but it's not rail connected any more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LCDR Posted May 17, 2020 Share Posted May 17, 2020 Yes, careless captioning on my part. One of these from Teesside is now preserved at Kirkleatham museum. /media/tinymce_upload/6df020356bb97d5d75e3c174ce54505a.jpg Trains of the ingot mould bogies are impressive, this was at Scunthorpe./media/tinymce_upload/f4511d4f3b796b39319b696d6720a6a1.jpgThe heat as they travelled past us was noticable! Note loco with match wagons front and back. These had auto couplers.Stocksbridge works also had a couple of interesting wagon types for handling ingots after they had been stripped,./media/tinymce_upload/38dfb834911e646a4a56170e82554155.jpg /media/tinymce_upload/26bc03508e30255ba3c3845efd453363.jpg You may remember these too./media/tinymce_upload/3cef2d82870a4cf93b165c8cef3881ff.jpgA 'bitza' wagon if ever I saw one! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LCDR Posted May 17, 2020 Share Posted May 17, 2020 And I found these at Consett. /media/tinymce_upload/fff8e5ce6bf90cba4c15be5a2e12b383.jpg This one was huge. Far too high and wide to operate over a normal railway. /media/tinymce_upload/0c7c645935cb4d02df899d57807aa8ae.jpg /media/tinymce_upload/86808150620160f1c096f919df297f97.jpg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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