Midland Railway 0-10-0 "Big Bertha?"

[Chrissaf]

As mentioned elsewhere I am hoping to create amodel of this loco from various surplus Hornby bits and pieces. I understand this loco was nicknamed either Big Bertha or Big Emma and have a few questions about the prototype

 

1. Are both nicknames correct? One site says both but most Google hits on Big Emma eems to refer to a US loco.

 

2. Looking at various photos, the tender appears to be originally a standard Fowler example (as fitted to Patriots) but without coal rails and has a cab fitted. However, later photoss eem to show that the sides had been reduced in height. As I have a spare Fowler tender body already in LMS black (from the Railroad Midland Compound) I would like to find out if I can use it as it is or will I have to put it into an earlier livery with the loco number on the tender?

 

3. Although I've seen a cigarette card showing the loco in midland red, was it always black.

 

4. Am I correct in assuming that this loco only ever banked (ie pushed from the rear and always faced up hill? If yes I will not have to worry about the rear coupling and provide something at the front to prevent buffer lock.

[BluMania]

To answer the last question, there was an attempt to use her on the coal trains that the LMS Garratts, Fowler 7f 0-8-0s, and Stanier 8Fs were all designed for, but other than that, I do believe she was only used as a banker

[VESPA]

Now that is an oddball loco 81F. I am not sure but wasn't there a kit version years back from "Kays" or "Finecast"? If you hang on long enough someone will be making it as a limited edition. The ugly Fell loco is now on track to be modelled.

 

Here we go   https://www.djhmodelloco.co.uk/prodpage.asp?productid=3060

[LCDR]

There are a few 'one offs' that are popular in enthusiast folklore. Big Bertha is certainly one that attracts interest.

 

Here are a few others -

 

W1 4-6-4 (and Hornby is going to produce it!!)

The Great Bear, the GWR's only pacific

Manorbier Castle, GWR stream lined Castle

King Henry VII GWR other streamlined loco, a King.

Fowler's Fury

Stanier's Turbomotive

Bulleid's Leader

The Great Eastern Decapod

The Duke of Gloucester, the only BR Standard Class 8 (another Hornby model)

Then there are the small classes or odd individuals within a class

The North Eastern Pacifics

The LB&SCR Baltic tanks

The streamlined B17s

there are plenty more.......................

 

[VESPA]

I think "Fury" was converted back to a normal "Scot" with parallel boiler and renamed "The South Lancashire Regiment, Prince of Wales's Volunteers". I was given a photo of the loco being officially named at Bank Quay station Warrington and the Regimental barracks was in O'Leary St. I bought a renamed version many years back from Frizinghall Models. Funnily enough the NRM was offered the photo but decided that they were not interested at the time. A large blow up of the photo was hung in Dallam sheds (8B)

[Postman Prat]

Hi Vespa

 

The original 'Scots' were built in two batches by North British in Glasgow. The names had an Army theme on the locos from one workshop whilst the other batch were named after early steam locos. After a few years the 'old loco' batch were renamed on the army list.

 

Therefore I think the photo is showing the renaming of 6137 Vesta to 6137 The PrinceVolunteers South Lancashire. 6138 Fury was named in 1928. It was renamed The London Irish Rifleman in 1929, the Fury plates were presumably stored until used on 6170 after rebuilding.

 

Trust the above is helpful

 

😀

[atom3624]

Fury exploded first didn't it, killing the crew?

 

Al.

[Postman Prat]

Yes, although I don't know if it was the whole crew. I know nothing else, such as where etc

 

[LCDR]

On February 10th 1930 near Carstairs whilst on a test run a high pressure tube in the firebox burst on  6399 killing one man (an inspector from the Superheater Co.) and seriously injuring the fireman. The driver and an LMSR inspector were also on the footplate, and suffered shock, but no physical injury.

Despite being repaired it was not again used but it was stored at Derby until 1934 when after inspection in steam by William Stanier he decided to abandon the experiment it was sent to Crewe and was rebuilt with taper boiler as the 7P Royal Scot.6170 British Legion.

 

[96RAF]

I think "Fury" was converted back to a normal "Scot" with parallel boiler and renamed "The South Lancashire Regiment, Prince of Wales's Volunteers". I was given a photo of the loco being officially named at Bank Quay station Warrington and the Regimental barracks was in O'Leary St. I bought a renamed version many years back from Frizinghall Models. Funnily enough the NRM was offered the photo but decided that they were not interested at the time. A large blow up of the photo was hung in Dallam sheds (8B)

 

You could post a picture of that Vespa. No Moderation time.

[VESPA]

PP I wasn't quite sure about Fury and got it wrong. My "Scot's" reference book is trapped in my box room full of too much, so I couldn't  refer to it. It's surprising what you can find in a clear out so that my be a job to do. it's nice to see info such as this from yourself and LC&DR (not forgetting others as well)