Cheap 8-ohm speakers with enclosure kits

[96RAF]

Roads and Rails currently has a bargain offer of 10 x ESU 8-ohm small pre-wired speaker kits with a choice of cube enclosures you build yourself for £7.99. Or less of a bargain 5 for £4.99 or even 1 for £1.99. Handy if you want to upgrade your TTS locos.

[Deem]

Thanks 96RAF

I just order some on Roads and Rails Website.

Regards

[Deem]

I was after one to fit Class Q1 and I have bought extra for future upgrades in my Loco.

[Deem]

96RAF

I have received the speakers with wired soldered but both wires are in same colour. I try to call Richard at roadsandrails but no answer, wrote to them via email and haven't heard anything from them, maybe you can guide me which wire is positive and which is negative, own its own without any enclosure sound is very very low, I fear once I fit the body shell I won't be able to hear any sound, change the cv 160 from 4 to 8 but sound is extremely low.

Maybe I am doing something wrong or have faulty Speaker or how do l test or check them with multimeter?

Regards

[morairamike]

It doesn't matter as you only have one speaker. If you have more that one it does as then the speakers would be in opposition.

[P-Henny]

Speakers do not have any positive / negative polarity as such. Thus it is quite normal to have both wires the same colour. As MM says, if only a single speaker, then the wires have no specific connection requirement, and if using two speakers then the wire connections need to have the same phase so that one speaker is not pushing air outwards when the other is drawing air in, else the speakers could potentially cancel each other out.

Are you absolutely sure that the speakers are 8 ohm. If they are greater than 8 ohms then the volume will reduce proportionally.

Note that measuring speaker coils with a multimeter will not give an accurate reading as the 8 ohms is stated as an inductive impedance typically measured at 1Khz frequency.

[96RAF]

The sound outwith an enclosure and loco will be weak. Once sealed into the enclosure and mounted in a box such as a tender the volume and clarity will be better. It is important the speaker driver is sealed to the enclosure else it can and likely will crackle or distort.

[Deem]

Listened to you all and watched few video's, now I know how to make enclosure to improve the sound, still not loud for my liking but I can only install this size speaker in Class Q1 in Loco body.

Thanks Again for your help.

Regards

[Deem]

How can I install 2 of Sugarcube in my Loco but keep the 8 Ohm impedance. If I am understanding correctly,

install in parallel impedance will be 4 ohm but if I install in series, impedance will be 8 ohm.

Other option I can think is to buy 2 x 4 ohm sugarcube and install them in series?

[96RAF]

If you install 2x8ohm in series you will get 16ohm. You would need 2x4ohm in series to achieve 8ohm. I bought some old ESU 4ohm speakers in enclosures and I run them in series. Nice tone and volume.

[Deem]

Thanks 96RAF

most of my locos are steam engine and as I don't like to run the wires from loco to tender, I am limited to use smallest speaker due to limited space.

In diesel or electric locos space is not an issue, in these locos I can install 2 x 4ohm speakers.

I even looked in roadsandrails - Youchoose website to find something to be small enough in 4 ohm so I can install 2 speakers but I haven't found anything yet.

Regards

[96RAF]

I am surprised no one has come up with a tubular enclosure that would snug fit into a steam boiler leaving the forward chassis area free for the decoder.

I reckon my std driver would suit such a tube.

[ColinB]

I must admit I find those sugar cube speakers a nightmare. They are a pain to solder to, difficult to insulate and they never seem loud enough. I have used them on some tank engines where there literally is no room. I found the ice cube ones from YouChoos better, but they don't always fit in some locos.

[Deem]

96RAF

I am still learning and new to this hobby also very grateful for valuable input I am getting from you all.

Colinb

I received pre wired 5 x sugarcube so I can't comment on how difficult soldering on these speakers, however as for sound, once I close the enclosure which came with the speaker all of sudden sound improved, and once I put the body shell on sound improved even more. However I would have preferred little more volume and little extra base, hence the reason I asked the question if I can install 2 of these in Loco body.

Regards

[Deem]

[Deem]

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1RVOgrUKQee2Oiq9H4Ztb7Wp9MuaWI4hA/view?usp=sharing

Here is the link with SugarCube speaker fitted under flywheel and with CV 160 and Value 5 volume setting.

Regards

[Deem]

Also installed same speaker in Hornby R3060 Flying Scotsman with Sugarcube speaker and sounds level are roughly the same as above Hornby P2 video I just uploaded.

Regards

[Deem]

Hello

Another question:

To improve sound from these sugarcube speaker (if I can find them in 4 ohms), I was advised to you use 2 x 4ohm speakers in series to have 8 ohm to use with TTS.

questions is: would the built in amp in TTS decoder would be able to handle increase in wattage?

I am considering to install speakers in Q1 Tender body so have enough room to install 2 x speakers, that's why this question.

Regards

[Rog RJ]

There is no increase in wattage.

[5Dublo2]

To improve sound from these sugarcube speaker (if I can find them in 4 ohms), I was advised to you use 2 x 4ohm speakers in series to have 8 ohm to use with TTS.

questions is: would the built in amp in TTS decoder would be able to handle increase in wattage?

 

 

I guess 1 sugarcube speaker might be better or close to the default TTS speaker so 2 would be better.

However you've kind of got the power question the wrong way around. The reason to get to 8 ohm is to decrease the current/power not increase it.

Think of the decoder as providing a specific voltage for a certain sound. Let's says that voltage is 1.6V

 

 

The equation for current is Amps = Volts / Ohms

• using 4 Ohm, the current drawn will be 1.6 / 4 = 0.4 Amps (400mA)
• using 8 Ohm, the current drawn will be 1.6 / 8 = 0.2 Amps (200mA)

 

 

The equation for Power is then Watts = Volts * Amps

• for 4 Ohm we get 1.6 * 0.4 = 0.64 Watts
• for 8 Ohm we get 1.6 * 0.2 = 0.32 Watts

 

 

So if decoder is designed for 8 Ohm and the speaker you are replacing is 8 Ohm, then accidentally using a single 4 Ohm speaker could cause issues with higher current/power requirements

 

 

Note: their are other factors in play as being sound the voltage is not constant and there are also frequencies (so impedance) that get taken into account so the above is a simplification just to give something understandable

 

 

[SteveM6]

To ‘improve’ the sound surely the way to go is to use a speaker of the correct rating and match it with a suitable resonance housing? Low quality and small/ineffective housings tend to give poor sound quality - just look at the standard 28mm speaker supplied with TTS.

Its not very scientific but I try to use the largest sugarcube speaker/enclosure that will fit the available space. Works for me.

[Deem]

Thanks everyone for detailed explanation, (specially 5dublo2) really appreciate everyone's help.

[Deem]

Five 30x20x7mm Double iPhone Speakers For DCC Sound (4 ohm) | eBay

So, I would be correct in thinking I cannot use (above speakers) in steams inside the loco's body unless I have space to install 2 of these?

Regards

[5Dublo2]

So, I would be correct in thinking I cannot use (above speakers) in steams inside the loco's body unless I have space to install 2 of these?

 

 

Well the 4 Ohm vs 8 Ohm problem will always need two of these speakers, unless you find a decoder that is designed for 4 Ohm (or designed for both)

 

 

Whatever the speaker design, the problem of space always exists, and steam locos do typically have less available space than diesels. A lot of newer OO gauge tender locos have wiring into the tender which typically gives loads of space for speakers.

 

 

Tank engines or tender engines with no wiring to the tender will always give more of a challenge to find (or create) space. However people manage to fit sound into N, TT and OO9 gauge models where arguably space will be more of a problem.

[Deem]

Thanks for your response @5Dublo2.

Sorry for not explaining clearly.

I only have Hornby TTS decoders so I am stuck with either to find 8 ohm speakers with decent to very good sound, or run wires to tenders which I didn't wanted to go down the route in the first place.

Only option left for me is either spend more on expensive decoders, or stick with limited space with smaller sugarcube or run the wires to tender to have better options.

Lets see if I can be brave enough to go down route of running the wire to tender.

Regards