R8216 stops working after burning Loco

[matthew_howard]

Hi experts,

I have a newby question… I recently purchased a second hand Hornby train set for my son (ans me of course). The set came with a Hornby Select and a R8216 decoder + 3 trains + 4 points, all mounted on a table. A great deal! When I purchased it, the gentlemen suggested one of the trains wasn’t working, but he wasn’t sure which train it was as he hadn't used it for a while.

I took the set home and tried out the set, the points work and so did the first loco. I tried the second loco but it didn’t work on the described channel, instead the loco sat there and started to generate a small amount of smoke and a burning smell. I quickly removed the said train. Subsequent to this, the 4 points stopped working. I did a reset of the Hornby Select unit and then tried re-programming the R8216 by plugging the R8216 into the ‘track’ output of the Hornby Select unit.  When I followed the procedure, the red light only flashes 4 times, not the described 7 times in the manual. After I did this, the points still failed to work. The other 2 locos still work though.

So my questions are:

1. Is it strange for the Hornby Select to flash only 4 times when programming the R8216?
2. How can I test the points (outside of the R8216), to check if they are the problem, can I connect the wires to the track power to test their operation?
3. I believe the R8247 would work with the Hornby Select unit?

 Thanks

Matthew

[Fishmanoz]

Matthew, you certainly cannot connect the point motors directly to the track. You will burn them out. 

With the loco that produced smoke, what address was it on?

[matthew_howard]

Thanks all.  

#Fishmanoz - The loco that smoked was on channel # 2. Thanks for the tip on the points, I will avoid trying to test them this way.

#magfan - yes the loco did hum.  I sinced opened it and found what I think is a DCC chip that has been 'connected' into the train (Thomas the Tank Engine). So I think the previous owner (an elderly gentlemen) tried to convert the train, but it hasn't been successful.  Also, yes the points where connected to the decoder when I tried to re-program from 60.

Anyway, the next step is to troubleshoot the decoder with a voltage meter, I will see if there is voltage passing to the points when they are activitated.

Thanks for your help though..

Matt

[Michael_A]

Well it seems a decoder has failed in the loco. The humming is probably becasue the AC voltage the DCC system applies to the track is getting to the motor, presumably via a short in the decoder. So you will need to replace that decoder in any case I'm afraid.

Why the points decoder no longer works is a real mystery. I guess the address could have been corrupted when the loco decoder failed. I would actually leave the point decoder connected to the main track if it is the only one. Remove all the locomotoves from the track, and re pogramme (use 60 as already suggested) as per page 24 of the Select manual. Make sure the point motors are connected to the points decoder correctly before pogramming it, again, as per the instructions.

If you dont have it, the Select manual is here (It's very oddly in an area of the website called 'archive'):

https://www.hornby.com/downloads/view/index/cat/12/ 

It's just possible I'm afarid that the points decoder has failed too, which would be unlucky :(

[ff2nd]

Try re-programming to 61 instead of 60. 60 is no man's land on a Select. The loco numbers run 1-59, and the accessory numbers run 61-99. If it works, the box should be 61-64. The manual was issued for version 1.0, but the firmware on the controller has since changed. Try that, and see if you get a result.

[Michael_A]

60 is correct I think? Page 24 of the manual states:

Addressing Points/Accessories:

Addressing a point motor or accessory that uses a solenoid motor is very similar to addressing a locomotive.

For consistency it is advisable that the first point motor/accessory is addressed No. 60. Once addressed the other three outlets will be automatically programmed to 61, 62, 63. There after, the Accessory Decoder should be programmed in consecutive blocks of 4 (i.e 64, 67, 72, 75 etc).When programming subsequent Point Decoders ensure that other Point Decoders are disconnected from the track.

[Fishmanoz]

Matthew, back to the smoking loco, if the decoder wasn't actually fitted correctly and the loco was still set up as DC, the chances are the smoke was the motor burning out. This is not unusual and you will see lots of advice on the forums about not running DC locos on a DCC layout despite its being possible to do so. If that is the case, you will need to replace the motor before it will work at all. 

[Michael_A]

Hmm. Confusing indeed. I would have hoped the instructions on the Hornby website were correct, but it appears there is a difference depending on the firmware version on the select. I found this on the centralstaion frum:: 'early SELECTs pre firmware 1.1, allowed 60 to be used as the first number within the first point group. Version 1.1 SELECTs start the point numbering for the first point group as 61-64. This corresponds with the normal NMRA practice'. 

So depending on the Select firmware version, couuld be 60 or 61!

No wonder people find DCC confusing ;)

[Fishmanoz]

You have to go back some years before you will find an old Firmware Select. Chances are it is latest. It tells you on startup screen anyway. You can return to Hornby for free upgrade if not latest too. 

And far better to start at 61 anyway, then your points will continue to work fine when you get sick of Select limitations and upgrade to Elite or RM/eLink. 

[ff2nd]

I thought I already had, Magfan!

Accessory numbering for the Select should start at no.61. The manual states no.60, but doesn't seem to have been updated since the very first versions of the Select were issued. If your Select is V1.1 or later, (i.e the first two numbers it displays on starting up are 11, 12, 13 or 14), you need to program ALL Accessory decoders from 61 onwards. In that respect, an R8216 is exactly the same as an R8247.

To the OP, try re-programming as 61, and see if it works as 61-64. Ignore what the book says for now, and see if it works.