choralc Posted December 28, 2014 Share Posted December 28, 2014 Input from forum members please - no.1.As this is a newer Ringfield motor mounted in the tender I will assume this is a straight forward conversion but the twist is that I want to keep the fire box glow in the loco body and run it from another pair of function wires if possible. Please note that this model did have a smoke unit but because it was defective a previous owner had 'disconnected' it. I will post photos shortly but because of the time of year expect a long delay before they are seen by anyone following this thread. The first photo should be the loco sans body so the motor can be identified and also the firebox glow enclosure location. The second photo should be a schematic of how I think this is currently wired up. The third photo is a schematic of how I think I will locate a decoder in the loco body and run wires from the tender to the loco (bypassing the brass pins and plates currently making the electrical connection) to connect to the decoder. I don't know whether I will run wires as a permanent coupling or get one of those mini connectors, complete with harness, so I can uncouple the loco and tender if I want.Input from forum members please - no.2. Does this look right and what colour wires from the decoder should I attach to the light for it to draw power and to be operated by a decoder functon. Comments on my projects are always welcome. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
choralc Posted December 28, 2014 Author Share Posted December 28, 2014 /media/tinymce_upload/R2464_close_up_small.jpg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
choralc Posted December 28, 2014 Author Share Posted December 28, 2014 /media/tinymce_upload/R2464_wiring_small.jpg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
choralc Posted December 28, 2014 Author Share Posted December 28, 2014 /media/tinymce_upload/R2464_decoder_wiring_small.jpg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fishmanoz Posted December 28, 2014 Share Posted December 28, 2014 CS, good chance you are correct that the motor left brush connection is isolated from chassis but you should check anyway. And remove the capacitor before connecting decoder orange and grey to the motor. The firebox should be made LED and powered from either green or purple function wire plus the blue common positive. Get the polarity correct for the LED. Why do you want to bypass the existing tender post pickup connections from loco to tender? They work perfectly well to connect all pickups together and making them available to use in either loco or tender depending on where you put the decoder. Mo matter where you mount the decoder, you have 2 wires to run to the other place. If you put it in the body, you have to run orange and grey to the motor. If you put it in the tender, you have to run blue and green/purple to the firebox. Much of a muchness. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
choralc Posted December 28, 2014 Author Share Posted December 28, 2014 Fishman take it for granted that I will remove the capacitor, hence the big white rectangle where the capacitor is in the 1st schematic :) To replace the firebox bulb with an LED any particular spec I should ask for at my local JayCar? Do they make an orange flickering one? I will consider leaving the tender connections as is which should mean I will only disconnect the pickup wiring from their solder tags on the brush pickups but leave all other wiring as is in the tender. No matter what I do have to make sure that I sort out which is the left and right pickup wires in the loco end and not damage the connections to the drawbar :) Tremors :( Oh and because it's a relatively new model the R8249 would be sufficient to power all this? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fishmanoz Posted December 29, 2014 Share Posted December 29, 2014 I think orange LED and if too bright, a series resistor with it. Don't think you can get flickering but I think you can get the function output to strobe on at least some decoders? And yes, I think the 8249 will do but no strobe I don't think. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
96RAF Posted December 29, 2014 Share Posted December 29, 2014 If you can get a Sapphire in there it has programmable light FXs.i just got some flashing orange 3mm LEDs out of Maplins. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PJR_slo Posted December 29, 2014 Share Posted December 29, 2014 Well you could have a look at the Faller fire effect light, item number 180695. Works from 6 to 16V AC/DC. It is a LED, but I don't know the current consumption. I am sure there are other similar effect lights available. Peter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fishmanoz Posted December 29, 2014 Share Posted December 29, 2014 There you go CS. And if it is a LED, the consumption will be well within the 100mA limit of a function wire. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
choralc Posted December 30, 2014 Author Share Posted December 30, 2014 Faller fire effect light!!! I don't know whether to crack up or shake my head :) Sounds like a lot of trouble for something that will only be seen at the correct angle and/or when the ambient lighting is very low, hehe. And of course where I am there are no model shops within a 1000km that would have that. I will ask for an orange LED (max 100mA output) and mention flickering at my local Jaycar but I may have to wait for my next visit to Cairns as they have a bigger range. The sapphire is again a good idea but probably too expensive for a nice-to-have effect rather than a have-to-have effect. I wonder if DCC Concepts decoders might be able to do it. I will have to ask when I get a decoder for the 1981-84 R.059 0-6-0T. Thanks all again for your interest in this project. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PJR_slo Posted December 30, 2014 Share Posted December 30, 2014 Faller fire effect light!!! I don't know whether to crack up or shake my head :) Sounds like a lot of trouble for something that will only be seen at the correct angle and/or when the ambient lighting is very low, hehe. And of course where I am there are no model shops within a 1000km that would have that. I will ask for an orange LED (max 100mA output) and mention flickering at my local Jaycar but I may have to wait for my next visit to Cairns as they have a bigger range. The sapphire is again a good idea but probably too expensive for a nice-to-have effect rather than a have-to-have effect. I wonder if DCC Concepts decoders might be able to do it. I will have to ask when I get a decoder for the 1981-84 R.059 0-6-0T. Thanks all again for your interest in this project. Hi ChoralcUnfortunatly, I am in the same situation as you regarding the model shops. I buy from one 1,800Km away from me. But that's what the internet is for...The reason I suggested that particular light is twofold. Not only does it flicker, but you could have it permanently connected to the rail supply and avoid the wiring from a tender decoder.You will find that most LEDs for this purpose are around the 20mA current drain, but you will need a resistor in series with a LED (800 to 1000 Ohm), otherwise the LED may burn out.I am now using mainly Zimo sound decoders and they have various user-selectable light effects. The last couple of decoders I bought came with free orange firebox LEDs and resistors. I believe Zimo the non-sound decoders also have the light effects.I recently converted a Dean Single (Lord of the Isles) to DCC with sound, smoke unit and firebox light. There was very little room for all that inside the loco (nothingin the tender), and I ended up cutting away some of the chassis to get the speaker inside, but it all works very well.Peter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
choralc Posted December 31, 2014 Author Share Posted December 31, 2014 Thank you for the detailed reply, Peter. I did not think I might need a resistor, Fishman may have metioned it too. I wanted to connect it to a function so it wouldn't be on all the time anyway A sound decoder? Hmmm. A small cube speaker could definitely fit in the boiler so the sound would be coming from the right place ... no, no I must resist. This is supposed to be a low budget resurrection of a loco from the spares or repair category with a slightly deformed boiler section. Resist ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aturovidal90 Posted January 5, 2015 Share Posted January 5, 2015 I think the 8249 will do but no strobe I don't think. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fishmanoz Posted January 5, 2015 Share Posted January 5, 2015 Ccrrect, no strobe in the 8249. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
choralc Posted February 25, 2015 Author Share Posted February 25, 2015 I have a DCC Concepts M series 2 function decoder. Is my project of fitting an led to replace the bulb still viable? If so, I will obtain a 3mm orange LED (flickering would be nice) and power it from either green or purple function wire plus the blue common positive (I have a mini-connector to run the LED wires back to the loco or vice-versa) and a resistor, 800 to 1000 Ohm, to wire in series with the LED. Confirmation/reality check please. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teedoubleudee Posted February 25, 2015 Share Posted February 25, 2015 You can buy flickering leds off ebay EXAMPLE but some decoders (such as Hattons) have CV settings to acheive same effect with a normal LED. As said above, either would require a resistor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
96RAF Posted February 25, 2015 Share Posted February 25, 2015 Or you can blag a whole box of those flickering led tea light candles from poundland and chop them up for parts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fishmanoz Posted February 25, 2015 Share Posted February 25, 2015 2-function decoders don't have green and purple function wires, only 4-function decoders. All your 2-function has is yellow and white and blue common, primarily intended for running directional lighting. Then you could use them in your firebox and have white fire going forward and red fire in reverse? Or any 2 colours you d... well please depending on what colour LEDs you buy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
choralc Posted February 27, 2015 Author Share Posted February 27, 2015 Any particular terminal I should place the resistor to the LED? long or short terminal? And it doesn't matter what orientation for the resistor? Long terminal is +ve? So that is connected to the white or yellow or green of the decoder? No purple on this dcoder. Short terminal is -ve? and that is the blue? If this i confirmed I will go ahead with the first installation! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fishmanoz Posted February 27, 2015 Share Posted February 27, 2015 Close CS, not quite. The resistor can go either way and attach to either lead. The Long lead is positive or anode, and there is a flat at the base of the case adjacent to negative or cathode. Anode attaches to blue common positive. Cathode attaches to negative function wire, whichever colour you use. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
choralc Posted February 27, 2015 Author Share Posted February 27, 2015 Thanks Fish. I even bought a little breadboard so I can test the circuit first. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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