Decoders

[Paul88]

I run the Hornby e.link with Hornby decoder.

The problem is getting the points to work (hornby R8243) the decoder is set at ports 61 to 64 as recomended by hornby. The decoder is accepting the settings but when i try to change point position on e.link nothing happens.

I have wired the points directly to the decoder to see if it was the signal strength (only 6inch for it to travel but still i have no joy).

The points on the computer via e.link say 0061.

What am i doing wrong. Please.

I have also tried setting ports as 1 to 4 still no joy.

The decoder has no wings but it will soon be flying.

[St1ngr4y]

Hi Paul,

Is it a R8247 decoder ? How have you connected it up to the DCC supply ?

Ray

[Paul88]

 

Hi Ray

Yes its an R8247 decoder Connected via Rail Master e.link model.

Then connected to track, everything is live it just will not switch te points over

Thanks Paul

[Paul88]

 

Hi Ray

Yes its an R8247 decoder Connected via Rail Master e.link model.

Thanks Paul

 

[GarH]

 

Silly question maybe but have you tried firing the point motors before attaching them to the points and screwing them down.  If the motor is screwed down too tightly this can stop the motor working?  Just a thought 

[Paul88]

 

Silly question maybe but have you tried firing the point motors before attaching them to the points and screwing them down.  If the motor is screwed down too tightly this can stop the motor working?  Just a thought 

 

[Paul88]

 Hi Yes i have tried the points 2 different sets with only the short wire connected direct still no joy. the computer reads as being switched but no will not work . Thanks

Silly question maybe but have you tried firing the point motors before attaching them to the points and screwing them down.  If the motor is screwed down too tightly this can stop the motor working?  Just a thought 

 

 

[GarH]

Is the decoder definitely connected to the main track supply and are the point motor's wires correctly connected to the decoder port connections?

[Fishmanoz]

Hi Paul, I'm not sure Hirnby recommends using 61-64, although there is nothing wrong with doing so.  In fact you can use 4n + 1 for the first poert, where n is any integer.  Points starting from 61 come from Select which uses addresses 60-99 for accessories.

 

It has been noted on here that it is not a good idea to use 1-4.  This is because sometimes decoders can reset to 1-4 and you could find the wrong points being thrown.

 

Gar's suggestion to try the motors not connected to the points is a good one too.  It is a good way to start finding out just where the problem is.

[Paul88]

Hi

Just tried the points with the decoder connected to my old DCC controller so its gets maximum power still no joy. 

With points only connected by factory fitted wiring.

Guess either the decoder is faulty or the R8243 points are not compatible.

Paul

 

[Chrissaf]

I appreciate that you have stated that you have wired the R8243 point motor to the R8247 decoder correctly, but it would be helpful for people here to confirm that fact if you would post what colour wires from the R8243 point motor are connected to the three R8247 terminals marked + C -

 

The R8243 and R8247 should be compatible, I have seen them used together on various layouts at shows and also at the Hornby Visitor Centre layouts in Margate

[Chrissaf]

You say you have configured the R8247 as ports 61 to 64. But have you also configured the points in your RailMaster track plan with the same numbers. ie. When you look at your track plan in RailMaster is there a rectangular box next to the point with the number 61 (or 62,63,64 etc) in it. Note: I think there is a setting somewhere in RailMaster to hide or unhide this box display. If you do not have these two configuration settings synchronised then the points will not fire.

[Chrissaf]

Further to above. If you do have the rectangular boxes with the correct point numbers showing i.e 61 to 64, Then go back into the RailMaster track design page, (right?) click one of the point control buttons to initiate the point configuration window then confirm that Hornby R8247 Decoder is selected in the pull down menu.

[GarH]

I appreciate that you have stated that you have wired the R8243 point motor to the R8247 decoder correctly, but it would be helpful for people here to confirm that fact if you would post what colour wires from the R8243 point motor are connected to the three R8247 terminals marked + C -

 

The R8243 and R8247 should be compatible, I have seen them used together on various layouts at shows and also at the Hornby Visitor Centre layouts in Margate

They are definitely compatible Chrissaf - I use them on my layout.  I had them working with a Select Controller before upgrading to eLink and had no problems integrating the points and decoders in Railmaster.  Unless Paul88 has a faulty decoder - and remember there were lots of problems talked about on this forum last year and a shortage of decoders available - he is definitely missing some probably minor instruction in the setup and as Fishmanoz said he needs to go right back to the start and check at each stage that the motors are firing properly before even setting them up on the system.  I know in my setting up initially I misread part of the instructions and couldn't get the first motor I connected firing but that was with my Select not direct on to RM.  Can't recall exactly what I had done wrong but I know it made me feel foolish?

[Paul88]

Hi 

Iwas having the same problem . wiring connect red to + black to -   green to C. 

Unforunatly my system did'nt work so i went back to my Peco points that work well. Despite Hornby saying they would'nt due to the voltage drop.(even on 12volt  should be 16volt)

 All is working fine now after two frustrating days.

Found i coul'nt get the R8243 to work at all.

Paul

 

 

The R8243 and R8247 should be compatible, I have seen them used together on various layouts at shows and also at the Hornby Visitor Centre layouts in Margate

They are definitely compatible Chrissaf - I use them on my layout.  I had them working with a Select Controller before upgrading to eLink and had no problems integrating the points and decoders in Railmaster.  Unless Paul88 has a faulty decoder - and remember there were lots of problems talked about on this forum last year and a shortage of decoders available - he is definitely missing some probably minor instruction in the setup and as Fishmanoz said he needs to go right back to the start and check at each stage that the motors are firing properly before even setting them up on the system.  I know in my setting up initially I misread part of the instructions and couldn't get the first motor I connected firing but that was with my Select not direct on to RM.  Can't recall exactly what I had done wrong but I know it made me feel foolish?

 

[GarH]

Glad you've sorted it out Paul88.  Not clear what was causing the problem in the first place and pity we couldn't pin it down, to use a pun, but if you're happy using a different manufacturer and the points fire via RM then so be it.

[Chrissaf]

Hi 

Iwas having the same problem . wiring connect red to + black to -   green to C. 

 

Message to Paul88.

 

Have I understood correctly that the post extract above was from you and describes how you wired the R8243 to the R8247. Looking at the R8243 installation guide (I freely admit it is not particularly user friendly) my understanding of the guide would be that your Green and Black wires are reversed. In the above configuration the firing current is going through both point solenoid coils at the same time and cancelling out resulting in the point not firing.

 

I appreciate that one would normally assume that Red is + and Black is -, but not in this case. The + and - on the Hornby R8247 are both switched negative voltages with the C terminal being a positive return.

 

My reading of the install guide is that R8243 Black wire goes to R8247 C terminal. Red goes to either + or - and Green goes to either - or +. The Red and Green can go either way round. If the point fires the wrong direction compared to the RailMaster track display, then reverse the Red and Green but leave Black on the C terminal.

 

This also fits in with the use of Red and Green on RailMaster point icons to denote points switching left and right ie. Red wire Red Icon & Green wire Green Icon.

[idlemarvel]

I have some Hornby surface mounted points R8243 and Hornby accessory decoders R8247.  They work fine.  With Hornby point motors black is common © and red and green are + and -.  With Peco point motors green is common and red and black are + and -.  Why they are different is history but they are.

[Chrissaf]

A Postscript: I can also confirm that firing the Red point icon (point turnout left) puts a negative pulse on the R8247 + terminal & firing the Green point icon (point turnout right) puts a negative pulse on the - terminal.

[Chrissaf]

I have some Hornby surface mounted points R8243 and Hornby accessory decoders R8247.  They work fine.  With Hornby point motors black is common © and red and green are + and -.  With Peco point motors green is common and red and black are + and -.  Why they are different is history but they are.

 

I think this nails it. Since Paul88 stated that he changed from Peco point motors to Hornby R8243 point motors, he must have assumed that the wire colour functions were the same. It all fits.

[Chrissaf]

Extract from Paul88 earlier post:

"so i went back to my Peco points that work well. Despite Hornby saying they would'nt due to the voltage drop."

 

I found that the R8247 does not work well with the Peco (low energy point motors) the ones with the W suffix and 11 ohm coils. I know I bought 17 of them, I couldn't get them to fire properly even in a workbench testbed environment with minimal mechanical load. The R8247 does work beter with the non W Peco motors with the 4 ohm coils ( I bought one to experiment with), but still not robustly enough for my peace of mind. The solution I used in the end (not wanting to bin the investment already made in the W type motors) was to build a relay interface board (between the R8247 and the points) and fire the motors via an external high power CDU, but still controlled via the R8247.

 

In hindsight, If I was building from scratch again and specifically wanted to use Peco point motors, then I would probably be looking for an alternative accessory decoder to the R8247.

[Paul88]

Guess i need to try and wire up differently. As people are suggesting Black C   Red&Green either +or-  never thought of that one a job for first thing in the morning.

[Michael_A]

Sorry to say Hornby have fallen behind with their decoders. They would be better off re badging some of the better ones on the market, and it would actually stop the damage this is doing to their reputation. They might even be better testing thoroughly then simply recommending another decoder, as I can't imagine there is much profit in it for them when you can pick better and far cheaper decoders from a shop in Liverpool (e.g. loco decoders from as little as £12)