Setting up the Select R8213 to control points

[Chrissaf]

Regardless of that though I still think he should get something simple working in Walkabout mode before trying it with points.

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Agree entirely !!

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The Select manual talks about configuring a Select address when using it as a Walkabout, albeit when using it as a Walkabout with another Select. From memory, is this something you had to do when using it as a Walkabout with the Elite, or did the Elite just recognise the Select was attached and just respond to it?

 

[RDS]

... or did the Elite just recognise the Select ...

 

Yes, it just worked.

[Michael Tanguy]

OK, lots of interesting things here. If I get a chance tonight I will:

Connect my "link" cable which I think is OK

Power up the Elite. LCD should display “03”

Check the Select. LCD  should display “HC”

    Press “SELECT” to confirm. LCD  should display “Ad” (Address)

    Insert a number (1-31) which will be the Walkabout’s address

    For this example, press “1” and then “SELECT”.

    Red LED should flash 5 times. LCD should then display the default setting/locomotive “03”

All going well with the Select I will then try to control locos (As addressed on the Elite) and points (with different addresses)

and report back.

Thanks again

[Fishmanoz]

Interested to hear how that went Michael, particularly noting RDS says above the Elite just recognises the Select is there without doing anything in particular.

 

Then have you reprogrammed the decoder addresses from 60/61 yet as Chris recommends so you can see if they work from Select Walkabout with an address 3 less than the correct address, noting it is unresolved whether this has been fixed by Select firmware upgrades to latest.  And whether you've done that or not, have you tried your Elite in Classic mode (see page 67 of the manual) as this should solve the minus 3 address issue anyway.

 

Just on the reprogramming, if you do it with Select non-Walkabout, you need to set port 1 to at least 64, whereas with Elite it must be at least 65.

 

Anyway, with all of this happening/not happening depending on your point of view, I can assure you my Select's only value will be to stop me having room for more junk in my bottom draw.

[Michael Tanguy]

I did the test, setting up the Elite and Select as per the above. One loco responded to address 01 from the Select. This was the original address programmed for it on the Select. I then tried addresses 60 & 61, 57 & 58, 63 & 64 for my point and colour light signal but nothing happened, not a budge. Reading back on the posts, I can only assume that it has something to do with the "Standard" vs "Classic" mode on the Elite. I have not tried this yet. What would be the consequences of doing this, what impact on future operation? My Select came from the Hornby "mixed freight" train set.

Perhaps I should forget all this playing around and control everything from my Elite although it sounds good to control the locos with one unit and the accessories with the other.

[RDS]

... control everything from my Elite ...

That is exactly what I decided to do and although I have loaned my Select out at the moment, when I get it back I will put it at the othe side of my layout to occasionally control just a Loco from there.

 

 

[Woody52]

Hi Michael, on the SELECT addresses 57 & 58 are locomotive addresses and will not operate points and signals.

Address 60 is best not used also for the reasons already stated in the above replies.

Keep trying, you are getting close, just carefully re-read the earlier posts.

Peter.

PS I agree with others, you are better off using only the Elite.

[Chrissaf]

Michael,

Chris here. You're making good progress so far, just one more hurdle to cross. Let's review progress to date. You can now control loco with address 01 from both the Elite and the Select connected as a Walkabout - good this proves the cable is OK and the Elite & Select are communicating. Now should be just a case of getting the Accessory Decoder addresses sorted.

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As I suggested before. Try re-addressing your Accessory Decoder using the Elite to port addresses 65 to 68 (see Elite Manual Page 58). Remember your R8247 will need to be connected to the 'program' output of the Elite to do this.

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With the R8247 re-programmed perform your test again. First making sure that you can control loco 01 with the Select to prove you still have a working Elite / Select connection. Assuming your point is now on address 65, then use the Select to see if address 65 operates the point, if not try address 63.

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If using adress 63 works then set the Elite to work in 'Classic Mode' (Elite Manual Page 67). Then try test again. Hopefully you will now find the point now works on address 65 as expected. Loco control should be un-affected.

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With regard your question "What would be the consequences of doing this, what impact on future operation?". With Elite set to operate in 'Classic Mode' it will not function when connected to Hornby's RailMaster PC control software. RailMaster requires the Elite to operate in 'Standard' mode. Also, in 'Classic' mode, there may be a slight risk that certain loco decoders might behave strangely or have other operational issues. If this concerns you, then leave the Elite in 'Standard' mode and just remember to deduct 3 from your accessory addresses when using the Select. For example 65 becomes 63, 66 becomes 64, 67 becomes 65 and 68 becomes 66.

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Also if you do decide to have the Select as a Walkabout, then there will be long term limitations. As I wrote before. The Select has limited functionality compared to the Elite and as the rule of "lowest common denominator" is in effect. As I understand it, you will have to ensure that any loco and point addresses you use are compatible with both the Elite and the Select if you want to use the Select as a Walkabout. That is to say. Loco address in the 1 to 59 range and points / signals in the 61(65) to 99 range.

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Personally, I wouldn't bother with using 'Select' as Walkabout. It cripples the Elite functionality too much. You can do so much more, controlling the Elite from RailMaster. See bottom of this page for the highlights.

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You can try Railmaster for FREE. Download the application from the link located at the top of the RailMaster section in THIS forum. Install it and all the manuals will be installed too as PDF files, when you 'run' the application it will come up with a message about continuing in 'Evaluation Mode' that you accept. You can then use it to control two locos (I think two is the correct number) and one R8247. There may be one or two other evaluation copy limitations, for exampe restrictions on creating your track plan, but not enough to stop you trying it all out.

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If after getting it 'set-up' and working in Evaluation mode, if you then decide that you want to use the full retail version of Railmaster then buy the CD version. DON'T INSTALL IT, just take the Installation key code off the CD and enter that into your already installed evaluation copy. This will remove all the evaluation copy operational limitations and make it a full working retail version. Doing it this way has one very distinct advantage. Some uses experience difficulties getting the RailMaster drivers installed and working correctly (there are pages and pages of forum threads on this). If your evaluation copy installation is controlling a loco and point, then your drivers are already installed correctly and working.

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RailMaster Highlights.

• Pictorial representation of your layout with points and signals controlled by pointing and clicking.
• Multiple loco throttles on screen, so that you don't have to keep pressing multiple Elite buttons to choose a different loco to control.
• Ability to create and run 'programs'. Programs allow you to automate some aspects of your layout. For example you control one train whilst the PC controls another or more.
• Decoder programming and configuration via software menus. So much easier than multiple Elite button pressing and knob twirling.

[Chrissaf]

Correction to my last post above:

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I wrote:

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"Assuming your point is now on address 65, then use the Select to see if address 65 operates the point, if not try address 63.

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If using address 63 works then set the Elite to work in 'Classic Mode' (Elite Manual Page 67). Then try test again".

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AND

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"For example 65 becomes 63, 66 becomes 64, 67 becomes 65 and 68 becomes 66."

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These two statements should have read (changes in bold):

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Assuming your point is now on address 65, then use the Select to see if address 65 operates the point, if not try address 62.

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If using address 62 works then set the Elite to work in 'Classic Mode' (Elite Manual Page 67). Then try test again.

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AND

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"For example 65 becomes 62, 66 becomes 63, 67 becomes 64 and 68 becomes 65."

[Fishmanoz]

Michael, you can reprogram your accessory decoder with either of your Select or Elite.  With Elite as Chris says program to 65.  With Select, reprogram to 64 and you will have the point on 64 and the signal on 65.  I add this as we know you know how to do it. Also, we know that point and signal wouldn't operate from the Walkabout previously on 60 and 61.  Now with the Elite in Standard mode, they will operate on 61 and 62 from the Walkabout and 64 and 65 from the Elite.  With the Elite in Classic mode, they will both operate on 64 and 65.

 

To summarise your Classic mode risks with your current setup, without RM and only using Hornby decoders, there is none.

 

but again, there really is only one place for your Select - in the bottom drawer.

[Michael Tanguy]

Hi All

Well I have tested as suggested, programmed one point at 65 on the Elite, connect everything, tried 65 on the Select, nothing, tried 62 and it worked. Quite exciting really. I know that the Select has its limitations but for my layout this set up is perfect. I will be able to add other points with this method. I think I will keep the Elite in Standard Mode and use the values starting at 62. I would like to thank all participants for their help. Much appreciated. Now I have a confession to make in that, of course, my colour signals are not operated by the Hornby accessory decoder. They are from Train-Tech and rather awkward to programme in my opinion. Anyway I'll have to do a bit more thinking on that one.

Thanks again and...keep shunting,

Michael

[Fishmanoz]

Glad you have solved it Michael, enjoy.

 

As a matter of interest, what is the firmware version on your Select - it's the first 2 digits on the display when it first starts, with a decimal point out between those digits (13 means it's v1.3)?  Interesting because the implication is the latest (is that 1.4 or 1.5, can't remember) is reputed to solve this minus 3 problem on the address, and it's clearly not solved on yours.

[Chrissaf]

Michael,

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Chris here. Glad my perseverance paid off in the end. The forum is all about members learning from others experiences, so just for completeness of information and in addition to Fishman’s question about your Select firmware version. Could you also answer the following question for me please.

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Earlier in the thread there was a discussion about configuring the Select with a Walkabout address. RDS then added that in his case this pre-configuration was un-necessary. The Elite just recognised the Select being attached and auto-configured itself to work as a Walkabout.

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You never did confirm which of the two approaches above you found to work for you. Did you configure a Walkabout address in the Select or just plug’n’play?

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These final snippets of info will help us focus on providing ‘best practice’ answers to the next person to ask your original question.

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Thank you

[Michael Tanguy]

 Hi Chris,

RDS is correct, the Elite just recognised the Select being attached and auto-configured itself to work as a Walkabout

so it was just plug'n' play but not straight forward as we have seen ;-)

Still it was a good learning curve and I thank you all for your help. I will try to find out the Select firmware for Fishmanoz

Michael

 

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[Michael Tanguy]

The startup sequence on my Select is 12  30  03 for I presume it is Firmware 1.2

Thanks again for all your help. The colour signal is also working OK.

[Chrissaf]

Thanks for the requested info update.