Elite update 1.42

[Icurus]

Evening all

I have just noticed in the DCC download area a download for the Elite titled version 1.42

I have version 1.41

Is this just a repack of the 1.41 files or is it a bona fide update?

I have searched the forum for info but alas there seems to be none

If it is an update, whats new?

Thanks

Peter

[96RAF]

A definite update to fix a couple of things like programming dummy cars and to work correctly with B'Mann 36-577 decoders (although this was actually a decoder not an Elite problem).

Note that the new manual says although you can program dummy cars you would need a load to enable readback and that the dummy car should be given the same address as the power car.

Also I believe there have been changes made to Elite Xpressnet comms to allow a Select Walkabout to update with the current state of a function when used with the Elite.

Does anyone know if update v1.5 to the Select enabled 28 functions or is that still on the wishlist?

[RDS]

I hope the Firmware contains less mistakes than the 'Read Me First File'.

[Icurus]

Thanks RAF96, time to find my usb cable :)

I hope so too RDS! :D

[Yelrow]

greetings, being a total pessimist, i belive there have been problems in the past, updating Elite. Before i  mess up a perfectly  working one, my computer is windows 7. What are the pitfalls if any. thanks. john

[RDS]

I'm with you John, 'If it ain't broke, don't ...'

(and I don't think I am a pessimist!)

[2e0dtoeric]

People have reported all kinds of problems ujpdating Elite to .42, with Win 7.

I read on here somewhere that even Hornby keep an old XP machine just for updating stubborn Elites!

If you contact Customer Services, you can probably send your Elite to them, so THEY can have the hassle! (With the experts on hand for when it doesn't play the game!)

[96RAF]

Mine failed to update on either of my Win 8.1machines (but then it never has worked - ever), but updated no problem on my old XP machine.

Other people have had no problems on any machine.

I just wish the Elite has a reset button that recovered the old firmware from memory and reinstated it when these updates go awry. I have suggested it to them, but...

[olly]

Is the manual any different from  1.4.1  ?  is it worth printing out all those pages again?  also what are the improvements  with 1.4.2 ? Have hornby made an official announcement about the new firmware?

[96RAF]

Look at my first post.

1. New manual...

2. What it fixes...

3. Its listed on the update area of this site. so it must be official

[Icurus]

Updated mine earlier today with no trouble.

First you need to make sure you have your windows 7 pc fully updated, with no outstanding updates not applied!

If in doubt run windows update to check.

Now connect your Elite to your pc and turn the Elite on, you should see a message in the task bar saying something about installing software for your device, or similar, but basically your checking to see if the pc actually 'see's' the Elite, if it does, then follow the instructions in the update folder.  If it does not see your Elite, then you are missing a .net or similar windows update OR you are using a really bad usb cable, yes, not all cables are equal!!  Some are just awful and will hinder the flow of data etc!

[96RAF]

That's good advice Icurus to check that your pc is seeing the Elite prior to attempting an update.

[choralc]

Did my update this evening using XP on my Mac running Parallels. Let XP find and install the driverr. No issues to report.

[Yelrow]

Staying in my pessermistic mode, if update fails, will it stop elite working, as now. john

[96RAF]

John - yes and no.

Sometimes it will report 'failed to update' and you are left at the previous revison state, but some people have manged to get to a half-way-house where the Elite hasn't properly loaded the firmware nor has it reverted to the previous version - technically this is know as having bricked it.

Regardless of what state it ends up in you can still try to reload the firmware until it is successful by going through the press red button, wait, switch power on, wait for it. release red button, wait for it, plug in USB, crank up the .exe file, etc.

If total disaster strikes then it can always be sent back to Hornby who will update it for you.

Another tip is if you have the older firmware version download folder keep those files safe and if the new version.won't work for you can reload the old one.

Rob

[2e0dtoeric]

Or - buy a second Elite, and only update one. if that works, update the other. Then if you end up with a failure, you can still play when you get tired of going through the update procedure!  :-)

[Chrissaf]

Elite updated OK to 1.42 (eventually). Had to resort to borrowing my next door neighbours old spare XP desktop. Initially tried the update with my Win 8.1 laptop (the one that normally runs RM OK without issue). But ended up 'bricking' the Elite. I was surprised and somewhat relieved that plugging the 'bricked' Elite into the XP desktop started the 'found new HW wizard' allowing me to install the Elite XP driver on the borrowed XP machine. With XP driver installed, the 1.42 firmware update worked on the second attempt. The first attempt generated an 'unable to open port' error message.

.

Moral of the story, just because RM and Elite worked fine without issue on my Win 8.1 PC, I shouldn't have assummed that the firmware updater would work too. I was lucky, I had access to an XP machine to fall back on.

.

By 'Bricking' I mean the LCD screen remained blank on power-up and the green LED stayed flashing with no further change in observed status.

[Yelrow]

And one can see why one is reluctant to try. I simply fail to understand the convoluted problems associated with what should be very straightforward. Is it time for hornby to rethink this system. john

[Fishmanoz]

It's a while since there has been an Elite update.  If you think there is fuss and kerfuffle now, try going back through the forums to the last one and see what you find. Eventually, everyone managed to do it or send it back to Hornby to be done and the fuss died down.

 

Then, fewer were using RM so the first problem they had was driver installation. Drivers have been updated now and many already have them installed for RM, so less problem with that. Interesting with Chris though and 8.1 problems even though driver installed. Next problem they had was failing to put their Elite into update mode with the button pressing and holding and delays.  I'm certain many failed because they didn't do this properly.  Then, even with having done this, some machines from XP to 8 just simply failed to load the update.  Nearly always they managed it on another machine.  I suspect it is some weird combination of hardware/BIOS and I don't know what that is the problem.  Many people who couldn't do it at first managed it eventually with forum help.

 

A need for a rethink john, not at all.

[96RAF]

Quite often if you have your pc set for automatic updates of Windows (or if pre-loaded via the manufacturers bloatware) then the pc needs to be restarted after some updates to complete the job, but it just sits there without telling you this.

 I've just started my pc this morning so one would presume it is a clean boot, but pulling up the charms slide-out in Win 8.1 by mousing at bottom RH corner, then selecting power options I see an option to 'update and restart' so obviously there is more going on than Windows lets the user know about.

I agree with Fishy that some machines will never be suitable for Elite updates. At Hornby's suggestion I've even used the advanced Windows startup procedure and that didn't work either. I may have a look in the bios and see if there is an option for legacy stuff that may help.

[Yelrow]

Surely all this backs up my suggestion of a better method. If experienced computer users like Chrissaf, Raf, and several others, have probs, what chance have the more amateur, of this working. john

[Chrissaf]

Further update for clarification to my earlier post that may provide a clue to Win 8x issue.

.

Now having had the experience of installing the Elite driver twice. Once on my original Win 8.1 machine (2 years ago) and again yesterday on the borrowed XP machine, plus a thorough review of the Hornby driver and firmware update guides. I have come to the following deductions.

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The first thing that is completely obvious when looking in 'Device Manager' on the XP machine, and this is no surprise and expected, is that the installed driver is the Hornby one as it is clearly listed as "Elite R8214 (COM x)". In my case x = 4. Further confirmed as being the Hornby one, as I had to navigate to the Hornby update folder to select the driver .inf file to install it.

.

Upon reviewing 'Device Manger' on my Windows 8.1 machine, the driver entry was listed as "USB Serial Port (COM3)". Right clicking the entry and choosing 'properties' showed the driver as "CDC RS-232 Emulation Demo". Thus, no mention specifically of 'Elite R8214'. This was consistent with several references in the Hornby documentation. My deduction therefore (may be wrong) is that this is the generic Windows driver and not Hornby's.

.

In the Windows 7 part of the driver guide, it states that if functional issues occur then overwrite the Windows generic driver with the Hornby one. Instructions for doing this are given in the guides. There is no equivalent guidance or mention of Win 8x in the guides, so it is not clear if overwriting a generic Win 8x driver is an option. Don't particularly want to experiment doing this myself as it may become a 'frying pan to the fire' experience, although I could use 'System Restore' to recover if the experiment went drastically wrong. Apart from which, I now have a restored stable installation that I do not particularly want to jeopardise.

.

So my overall deduction (may be wrong again) is that the Firmware updater works more consistently with Hornby's driver rather than the generic Windows one, even though the generic Windows one works with RM / Elite perfectly OK.

.

The un-answered question is, could overwriting the Windows generic driver with the Hornby one be a solution to people with eLink issues on Win 7&8x machines? - I don't know but worth a thought.

[PJR_slo]

Chris

 

When I first installed the Elite on Win8.1, I forcen an install of the Hornby drivers - they are not signed and therefore do not easily install.

 

That didn't work, so I reverted to the generic windows driver, which works OK for the Elite, but not e-link.

 

I believe that the serial comms within the Elite/E-link is using an off-the-shelf serial comms chip and so the generic drivers should work fine.

 

Peter

[Chrissaf]

Hello Peter,

You've just triggered a memory from two years ago when I was installing Elite drivers on my then Win 8.0 machine for the first time. It's hard to remember the details, but it took me two days to get a working driver installation. To the best of my recollection, I initially tried installing the Hornby drivers. Like you say they didn't work. On the second day I put Hornby's user guide back in the box and just let Windows do its own thing and had success. Now it's evident that letting Windows do its thing, installed the generic ones.

Chris

[96RAF]

Don't get too excited about us lot making heavy weather of it John - we just refuse to accept that it doesn't work and go looking for answers and usually find more trouble than the average person would trip over.

 Peering inside the Elite the 2 main chips are PIC18Fs if that means anything to anybody. The big one seems to feed everything including the dispaly screen and the smaller one seems to lead to the USB and RJ sockets.

I have also noticed that on Win 8x Device Manager doesn't pick out the Elite by name as it does in XP.

As an aside my PCB also has provision for a speaker and associated drive transistor and limiting resistors. I wonder what was planned for there.