Lost Interest

[Yelrow]

Michaei A, i have a DCC shuttle, into which you can programme a stop. Its Tam Valley. Might be worth a look. john

[St1ngr4y]

I wanted my end to end branch to shuttle automatically, and my train stop in the hidden fiddle yards and a different one come out, plus automatic route setting etc. etc. So I was devastated when I found all that was impossible as trains did not stop in the same position. 

Michael,

If you were to persevere with program control of your trains, I think you would be able to get them to stop within a half inch of the same spot every time. You can achieve quite accurate (and repeatable) train movements using the accelerate and decelerate commands. As long as they always start from the same position, a program should be capable of repeating the same journey over and over. Do your fiddle yard roads have a buffer stop at the end of each of them? If so, when you return a train to the siding, let it slowly run up to the buffer and allow it to push against the buffer for a second or two. That way they are bound to be in the correct starting position for the next journey.

Ray

[Michael_A]

I wanted my end to end branch to shuttle automatically, and my train stop in the hidden fiddle yards and a different one come out, plus automatic route setting etc. etc. So I was devastated when I found all that was impossible as trains did not stop in the same position. 

Michael,

If you were to persevere with program control of your trains, I think you would be able to get them to stop within a half inch of the same spot every time. You can achieve quite accurate (and repeatable) train movements using the accelerate and decelerate commands. As long as they always start from the same position, a program should be capable of repeating the same journey over and over. Do your fiddle yard roads have a buffer stop at the end of each of them? If so, when you return a train to the siding, let it slowly run up to the buffer and allow it to push against the buffer for a second or two. That way they are bound to be in the correct starting position for the next journey.

Ray

Ray, thanks for the reply.

 

I have tried many different settings, and still find the 'error' very accumulative. On a long straight section an inch or so is no real issue, until after 6 cycles that becomes 6 inches. This doesn't work too well when you need to stop a train in a station, or before points.

 

I have however tonight found a (what I think anyway) clever solution that works! I am using an accessory decoder to drive a relay to isolate a section of track. In conjunction with a long period of very slow running, the train doesn't stop too suddenly. 

 

Sequence is: relay drops to switch power to track, loco accelerates to cruising speed. About 2 seconds after setting off, once train well clear of the switched isolated track, relay comes in and isolates the section of track. Train starts to decelerate, runs very slowly into isolated section, stops! Not the most eloquent solution, but a good work around for now.

 

I do use the buffer trick for the end to end, and yes,it does work well.

 

Thanks again for taking the time to reply :)

[Michael_A]

Michaei A, i have a DCC shuttle, into which you can programme a stop. Its Tam Valley. Might be worth a look. john

Thanks John. Troule is knowing my luck I will fork out $79 then Hornby wll release LD! It's a risk / waiting game. thanks for your reply, apprciated.

[Teedoubleudee]

Michael, that's a good way to do it. Last year when I started back into MR and DCC, I built a 6x4 single oval with a passing loop. The passing loop and points were all hidden. My intention was to run a full goods train round in one direction, stop on the loop and after a short while run an empty coal train back in the opposite direction. Like you I couldn't get the timing spot on so. so I also used an isolated section just prior to end of the passing loop. But rather than programmimg the dead section I used a couple reed relays under the track with a small magnet on the locos. The reeds switched a bigger 4way  relay. The moving train would hit the reed switch which caused the isolated section in front of him to "die" and liven up the isolated section on the other side of the loop. After a programmed interval, the point in front of the other side of the loop would be switched, livening it's isolated section ready to move out. Once I got the timings right it ran well except for a darned sticky point which took me ages to sort out, by wich time the weather forced me out of the garage back into the house to work on my current layout.

[Michael_A]

I also considerd that option, and I know its probably cheaper. I just didn't want to worry about fitting magnets to my 70 locos, and I'm still kind of hoping my solution is only temporary.

[GWR Greg]

I use the isloate and low run up trick. At the moment a message comes up on RM "ISOLATE" and I throw a switch. Train stops in station.Guard blows whistle and I throw switch back to unisolate track section. Train moves off. I intend to fit an accessory decoder to do the job at some stage so it can be part of the running programme.

[Teedoubleudee]

How do you set up the decoder in RM? Do you call it a signal or point or whatever? I asked a similar question last year but never got a satisfactory answer.

[Augustus Caesar]

Michael... I do not understand what the problem is with the 'waffle' you describe. Take that away from any forum and it gets boring. We need to have a light hearted feel to the subject when things become a little long and folk do like a laugh you know.

If you personally went through life and had conversations about any subject and no-one broke in and cracked a funny then you are on a different world my friend. Imagine sitting with four of your friends at home or whatever and you are talking serious stuff and all that happened was just that and not of them, or indeed yourself, at least cracked any one liner on that subject or no, then that evening's talking would soon get tiresome.

I am not having a dig but please do not spoil the forum for others just because you do not like a bit of banter thrown in every now and again... no matter who by. We have folk ask admin to remove these posts before and nothing was said or done... it's just life Michael. We all appreciate a serious chat but if one does throw in a tad of humour or silliness then let it go... don't read it. Personally I see no harm in it as long as it does NOT offend by nature of its content.

[walkingthedog]

I worked on a job where jokes were absolutely essential and I know there are many on this and other forums who had jobs that needed humour. 

Same goes for most things in life and definitely model railways. You see, it's a hobby and if a hobby isn't fun, then it ain't a hobby. 

[GWR Greg]

I am going to use the DCC concepts decoder. This has a switch designed to change polarity on points but DCC concept assure me it can be used as a simple on/off switch. I will then treat it as a point with straight as On and turn as Off.

[Michael_A]

How do you set up the decoder in RM? Do you call it a signal or point or whatever? I asked a similar question last year but never got a satisfactory answer.

I set it up as a signal, red the track is isolated, green it's live. I use an ESU switch pilot to operate the relays (I have 4 sections controlled in this way). You could also use latching relays, using the pulse output from the decoder rather than the on / off state. I also have an led with a diode and resistor across the track showing if it's live or not. Fun to watch ;)

[hosh]

The best thing to do is to invest in kryo technology - both in study and purchase. That fills in the time between now and the eventual release of LD!

 

ta da

[stuart_marshall]

I came back to model railways, like I would imagine a lot of men my age, later in life and was very keen for the first couple of years. I built a 12' x 4' layout with numerous points, signals and turntable, acquired several locos, some with sound, rolling stock and all controlled by Railmaster and an Elite Controller. I then started landscaping and bought houses, stations etc but then I thought I'd better wait because I wanted to incorporate Loco Detection, well I'm still waiting, I haven't touched my layout for over a year now and judging by how the number of posts on this page has decreased I realise I am not alone. 

What damage has Hornby done by promising us something it appears it cannot deliver?

 

[stuart_marshall]

Well I can imagine your frustration, I too have returned to model trains after many years and thought that the railmaster system was the go. I even took a trip to UK and personally visited Hornby at their location in marate, must say they were all very helpful.

However, when it comes to me to the Loco detection system I have from the horses mouth, they do not know when it will be released !

apart from that all my questioned have been duly answered.

living here in Australia I find it very difficult to understand how a company can sell something that does not work, we have laws to protect the consumer, clearly such laws do not exist in UK.

 

 

[tony_forward]

Well I can imagine your frustration, I too have returned to model trains after many years and thought that the railmaster system was the go. I even took a trip to UK and personally visited Hornby at their location in marate, must say they were all very helpful.

However, when it comes to me to the Loco detection system I have from the horses mouth, they do not know when it will be released !

apart from that all my questioned have been duly answered.

living here in Australia I find it very difficult to understand how a company can sell something that does not work, we have laws to protect the consumer, clearly such laws do not exist in UK.

 

 

What is being sold that doesn't work Stuart? LD is NOT being sold, it is being talked about and developed and in due course WILL be sold. 

RM does work, I have used it with Windows 7 very successfully on my layout at a few exhibitions and will continue to do so.

 

 

[Teedoubleudee]

How do you set up the decoder in RM? Do you call it a signal or point or whatever? I asked a similar question last year but never got a satisfactory answer.

I set it up as a signal, red the track is isolated, green it's live. I use an ESU switch pilot to operate the relays (I have 4 sections controlled in this way). You could also use latching relays, using the pulse output from the decoder rather than the on / off state. I also have an led with a diode and resistor across the track showing if it's live or not. Fun to watch ;)

Yep, a signal makes sense. I have on my old layout board an ESU 4-port decoder switching an old style Cobalt that requires a reversed voltage to operate, via a latching relay. I've also been playing with servo outputs of the ESU to drive signals. All good fun.

[Michael_A]

Some interesting posts on here. I too am frustrated that loco detection is not yet available, but to me it would enhance the running of my layout, and I certainly would not let it be a complete show stopper. Better to run trains without loco detection than not at all. And as I posted above, there are work arounds ;)

[walkingthedog]

It is a bit daft to build a layout but not being able to use it because of something that isn't available. I would say using Phul's comparison it's like building a car when wheels haven't been invented let alone released. 

[dynax]

some of you just make me laugh so much, would you refuse to eat a full breakfast because you had no sauce to put on it, put it in perspective people, it won't stop you playing trains without it,

[walkingthedog]

I would if the breakfast was corn flakes Dynax. 

[Yelrow]

Dynax, thats exactly what they are saying, that it will stop them playing. I am with you. My layout was built before LD, even mentioned, and i  certainly, cannot afford to add it, even if i wanted to. As Michael says people managed to stop/start trains before. its a tad like windows 10, you have to have it, even though  you can happlly continue  without it.. john 

[walkingthedog]

Can't you answer anything without mentioning W10 John, it's getting tiresome? 

[HornbyRailMasterSupport]

Loco Detection certainly does not stop you playing with trains.  It will enhance the automated control of trains when it is available.  You can still plan and build your layout without Loco Detection.  You can run your trains, set points, signals and routes without Loco Detection and you can also write programs and automate your layout without Loco Detection.

 

Loco Detection is an enhancement and also will be retro-fittable so it not being available in no way impacts on the design, building or running of a layout or the running of trains.

 

For those who say "Why bother building a model railway without Loco Detection" we have to say that model railways have been in use, happilly, for 100 years and Loco Detection has not been an issue.  Also remember that no model railway manufacturer that we know of has released any system like our Loco Detection system and this has not deterred people from railway modelling.  Loco Detection will certainly make model railway control more fun and interesting however it is not a requirement for railway modelling.

 

If you are desperate to have more accurate stopping of trains at particular points you can create small isolated sections of track which are made live or not by a relay connected to an accessory decoder port and simply program trains to stop at exactly the same point every time.  This is in fact the most common method used by other railway modellers up until now.  Of course Loco Detection will offer a much more elegant solution, with many added features, however it is not impossible to achieve now for those who cannot wait.

 

Hopefully that settles this thread (but most likely not for some!)

[Yelrow]

HRMS, thank you for your interjection, and advice on how to achieve with accessory decoder. I have one spare, so will attempt your solution. I am aware others had mentioned similar, but the fact i had a spare has only just registered. john