ColinB

Jimyjames Some of the railroad based locos, that are loco driven use a a ringfield based "tender" driven tender, but with the motor and gears removed. So effectively the tender will be quite heavy. I gather Hornby do it as it saves designing a new tender. It is a late designed ringfield motor with pickups on the wheels, the earlier ones just used the axles, so it is quite easy for a pickup to accidentally short again the chassis. I have a Railroad type Mallard that has loco drive and a tender that has the ringfield drive chassis but no gears or motor. On this type of tender as someone has said the pickup of power is reversed. If look at the teder from the front, on an early ringfield motor the gear wheels on the left are insulated from chassis and the right hand wheels connect to chassis. On the the later type the left hand gear wheels are connected to chassis via pickups and the right hand wheels are insulated. Your tender should have insulated wheels both sides. If someone has changed the wheels to the early type, then that might be your issue. On the original subject, have you checked there is a good connection between the tender coupling pin and the wire to the motor, this a crimp connection and can become loose, meaning it becomes high resistance or not connected at all.

Ketygee Jimyjames loco is loco driven, yours from what I can gather is tender driven. So Jimyjames is leading you up a blind alley, your fault is nothing like his. Jimyjames has got issues with the additional pickups in the tender that are in parallel with the ones in the loco. From what I have read so far, you basically have issues with the motor in your tender. Take the tender apart check that the brushes are the right length, check the amature has good windings make sure there is not excessive oil or dirt on the axles of the tender. Finally check there isn't a build up of grim on the tender wheels.

Get a multimeter and check that there is resistance between each winding of the armature, the thin wires have a habit of snapping off. My ringfield based HST was very slow until someone suggested the fault, and sure enough that is what it was.

Why not buy one of those ex iphone speakers off EBay, they are 8 ohm and give out significantly more sound. They are also nicer to fit.

I forgot to mention, there is someone on EBay that does educational aids for people learning electronics. They do a 5 or 8 way printed circuit board with biased switces and screw terminals especially for control of points, it is labelled as such. They are significantly cheaper than the other option offered. You can buy the board ready made or if you want it cheaper you can solder it yourself.

I use centre off biased switches, you can get them off EBay, model railway suppliers or electronic component outlets. I have tried peco switches, but found they were not that brilliant and cost a lot more than normal switches. I use a CDU, but at least with this set up the switch springs back so it is a lot more difficult to hold the current on the point motor two long if you do decide to not use a CDU. The only issue with CDU is if you use a large capacitor it takes a while for it to charge up again. If you want to use relays you need to find a way that they only connect for a certain time, by using a timer circuit.

The thing you should check is if someone has over oiled the axles on the loco. This loco picks up one side of the 12 volt supply via the axles and axles on the tender pick up the other side, meaning it doesn't need pickups. I have done it to mine in the past. If you over oil the loco wheels, excessive oil gets on the axles of the loco wheels which acts as a great insulator. The other fault you may have is that one of the windings on the motor is not connected. Try the loco axles first. If it is the same as mine, it is tender driven, so check that the valve gear on the loco moves freely, round bends if the valve gear has an issue it can slow the loco down. Lastly the loco wheels may have a film of oxide on them in certain places acting as an insulator.

The real pain is that you don't seem to be able to buy the con rod nuts separately. Yes, I agree the spanner is a worth while investment, it even makes it easier to put them on.

Great, thank you.

I want to buy a replacement buffet car for my very early Ringfield motor based HST loco, probably 80's vintage. Now if I remember correctly the early Hornby MK3 carriages were shorter than scale length, is this true? It is just I was thinking of buying a Bachmann buffet car, but I am sure it is probably to scale length so is longer and look out of place.

Yes, what is it with posts, you write them and read them, but once you have posted them you suddenly see all the errors. At least this site gives you the option to edit, yahoo doesn't. The other thing that seems to happen is you type faster than the webpage can update so it misses the odd character, but then you have the "texters" that are so used to texting that proper english has no meaning, like 4 means "for" rather than "four". When you have a full page of it, it is impossible to read. As for the original post, I agree too tight a bend, I hate to say it, but looking at the locos wheels and the bend that should be obvious. On steam locos when the motor hums it normally indicates either the valve gear is stuck or the intermediate gear in the loco has issue.

Actually, I wasn't whingeing, it is just a suggestion. I tend to use sugarcube or iphone speakers as they are supposedly better, definitely easier to fit and they do sound a bit better, so I usually have few issues.

Actually they do tell you how to fit the decoder in that they tell you to make sure where the number 1 pin goes. As for the speaker, if they change the design then it will have a new part number so of course it won't fit into an older model, it is a bit like me fitting the new Princess TTS decoder into my old version. The old version was not meant to have TTS so it is up to the individual how to fit it. If you look at the Princess they have just retooled to take the new TTS decoder as they released them at the same time, so for the current model there is no reason not to have fitting instructions that apply to the current TTS model, with the requirement that you use the correct size speaker. I have just bought a Bachmann class 150 DMU, it tells you in the instructions where to fit the speaker, now admittedly there is an easier way to fit it if you use an iphone one, but if you use the speaker Bachmann recommend then it will fit as they intended. Dapol do the same. As I say the instructions for fitting should be an appendix for the Loco instructions, lets face it, it is only relevant on steam locos where they have made a particular enclosure in the tender, so it would help if they explained how they intended for you to fit it (on some of them I would really like to know what they intended). Perhaps I am different, I come from an enviroment that if you don't tell them how to fit it, they break it. Anyway not my issue, I know exactly how to fit them, it is just that a lot of people are not that skilled and need help and surely that should come from Hornby. From Hornby's point of view believe it or not, from my experience, when you write instructions it focuses the mind on whether you have designed the product properly.

I am sorry RAF96, I do not agree Hornby could include the data on how to fit TTS decoders with the Loco, as Bachmann do on some of their models. Obviously where you are trying to fit it in older models where it was not intended, then yes it is fair there are no installation instructions. In the case of several of their newer models where they have designed the tender to accept the TTS speaker, then why not list in the Loco instructions how to do it. If not save the design effort and don't bother modelling the weight to take a speaker and assume everyone is going to fit a sugar cube or iphone speaker. As I have said on many occasions if you cannot do the job properly, don't bother. As for writing user documentation, this is what stops the customer breaking the product, ok when Hornby first started, you would buy another one, today you send it back on warranty and the company loses money. This is from a person that wrote mainly user manuals for complex software programs, if anything it stops people phoning you up over simple matters.

You can do a DCC upgrade to a ringfield motor based one, I did it recently to an A4. The big issue for me was the pickups, on the early ringfield types the loco gets its power, one side from the loco the other side off the tender. If you do as I did, put pickups in both so it gets power from all the wheels on loco and tender, then they run very much better. The only other issue you run into is by putting extra pickups in the loco, you increase the loco drag, which may have the effect of the loco sliding on the track when pushed by the tender.

If you want to join the two units together why don't you use one of those JST connectors. They do a two pin version and it is what Hornby used to use between Loco and Tender on their early DC ready Britannias. You can get them off EBay. I upgraded my Britannias to the latest 4 pin connector as I added sound in the tender, so I used the old two pin connectors to connect loco and tender together on my Ringfield based tender driven A4. It is so small you can hardly see it.

Hornby tend to only make TTS decoders for locos they currently make and even then not all of them. Even with the current TTS decoders, they seem to get a batch made and that is it. I know they are going to rerelease the class 47 TTS decoder in the summer, but at the moment you cannot get one although they released it in the past. I keep saying this, but I suspect all the TTS decoders are the same hardware loaded with different software. I don't know if they still use the same technology but the way you used to do it was digitise the sound, store the data in memory and then replay it through a digital to analogue converter to reproduce the sound. The only hope is they might make one for the Brighton Belle. Lets just hope that when the people that are rebuilding it for mainline use, finish it, Hornby do a special release to celebrate. From watching James Mays documentary, I get the opinion that they have one guy that does the TTS, so I supect they are limited as to what they can produce.

I have just converted my Bachmann 31-377 to DCC (I had a spare 21 pin decoder from converting a class 66 to sound), so I had to take it apart. I think if you use a convertional rectangular speaker then you put small self taping screws into the preformed holes. The space is big enough to put a double ice cube speaker if you wanted (note; this is 4 ohm, not 8 ohm which a Hornby TTS has to have), or if you wanted to, a slim small iphone speaker. It is probably easier to mount it using double sided tape.

I use vehicle molex connectors, I get them off EBay.

I think when I bought my "Thumper" sound unit from Howes, it came with a speaker, I know the ones I buy from YouChoos, I always have to buy a speaker. I suspect your EMU came with a particular place to put the the speaker as it basically the same as a "Thumper", I think it is a 40 mm rectangular one, but I am not sure. Generally, I find that even if you bought a rectangular speaker they don't always fit in the position. It is better to look at speaker mounting position and work out which speaker will work best. It is a bit academic anyway Hornby don't make a TTS decoder for an EMU. For a lot of my sound applications I am tending to buy iphone speakers off EBay, they are really slim and sound alright to me (others may disagree).

I didn't realise that about plastic wheels, I just changed mine for smoother running and initially I had issues with the HST pulling the coaches. I late found that the HST had a winding on its ringfield open circuit. It definitely runs well now. That gives me an even greater reason to change all my plastic wheels.

One of the things I will add to this post, is from my experience (may be different to other peoples), the decoder doesn't work that well with a "dodgy" track signal. When I have fitted the 8 pin variety to locos without decent "pickups" they sometimes, when they lose the signal, on occasions made the loco go in the opposite direction to that programmed. I tend to use the 21 pin versions on Bachmann Diesels and EMUs because these have decent pickups and so far have had no issues with them going backwards. Another couple of uses for them, is as function decoders as they are so cheap or something you use to test out the wiring of the DCC socket, as in my case where you have converted an old loco. It is much better to damage a £10 decoder, than a £20+ one. I have used the 8 pin types in DMUs where you need one for the opposite end to switch on the lights, again why waste an expensive one, when you are not going to use any of the motor drive facilities. In my case I don't really mess with CV values, all I want is a decoder to drive the loco, so for me as long as they don't go backwards they are perfect in the 21 pin variety.

If you look on EBay a Chinese supplier does strips of SMD leds on a sticky strip with two wires that connect to 12 volts. I have used them for kitchen lighting, illumination of my railway in the loft, illumination under station canopies and in carriages. They are not very expensive, I think they were about 10 for £5.00. You might have to wait a few weeks for them to come from China, or you might be able to get them from the UK. They use then for carivan lighting. If you are on dc you will need to feed them with a bridge rectifier otherwise they only light up in one direction and if add an electrolytic capacitor across the 12 volt wires, the lights don't flicker.

You could try this guy on EBay he sells Hornby motor replacements https://www.ebay.co.uk/sch/jacclar_0/m.html?item=254489919468&var=554159706928&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l2562 If it is only 2 or 3 months old then surely send it back to Hornby, it should not just burn out. I suppose the motor stalled and drew maximum current, even so it shouldn't be that easy to burn it out. Anyway ask Hornby for a return number, then it is their issue. If Hornby don't get the duff ones back, then they will never fix the issues. I know I always try to fix things myself, but in this case it needs to go back.

I get the opinion the design of the speaker enclosure in the tender must be made by different designers, the one for the Schools class works ok, the one for the A4 would be ok if they thought about how to bring the wires through with the speaker in situ, the Duchess, why did they bother and it seems the Princess is the same. This is not a criticism but if you are going to spend time designing something then do it properly otherwise don't bother, it wastes time and effort (and money) designing something that does not work. In the case of the Princess and Duchess they might just as well just put a normal weight in the tender and left it up to the buyer where they put the speaker, which is effectively what we are doing.