ColinB

I didn't know that but it is probably obvious, the 5 pole motors have totally different gears grey verses black. They also draw less current.

I must admit generally I tend to look at the parts and see if they look the same. Having worked in automotive design I know that generally designers don't reinvent stuff that already exists so that is generally the case with Hornby. So normally I will look at the photos on that well known spares supplier, take a flyer and order the gears and hope they fit. Fortunately most Hornby spares if you get them from the right source are cheap and worth taking a chance. Generally I get it right although the new rebuild of the Princess class the gears are totally different as is the motor (same shell but spins at twice the speed). I can only suggest then to buy the gears for a rebuilt Merchant Navy or Duchess/City class (they are the same). The gear on the axle can be obtained from a guy selling them on EBay. I just looked at the one on sale at Hattons that is a standard one, the R number confused me. Fortunately Hornby haven't changed the design much. The wheels are the same as the Rebuilt West Country so you can buy them. The arrangement is exactly the same as a Duchess, I have just rebuilt one from bits using Duchess gears. You can definitely get them on EBay and I think New Modellers and Lendons have them. If you want the exact numbers let me know.

I did look at this post and figured it must one of the early West Countrys/ Battle of Britains made in Margate of which I have absolutely no experience. I did have one of this era but I sold it on as I found the newer ones better. I have built an awful lot of the newer ones which is no use in this case. When the guy mentioned the odd gear ratios I suspected that you Going Spare would know. Generally with all the Chinese variants up until the new designs of the last couple of years (mainly when SK influenced design) they stuck with roughly the same gears. Sorry but I honestly haven't got a clue.

Bought a Duchess off EBay as a non runner. Put it on the test track and yes it did not work. Opened up the loco to find a DCC decoder hardwired inside. So I removed the decoder, rewired the loco so the decoder is now in a socket in the tender. I then put a plug onto the DCC decoder to find it actually works and it is a Lenz. Amazing purchase. This is not the first time it has happened where I buy a non runner to find it is because it has a DCC decoder fitted.

I agree atom3624 but it may be that they particularly want a Captain Tom for personal reasons.

Thanks 96RAF. I should also warn not to put too much solder on the joint as it is very near the chassis.

For that price you can get a decent second hand Bachmann one (better mechanism, better detail) but I suppose it is a Captain Tom class 66.

Looking at the photos it should be connected to the motor terminal underneath the one with the red wire on. If you look at the second photo you can see the motor terminal with no wire on, plus the capacitor goes across the motor terminals, so the red wire goes to one terminal the black wire to the other.

Usually about 3 days to a week. An unsoldered wire shouldn't cause it to blow up. An unsoldered wire that touches the chassis will do that.

All I can say is amazing, it has never worked with any of mine with "stay alives" even the one I added to my TTS decoder. I think a couple of my Zimo sound decoders have "stay alive" and they seem to work ok but all the others I had to remove the connection to read a CV value. I am really surprised with that big a value of capacitance it works.

I must admit that using an Elite as a programmer very many of the decoders with "stay alive" don't read, but I suppose some people are luckier than I am. I read the spec for programming and 100 mS is not really long enough time to charge a decent electrolytic capacitor, so it is not surprising. In fact when I used to design micro circuits I used to allow 100 mS before the micro came out of reset. So SteveM6 which decoders do you use and what is the capacitance value of your stay alive? I had most of my issues with the DCC Concepts ones but there were others. There have been many posts on the subject generally recommending that you remove the "stay alive" if you want to read CVs reliably on DCC. The link with prices was that I just said that YouChoos did a small "stay alive" circuit board. It was relatively cheap unless you added the high density computer grade "backup" capacitors.

Yes but the problem is you have to take the loco apart to do it. Generally and I am not going to point fingers, the less times you take the loco apart the less bits fall off it. To me there should be an option to extend the programming time to allow the "stay alive" to charge up. I am sure there are reasons why not to do this, but it is a pain.

YouChoos did a very small "stay alive" and it wasn't that expensive. It was also expandable so it was up to you what capacitors you added. I like "stay alive" but it is a pain with DCC as you cannot read anything in programming mode (it is about time someone sorted that). With HM7000 you avoid the programming mode so it is a worthwhile upgrade. I was thinking about this today whilst I was contemplating buying a loco or a sound decoder. Locos are a bit like an investment, well you usually get about half the price back, electronics are a bit more difficult to shift. If you sell them on EBay how do you know someone will say it doesn't work and send back their broken one. I know not everyone is that crooked but it only takes one and it is so difficult to prove that the one you sent out worked perfectly.

There is a guy on EBay that does a circuit board to convert to 2 logic outputs to full voltage ones. That is nothing unusual Zimo suffers from the same issue, if I remember rightly it is the D option verses the C option. It is probably a bit late now but I found with Accurascale it is cheaper to buy the loco with sound already fitted verses adding it later. By the time you have bought the HM7000 added the "stay alive" you are probably getting very close to the fully fitted option.

Some people are going to hate this response but what I normally do is replace the decoder with a different type from a different manufacturer and see if the fault is still there. I very rarely see DC runaway, some decoders seem more sub sceptical to it than others. The other thing it could be is the Select getting confused. I recently had a loco that I had been running for about an hour to run it in, when the loco suddenly lost its sound and control from my DCC controller. It worked out that my DCC controller had got itself lost and wasn't sending out the right commands. I assume your track is clean, normally I get these sort of faults when my track is dirty.

What make of decoder are you using? It seems weird that you change something and it does this. There are some decoders that are more prone to DC runaway but it seems a bit weird that it was working OK then it started doing this. I am pretty sure the Elite sets this bit automatically when you set the address. I suggest you program it again.

I like your post threelink it is exactly as I feel. Things do get cheaper for a short while, which they did for Hornby. It is a bit like Outsourcing that works for a couple of years until the Outsourcer hits the same issues you originally did. I think there was also another reason stated when they shipped everything to China, Chinese women had small fingers so could make them easier. It is a British/ US disease primarily because Germany seems less less inclined to the same. The other thing companies forget is if you decide to manufacture abroad you need a huge travel budget and what happens when there is a financial squeeze the travel budget is the first to get cut, so now you have a remote operation primary dependant on IT. Sadly a lot of things only get resolved properly by a physical presence contrary to the views of the IT community, been there, done it. As to the cost of the coaches and looking around Bachmann new coaches are even more expensive, but I am sure Hornby will get there. Most people already have a set of teaks so it is a limited market.

Admittedly it wasn't a Hornby loco, but on my Rails 812 with a Next 18 socket where the sound kept cutting out I had to clean the actual connector. Previously I tried pushing it in again as Rails suggested. I think I did it very carefully with a track rubber but it was a long time ago so I can't be sure what I used. It definitely fixed the issue.

Trouble is if they don't make stuff they have nothing to sell. On the other hand they may be making enough from the other products in their range I suppose a detailed study of their profit would give some insight. Generally the people that leave are the ones that find it easy to get a job somewhere else. The TV coverage can have done Montana no harm.

I notice Rails are doing a deal on Bullied coaches, their initial price was £74 so £66 looks cheap compared with that. As I first said though, they are in the Rails sale with 26% off so obviously not many takers at the original price. Vietnam is probably ok for production but if you think QA is bad now, just see what it would be like in India. A lot of autoparts get made in Eastern Europe but I suspect with their membership of the EU, their prices are rising.

Yes Yelrow you are entirely right, Hornby are entirely dependant on China. The sad reality is beginning to dawn on my businesses.

No there aren't, Hornby are focussing on the HM7000 which you can buy a 21 pin option. The alternative is buy the existing 8 pin and a 8 pin to 21 pin converter. The other thing I have done in the past is buy a 21 pin header off a guy on EBay and rewire the 8 pin. I assume you are asking the question as a TTS is substantially cheaper than a HM7000 and if it is a P2 there are a lot of reasonably priced TTS decoders out there at the moment.

All we were doing was commenting that the price of Hornby teaks was a bit high. I don't know if the rest know I but definitely know all you are talking about AndyMac, that is why if you tax a company too much they declare their profits somewhere else, my company regularly did it. At the end of the day if you think they are too expensive then don't buy them. The original post was about their high price in relation to a Coronation coach, which is a fair comparison as the Coronation coach has working lights. So that means it has leds and pickups which would normally add to the base cost. Both of these coaches are new releases of an old design so no additional design costs. I have both of them from getting old ones off Hereford models so why certain individuals have to go diving into high level finance and personal abuse amazes me. It was a simple comparison on cost, I imagine the original post was searching for a reason why the teaks were so expensive.

That was totally uncalled for SteveM6 if I have said that I would probably been banned. So sit back have a long think and cut it out. I may complain but I also highlight the things that are good, if you were to bother looking at my posts very many of them are helping people find alternative parts and fix various issues. As I said tone it down, I thought this forum was for discussion which is what I was having. As to Hornby Towers you may not have noticed but I have said frequently that if that is up to them how they run their business.

SteveM6 we all know exactly how a business operates, we are still entitled to complain about the prices. Many industries have lost touch with their target buyers and paid the ultimate price. Currently it is Wilkinsons previously Woolworths and BHS and I am sure they were big enough to do decent cost analysis, but according to the articles I have read they just took their eye off the ball. Actually the thread was about the high price of coaches nothing to do with locos. As I have said before Hornby and Bachmann can charge what they want but it doesn't mean they will sell them at that price. Hornby can charge a high price for their teaks as there seems to be a hug demand but eventually the market will saturate as most people will have a set. High prices, late models, sound familiar, the demise of the British Bike Industry.