Upgrading Triang Liverpool and Manchester coach wheels

[81F]

I would like to replace the plastic wheelson my three Triang Liverpool and Manchester coaches and am wondering whether I should use split spoked wheels or plain spoked?

Which is likely to be more Authentic

Many thanks for any suggestions

[Going Spare]

There is a thread on RMweb 'Split versus solid spoke wagon wheels' in which it is stated that split-spoke wheels pre-date solid-spoke because of the manufacturing techniques required so, on that basis, split-spoke seems more likely.

[What About The Bee]

Depictions by period artists, known good observers, show straight spoked wheels. Image after image, straight single spokes.

Stephenson approved a drawing of a third class (blue) carriage. Straight spokes.

The manufacturing problem is this. A cast wheel has three main components. The hub, the spokes and the wheel itself. When cast, the unequal mass of the spokes compared to the other components makes them cool more rapidly. This cooling causes shrinkage. Which sets up stress concentrations, cracking and breakage.

R. Stephenson is noted as early as 1815, working on this problem with Dodds. Dodds' nephew, who apprenticed there, later patented a wheel arrangement in which the spokes were tangent to the hub and at an angle to the wheel.

81F - this was a period of the grand railway experiment. Either choice is acceptable. Stephenson even patented a wheel that used tubes for spokes, the metal cast around them.

But if you want to match the imagery, straight spokes it is

Bee

[What About The Bee]

[What About The Bee]

Here are some other, period wheel arrangements.

A chaldron on the Stockton and Darlington

A utility wagon on the Bolton and Leigh

A sampling from Wood, Practical Treatise, 1838

As a reminder, all images can be zoomed

Bee

[What About The Bee]

Armengaud shows split spoke wheels. The railway is not specified. There are some characteristics of the LMR, others not.

Note the steps are very close to the Hornby presentation.

[What About The Bee]

Caledonian LMR28 is a very unusual locomotive. Vertical pistons, and odd connecting rod arrangement. On my make list, since Hornby will never manufacture it.

Caledonian is drawing a standard first class carriage. Caledonian only ran on the LMR, so we know this is an LMR carriage. The book it appears in contains several LMR images. I emphasize this LMR association.

Note that the spokes are simple straight spokes.

Here is the interesting part for you 81F. The artist took the time to depict the unusual piston arrangement. Would he not have sketched in any odd spoke arrangement too? I think the answer is, yes, he would, were it there.

I will repeat my earlier answer. You can actually and reasonably pick anything that you please. But in general, the simple, straight spokes were depicted for LMR carriages

Bee

[81F]

Many thanks all,

Although nothing much to do with coach wheels my researches found this site:

https://www.newton-le-willows.com/?p=1751

Which is mostly about Lion 1979 rebuild/restoration but it does mention some interesting additions made by the LMS in 1929. As a result I am thinking that I should be asking about the replica coaches build for the LMR centenary rather than the originals!

In which case I am probably looking a straight coaches but a combination of bad eyesight and the quality of some of the photos on the web means that I am not sure.

[What About The Bee]

The centenary carriages used straight spoked wheels 81F.

Photographs are clear enough for me.

Bee