TTS hard wiring, word of warning

[richard_croft]

Just wanted to share my recent experience with bure valley models/ Hornby

I fitted 2 TTS decoders into a pair of Bachmann class 20’s because I quite like the sound of them and they are cheap! Because they were older models they had an 8 pin socket at the front, right where I wanted to put the speaker, so I decided to hard wire them, one works fine, the other has an intermittent sound fault where it will run for a while absolutely fine with the sound on, then the sound just starts breaking up before stopping completely, it won’t come back on unless I do a CV 8 reset. This only cures the problem for a short time.

I decided to send it back to bure valley who quickly said I had voided my warranty by cutting the plug off. thinking this was them being over cautious I contacted Hornby who also said I had voided my warranty. Even when I pointed out that hornbys own website gives hard wiring instructions they weren’t interested. They said if I am fitting a decoder to a none DCC ready model I should first install an 8 pin socket, then plug the decoder into it. (Meaning you could in theory connect a socket to your model incorrectly but because the decoder was intact they would still swap it!)

So if you are hard wiring TTS, or any other Hornby decoder (or possibly other brands) don’t expect the manufacturer to help you if it develops a fault

Richard

[96RAF]

The generic TTS installation guide talks about hard wiring may be necessary, electric soldering skills required, etc and suggests contacting a decoder fitting specialist, which it appears you are Richard.

 

Understandably Hornby has no control over a persons ability to hard wire a decoder in place but it seems a little harsh to claim a voided warranty when their instructions endorse the method both for TTS and on their standard decoder installations page on this web site.

 

Rob

[richard_croft]

I understand that its a difficult situation for them becuse obviously if a decoder is hard wired incorrectly then its fair that they would say that was the issue. However when its fitted following the instructions and still works but with an intermittent problem, that suggests that its a decoder issue because if it was fitted wrongly id be more likely to see a total faliure of the decoder.

I would be interested to hear what they consider a decoder fitting specialist; as someone who fits sound and does weathering for a living I consider myself  a decoder fitting specialist.

I have been singing the praises of TTS decoders for a long time, I really do think they are a great product for the money, but things like this will stop me using them, as a matter of principle, not because I want to.

I have emailed the CEO of Hornby in the hope that they might be able to help, thats my last chance to try and get it sorted I think. I will let people know how I get on.

 

Richard

[richard_croft]

Just a quick update, I dont blame Bure Valley models for this issue at all, they were very helpful and did try on my behalf to get Hornby to honor the warranty on it. Andrew who is the MD of Bure Valley did everything he could to help.

Moving onto Hornby, I spoke to their technical support department who said I could send it and they would look into it for me but the person I spoke to wasnt 100% sure about what the process would be and whether it would actually be tested etc. In the meantime I managed to get hold of Simon Kohler who has been very helpful and I'm now confident that the decoder will be changed.

Richard

[96RAF]

Glad to hear that Richard. I reckon it was probably all a case of left hand and right hand not being connected in the warranty chain.

Rob

[Ridgepointe Rail]

Thanks for sharing Richard..

I too, have run across this issue, but with another retailer.

 

Hello Martin,

 

Thank you for your email.I'm sorry to hear about the issues you have been experiencing with one of the Class 43 TTS decoders.

Unfortunately due to the plug being cut off and the wires being extended on the speaker, this has invalidated the warranty and would not be able to be returned for a replacement, due to the item not being able to be returned to the manufacturer.

I can understand how disappointed you must be, and I'm sorry that we could not assist you any further. If you do have any further queries, please don't hesitate to contact us, and we shall be more than happy to help.

 

I replied.

Thank you for your response. 

 I can understand that reasoning to a point, However hornby had released thousands of Class 43's that are not DCC Ready. And its possible to say that the design of the extended wire plug is meant exactly for this modification in mind as well as chip placement, otherwise a plug on chip would have been the solution. It's fair to say that wire plugs are extensively used for hardwiring, are are a benefit of this type of design and one of its purposes.I can always resolder the plug directly to wiring again. After reading the warranty information, under No Socket, its states that hardwiring may be required.It also states that any modification to the decoder will void the warranty. I have not modified the decoder itself, only the wiring.  I can understand if your position remains the same, as I dont expect you to lose any money in your business, when you are not responsible for setting unrealistic scenerios in which the warranty would be voided. I will be quite happy to pursue this with Hornby if you decision remains the same. Selling unwarranted decoders, to the market that wish to upgraded non DCC gear, with out a prior warning, would sure to be considered unfair by the manufacturer. Though a warning on your website might help, as hardwiring would have to large part of the decoder business. Please, if it is possible to reconsider your decision. I beleive that removing the plug for fitment is a fair and acceptable practice in model railroading. This chip was working fine and suddenly popped, with my friend a Retired Military RAAF Policeman at the controls. I'm sure he would be happy to provide a statement backing the conditions under which it failed... By the standard as to how you have rejected my claim, also means that any speaker relocation, to a tender for example, will void any warranty, and that any purchase of a hornby decoder to upgrade a non DCC ready fleet, will void any warranty in place.  As Hornby do not provide any Decoders, motion only, 2 function or sound, with the plug removed. That would exclude them from this market of analogue upgrades. I'm sure the response from hornby when asked about this market exclusion, would be simply to remove the plug, as its original design would cater for.  Thanks Marty. Thanks MartyDCC System supplier...   Ridgepointe RailABN 80456474982 

[96RAF]

That may be water under the bridge now as your dealer should be supporting you under the terms of the latest TTS warranty linked below which covers accidental damage.

 

Note also the paragraph near the bottom of the page entitled No Socket

 

https://www.hornby.com/uk-en/media/Fitting_a_Decoder.pdf

 

If all else fails contact HCC direct and moan about your uncooperative local dealer.

Rob

[Ridgepointe Rail]

Thanks for your reply RAF..

I appreciate the info and I'm not too savvy with UK warranty guff..

[morairamike]

I fitted three TTS, two A4s and a Castle. The decoder in the loco and speaker in tender. I desoldered the speaker end and installed. Well within two days the speaker in the castle was shot. Crackled all the time. I contacted Hornby and by return they dispatched new speaker . But I also bought sugar cubes speakers which I  fitted to all 3.

The original speaker isn't hi end quality and would be my first port if if call if sound goes. 

The instructions for say that they can be hard wired. Hornby didn't argue about replacement part. That should tell you something.

[96RAF]

According to Hornby some dealers were not altogether sure of the terms of the warranty, whch is why it was revised for absolute clarity and placed at the top of the instructions sheet.

 

A classic case of left hand and right hand between HCC and the dealer network. Added to this was the interim period when it was found that some TTS decoders were awry and needed reprogramming by return to works. You can bet your pension that there are still some of those unreprogrammed ones sitting on a shelf in a shop somewhere.

 

Rob