PhilipB Posted January 28, 2012 Share Posted January 28, 2012 I have just installed a reverse loop on my layout and bought the Hornby reverse loop module and 2 sections of isolating track. I have wired them up according to the Hornby instructions and put the isolating tracks in the positions shown on the included track diagram but the track is shorting. I have checked and all the joints are tight and there is no metal arcing between the sections but it still keeps shorting. Even if I disconnect the module but leave the isolating track in place, it still shorts. I hav googled for help but I can't find anything appropriate and looked at Mr Lambert's site but the problem persists. Has anyone any suggestions? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poliss Posted January 28, 2012 Share Posted January 28, 2012 You have the R618 double isolating track pieces and not the older R616 single isolating track pieces? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhilipB Posted January 28, 2012 Author Share Posted January 28, 2012 Yes I have the R618s Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poliss Posted January 28, 2012 Share Posted January 28, 2012 Do you have switches connected to the tracks? Can you take a photo? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhilipB Posted January 28, 2012 Author Share Posted January 28, 2012 I have taken a photo but I am having difficulty attaching it to this forum. If you wish you can email me dirctly and i will send a photo by return via email. My address is philipjohnbaker@btinternet.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poliss Posted January 28, 2012 Share Posted January 28, 2012 Best thing to do is open a Photobucket account, post your photos on there, post the link here, and then everyone can see it and maybe offer advice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhilipB Posted January 28, 2012 Author Share Posted January 28, 2012 Opened up a photobucket account and here is the link. As it may be difficult to see, I will try and explain where everything is.1st feed into the module is in the bottom right quadrant of the picture before the points. The 1st isolating track is the straight piece of track that joins on the other straight side of the points.The second feed into the module is into another straight which joins the 1st isolating track.The 2nd isolating track can be seen on the left of the photo about halfway dowm and is the straight piece of track before the curve back into the points.The main power feed is elsewhere on the lower level of the layout.Although you can't see it from the photo, there is an uninterrupted oval with no further junctions and all the joints are tight.Please advise if I have got anything wrong.http://s1168.photobucket.com/albums/r500/Philipb2011/?action=view¤t=Layout.jpg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poliss Posted January 28, 2012 Share Posted January 28, 2012 Could you post a photo of the overall track plan? I think your isolating tracks are in the wrong places from what I can see. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flashbang Posted January 28, 2012 Share Posted January 28, 2012 HiIs the actual loop running along the side of the blue wall? If so then the point shown is the lead in/lead out of the loop. The two isolating track sections on the straights after the point seems to have a wire link bridging one side?? If so, and its the start of the loop, remove these two links.A reverse loop needs both lead in and lead out ends to have two gaps or insulation joints to make both rails of the whole loop isolated from the rest of the railway. The loop rails are then fed by the Auto Reverse Modules output and nothing else! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhilipB Posted January 28, 2012 Author Share Posted January 28, 2012 Copied my plan into free version of anyrail - upper level and lower level. the reverse loop is the upper level and you should be able to see where the 2 sets of track join.The main power input is in the lower level on the outer loop just after the the double points. Got run now so will respond to any further questions on Sunday . http://s1168.photobucket.com/albums/r500/Philipb2011/?action=view¤t=lowerlevel.jpghttp://s1168.photobucket.com/albums/r500/Philipb2011/?action=view¤t=upperlevel002.jpg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flashbang Posted January 28, 2012 Share Posted January 28, 2012 Hi]As I said above, remove the two link wires - Shown here.....http://i190.photobucket.com/albums/z311/Flash_bang/Layout-1.jpg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhilipB Posted January 29, 2012 Author Share Posted January 29, 2012 Thanks Flashbang for the very clear picture - that has help[ed me a great deal. I did what you suggested and I am making progress. I removed the 2 wires and the problem with shorting is solved. However,when the loco moves on to the isolated stretch of track it loses power and stops.Again I have checked all the joints and evertything is fine and the track in this section is new so therefore (hopefully) clean.Have I dione something else wrong?Here's (hopefully) over to you guys.Thanks Philip Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markSandD Posted January 29, 2012 Share Posted January 29, 2012 Have you wired up the reverse loop module correctly, is there a loose connection somewhere?I have a reverse loop on my DCC layout, and it works very well.All you need to do, is make sure that the reverse loop is isolated from the rest of the layout at either end, 4 insulated rail joiners will do this. Then simply connect the side labeled 'track' to your 'DCC main bus', or a section of track that is 'constantly powered'. Then connect the terminals labeled 'isolated track' to your reverse loop. This should work fine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhilipB Posted January 30, 2012 Author Share Posted January 30, 2012 markSandD said:Have you wired up the reverse loop module correctly, is there a loose connection somewhere?I have a reverse loop on my DCC layout, and it works very well.All you need to do, is make sure that the reverse loop is isolated from the rest of the layout at either end, 4 insulated rail joiners will do this. Then simply connect the side labeled 'track' to your 'DCC main bus', or a section of track that is 'constantly powered'. Then connect the terminals labeled 'isolated track' to your reverse loop. This should work fine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhilipB Posted January 30, 2012 Author Share Posted January 30, 2012 Thanks Mark. I have checked all the wiring and I think it is all good and properly connected(A to A , B to B and wired correctly to "Track" or "isolated track") and unfortunately, no matter which way I try to send a loco round the loop, it grinds to a halt as soon as it passes the isolating track.I really am scratching my head. I am not going to have chance to try again until the weekend as I am away this week, but if you have any more suggestions I would be extremely grateful and try again next weekendHave you wired up the reverse loop module correctly, is there a loose connection somewhere?I have a reverse loop on my DCC layout, and it works very well.All you need to do, is make sure that the reverse loop is isolated from the rest of the layout at either end, 4 insulated rail joiners will do this. Then simply connect the side labeled 'track' to your 'DCC main bus', or a section of track that is 'constantly powered'. Then connect the terminals labeled 'isolated track' to your reverse loop. This should work fine.[/reply] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rog RJ Posted January 30, 2012 Share Posted January 30, 2012 You have got a power supply connected to the reverse loop module, haven't you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flashbang Posted January 30, 2012 Share Posted January 30, 2012 Rog (RJ) said:You have got a power supply connected to the reverse loop module, haven't you?Reverse loop modules are self powered from the DCC powered rails. No external power is needed.What you now need to be is 100% sure is that you have all links removed from the two sets of isolating tracks - On each isolating track that both rail sides are free of any connections or links. Next ensure you haven't any other connections anywhere on the reverse loop rails between the two isolating tracks. The only connection should be from the Reverse Loop modules 'Loop rails' or output pair of terminals.That the selection switch is towards the console type you're using - Select or Elite.Are you also sure the Reverse loop modules 'Input' two wires are receiving power from the DCC rails? Or are directly connected to the DCC bus pair, is a bus is used?? Once all is proved, it possible the actual loop module is faulty. But you need to be 100% sure all your connections are correctly placed and are secure before considering that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flashbang Posted January 30, 2012 Share Posted January 30, 2012 Rog (RJ) said:You have got a power supply connected to the reverse loop module, haven't you?Reverse loop modules are self powered from the DCC powered rails. No external power is needed.What you now need to be is 100% sure is that you have all links removed from the two sets of isolating tracks - On each isolating track that both rail sides are free of any connections or links. Next ensure you haven't any other connections anywhere on the reverse loop rails between the two isolating tracks. The only connection should be from the Reverse Loop modules 'Loop rails' or output pair of terminals.That the selection switch is towards the console type you're using - Select or Elite.Are you also sure the Reverse loop modules 'Input' two wires are receiving power from the DCC rails? Or are directly connected to the DCC bus pair, is a bus is used?? Once all is proved, it possible the actual loop module is faulty. But you need to be 100% sure all your connections are correctly placed and are secure before considering that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhilipB Posted January 30, 2012 Author Share Posted January 30, 2012 Rog (RJ) said:There is no independent power supply to the module - I assumed it was powered by the track. The red light is illuminated and I have it switched to "Select" (my controller). If it needs an independent power supply, I am not sure where on the module it would be connected to.Have I missed something blindingly obvious?You have got a power supply connected to the reverse loop module, haven't you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rog RJ Posted January 30, 2012 Share Posted January 30, 2012 Sorry chaps, got things mixed up! I was thinking about the booster module.Just off to the doghouse :-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhilipB Posted January 30, 2012 Author Share Posted January 30, 2012 Something has just crossed my mind. Do I have to programme the Select controller to recognise that the reverse loop module is there. I have checked the Select manual and the very basic Module instructions and neither of them allude to doing anything to the Select controller - but I am fast running out of ideas and thought this may be something so obvious , that nobody would think to mention it and as i am still relatively new to all this, I wouldn't know I had to do this.Just a thought..... otherwise I may have to look in the yellow pages under train doctor and arrange home visit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poliss Posted January 30, 2012 Share Posted January 30, 2012 I suspect that you just have it wired wrong. Would need to see detailed photos of how you are doing it, including connections to the track and Select. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhilipB Posted January 30, 2012 Author Share Posted January 30, 2012 Unfortunately I won't get chance to take any photos until Friday. I will repost with photographs then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flashbang Posted January 30, 2012 Share Posted January 30, 2012 Hi againYou do not programme a Reverse Loop module. Its just takes its feed from the continually powered DCC rails (or a DCC bus pair of wires) and its output is connected to the loops rails which MUST have two insulated gaps at the beginning and two more at the end of the loop. You have this insulating gap via the two Isolating track sections.A simple test to prove you have correctly wired the input side is... Remove the two input wires from the module and power up the Select. Now momentary touch together the two bared wires ends. This should immediately put the Select into Error / Overload trip. If it does then the wiring to the module is correct. If nothing happens then you have a poor or incorrectly made connection somewhere. Check the conenction to the rails (or bus) and where the wires fit onto that connection.No harm will be done by momentarily touching the two wire ends together. The Select is designed to be able to deal with a short circuit occurring.If it does trip then reconnect the two wires back into their terminals, ensure the Select has reset and is now working again and retry a loco around the loop. If it still fails to allow a loco to run around the loop then I suspect the module is faulty Or the wiring from the modules output / Loop terminals to the loops rails or the power conenction on the loop is incorrect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhilipB Posted February 2, 2012 Author Share Posted February 2, 2012 sorry about the time it has taken me to repond - I have been away.Flashbang - I have tried your tests and everthing is sparking as you described but the loco will still not move across either isolating track.Poliss - I have taken a few photos (links below).I have taken: - one photo of one conection from the module to the isolated track and one section of isolating track(photo 1)- one photo of the connection from the module to the powered track (photo 2)- one photo of the second isolating track (photo 3)- one photo of the main power input to the layout (photo 4)- one video clip (hopefully it works) of the train crossing the isolating track and stopping (clip 1).Hopefully someone can spot what I have done wrong.RegardsPhilip Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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