"Other Point/Signal" control

[gilbo2]

I'm looking at pages 81/82 of the manual and trying to set-up my points with Train-Tech colour light signals. Looking at the manual text under the “Other Point/Signal” section...

======================

 “This is a powerful feature, which allows you to switch other points and signals when you switch the current signal. You can specify a point to switch, if desired, for a given signal condition.

The example on the left shows the switching of a point on port 1 to the left (red) only when the signal is set to green (clear). When the signal is set to red (danger) the point will not be switched.”

 =====================

So, under “Other Point/Signal” of a “point”, I can make changing points change the signal, perfect. BUT, reading above I'm taking it that I should be able to switch a point when I switch the current signal also. So under a “signal” Other Point/Signal I've done the same changes as a point but I cannot get this the signal to switch the point, has anyone worked out how to do it?

 

It's really making my head hurt this one!

[Fishmanoz]

I can see why your head might be hurting dg. Have you read p83 and tried the example to see if this helps your understanding?

[gilbo2]

Thanks fishy, the examples on p83 focus on signal control rather than point & signal control which I'm after. They do give good help on setting up the "other point/signal" sections though.

[gilbo2]

I've been continuing with my Train-Tech signals and “other point / signal” control.

 

My Train-Tech signals are not new to me, so I'm familiar with their programming etc. Pre-1.56 I would allocate them the same port number as an associated point and this allows the points and signals to change together, which is just what I wanted. Program control also works well in that you just enter a point change command and then the signal will also change to suit. The pre-1.56 downside for me was;

 

a) if you clicked on a signal, it would also change the point as it should BUT, the graphics for the point (i.e. dots and blue lines) would not update.

 

b) Also, you were limited to only red/green Hornby style 2-aspect signals.

 

1.56 changes all this so I wanted to see how I can improve what I have already, I.e. I also have a 2 aspect distant signal (green/yellow) which I would like to graphically show correctly (green/yellow colours) and to be able to click on a signal to also update the point & its graphics.

 

So on my journey into this I believe I may have uncovered issues with Railmaster and no doubt limitations with my own understanding of how it all works too. This does initially seem a very power facility but is also quite complex, even after studying the manual and the “train-tech” example.

 

So first what I believe are issues with Railmaster?;

 

1) Adding a Train-Tech signal to the track plan is straight forward to get working and at this stage I had not done anything clever with it. I noticed though that if my zoom was set to 75% when Railmaster closed, when re-starting, the track plan becomes graphically corrupt with little “butterflies” and gaps on the screen. (It seems to quickly go to zoom 75% but then go to 100% and become corrupt). Luckily this is only a graphic issue and the plan itself is still OK. By removing the Train-Tech signal from the track plan and then restarting Railmaster everything is OK again (or by only ever closing RailMaster at 100% zoom).

 

2) When adding a 2 aspect distant signal (green/yellow), clicking on it correctly changes the graphics from green to yellow etc., BUT when changing the point (which has the same address as the signal) the signal graphics do not update. If selecting a 2 aspect home (red/green) though it works fine. Seems to be a problem with the 2 aspect distant signal graphics?

 

Getting advanced

 

I decided to give my signals unique numbers and thought I would start them all at 100. This led me to the third Railmaster issue;

 

3) When re-opening the editors “point settings” window, it shows these 100+ points as 10, missing off the last digit. So I've renumbered them all again starting at 50 instead.

 

4) Returning to my original post, I can use entries in the “other point/signal” fields of the “point settings” window to correctly control both my point and signal together. BUT, using the relevant entries in the “signal settings” window it does not not allow me to control the point. I'm obviously missing something here but I've tried to use the train-tech examples given, but they don't help point control, unless you can only control other signals and not points with signals.

 

5) Having got my point to change the signal too (but not visa-versa) I tried a program. It seems that when running a program changing a point will not change the signal, this only occurs when manually controlling the point. Feature or issue?

 

Once up and running I'm sure this produces amazing control of points and settings, but it does seem complicated at first especially with the issues above contributing to my learning.

 

No wonder I retired with a headache last night :-)

[HornbyRailMasterSupport]

Fundamentally, you must not give a signal the same port address as a point.  They must be unique.

[gilbo2]

Thanks HRMS for the reply. When trying unique numbers for issues 1 & 2 above, the problems still exist. Issues 3 onwards are all around unique addresses for my signals required for 1.56 which I'm struggling with.

[St1ngr4y]

Hi DG,

I have a mixture of TrainTech 2-aspect home and 4-aspect signals. Unlke you I'm not interested in linking signals to points. However, on installing 1.56 + ProPack, I decided to change the settings in the layout for these signals. They had been configured as if they were R8247 decoders. The 4-aspects actually consisted of 2 signal icons close to each other to look like a 4-aspect on the diagram. Each of these was programmed with a separate port number but consecutive.

Conversion to the correct TrainTech 4-aspect involved re-configuring the icon with the lower address, and deleting the now redundant second icon. This means of course that all of the programs I have created which reference these signals have had to be changed, a task which is still ongoing...

However, the 2-aspect signals, now configured as TrainTech 2-aspect Home signals, although they operate ok from the layout diagram, will NOT operate at all in a program. After reporting this via the system, HRMS advised me to re-configure them back to R8247 for the time being.

Ray

[gilbo2]

I took a download of the latest rm-setup tonight (after 19:00) and looks like progress has been made on some of these issues (thank you!)

1) Fixed

2) Fixed

3) No change

4) No change for 2 aspect home signals but 2 aspect distant signals now pulse the point in the same direction.

5) No change

Really good to see progress being made.

[gilbo2]

I took a download of the latest rm-setup (V9) and looks like progress has continued on these issues (thank you!)

 

1) Fixed

 

2) Fixed

 

3) Fixed

 

4) Fixed

 

5) No change. However, from another thread I see that this is as designed. Personally it would be good to have an option somewhere when changing a point in a program that it would also change the signal as set-up in the design layout. I understand though you may have a situation where you want FULL control in programs as well!

 

I'm now having three other problems;

 

6) With the 2 aspect Distant signals, they are still not allowing point control and when in the “other point/signal” fields of the “point settings” window you cannot select "Amber", only red and green?

 

7) Now that point control from signals has otherwise been fixed, I now notice that when clicking on point red/green dot that instead of the usual double firing of the point, it now fires 4 times?

 

8) Finally, when clicking on the blue line to change points instead of the coloured dots, signals do not change.

[St1ngr4y]

Hi,

With item (6), is not the only physical difference between a home and distant signal, the colour of one led. So can you not just use red in place of amber in the configuration parameters?

Ray

[gilbo2]

Thanks for the suggestion Ray, but even by assuming red means amber, I still cannot get it to work points. As a work around I use the 2 aspect home signal which does work, but the graphics are then the wrong colour on the schematic.