Which way to face electric pont switches

[Castle-Man]

Used the turn turnout to avoid point point switches.

 

There are so many knowledgeable people on this board who know not just about model railways but also about real signal boxes that this seemed to be a good place to ask.

 

Just about to install myoint motors and switches.  That is all sorted and clear how to do.  What I would like to know is if there is an accepted way to face the switch.

 

 

 

 

[Chrissaf]

I had to read CM's question several times before the meaning made any sense to me. If I am correct, CM isn't talking about switch motors and they way that they are fitted / wired to the point (turnout).

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He is referring to the "levers" found in a signal box that I assume he has replicated with 'lever' type electrical switches to operate his points. I believe IIRC that CM is using PECO PL-26 electrical lever switches in PL-50 housings.

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Thus the question is:

When the PL-26 lever is facing away from the operator, should the point (turnout) being controlled by it be in the 'straight through' position or the 'divert' position or visa versa. Or is it more basic than that i.e lever away from operator for point left and towards operator for point right or visa versa. Or are there no particular rules that apply.

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I don't know the answer myself, but hopefully my question interpretation will make it easier for somebody to answer who does.

[96RAF]

I was not sure apart from knowing that a lever is pulled ON and set back to OFF, so I went to this web site...

https://www.signalbox.org/index.php

...where on the Block section pages it explains that the levers control signals and the signal determines the point position.

 

When a signal is set to danger or caution it is termed as ON and when the way is cleared it is OFF.

In the signal box when the lever is pulled it is termed reversed and when back in the frame it is termed normal.

 

I would presume without reading the whole website that a point could be set by a pulled lever to be either straight or diverge according to the line configuration and the way the signals control the junction.

 

I also await our resident signal expert to put me straight or is that ON or Reversed.

Rob

[LCDR]

 In a real railway track layout points are designated a 'normal' and a 'reverse' position. When set 'normal' it is usual for this to be set for the main through route (where possible), and divergence is 'reverse' . In a lever frame 'normal' is pushed away to the back and 'reverse' is pulled towards the operator. The same with signals where 'danger' or 'caution' are levers back in the frame, and 'clear' is pulled towards the signalman.

Some locks for gates etc are worked the other way round.

 

A frame with all the levers pushed back will therefore have points set for through running in the main route but with all signals at danger or caution.

 

Where possible levers are grouped logically so up line signals are at one end and down line signals at the other end of the frame and arranged in the sequence they are positioned outside, usually the distant signal lever is outermost.  Shunting signal levers are usually positioned alongside the point levers to which they apply. One important consideration is that a reversed lever may partially  obstruct another lever that has to be pulled later in the sequence so as far as possible this has to be considered during the design of the lever frame.

 

Points lock signals, and signals lock points .A set of points cannot be moved if a signal is 'off' for a route through them. A signal cannot be cleared unless the points are set for the route it applies to.

 

The distant signal is always the last signal to be cleared for an approaching train and is usually locked at caution until all signals ahead are cleared.  The driver seeing a distant signal at caution MUST expect one or more stop signals ahead are at 'danger' and bring his train under control to stop before he gets to it.

 

Levers are distinguised by colour. examples -

 

Red are stop signals and shunting signals

 

Yellow are distant signals

 

Black are points

 

Blue are facing point locks

 

Brown are level crossing controls (brown in combination with other colours indicates various releases such as ground frames [blue/brown])

 

White are spare (not in use)

 

 

Where rotary switches are used instead of levers horizontal or vertical is often 'normal' and rotated from horizontal or vertical  'cleared' or 'changed' . With buttons pulled out is  'normal'  pushed in operated or  'reversed'. (N.B. these are broad generalisations and may not apply everwhere)  A common panel design is the 'entrance - exit' panel. The route is set up on a geographic diagram by pressing a button (or turning a switch)  at one end of the proposed route where the train will enter the route and then the corresponding button at the end where it leaves.

 

[Castle-Man]

Thanks all and thanks Chrissaf for your interpretation.  I am aware that I was struggling to explain what I was after but thought I had suceeded.  Oh well.

Yes I am talking about the levers that control the points.  It seemed logical to me that that any easy way to identify which way a point was set just by looking at the switch/lever in front of me was needed (I am using Peco PL-26 switches housed in a Peco PL-50 housing.)

 

To me the most intuative thing would probably be to have them set so that when pointing  away from you the point is set to straight through.  Then when I want to set a point to divert I just move that switch towards me and it will easily stand out.  This also seems to be what people are saying happens in a signal box.  With this method the diverted point would easily stand out reminding you to cancel it if necessary when the train had passed to the new line.

 

To me any other system depending upon e.g. left and right depends upon knowing which points are left and which right where as the other is immediately noticable.  Just needing a diagram to identify clearly which switch/lever operates which point.  If however you are setting up a shunting yard then I can see that a setup based on left or right could work.

 

I am surprised that modellers have not adapted some sort of standard arrangement.   Hopefully that was clearer.

[81F]

 I was certainly wsiring up my lever frame (also PECO) to work in the same way until I decided to go full DCC.

[Castle-Man]

Thanks 81F