Points not setting at start up

[mikejj101]

Hi Mike,

Do you have the Propack version of RM?

Ray

Hi Ray,

Yes, Propack version installed. I don't know if you can help with this problem or not.

If I describe exactly what happens.

The power is on to the eLink unit and the USB cable connected. No errors reported with drivers or connections etc.. 

System is Windows 7 Pro.

When I start the Railmaster software I get the usual sound file that runs and then the software reports checking for updates.

The message initialising DCC controller appears and then the eLink fires all the points at once which then starts some of the points chattering. The software then reports setting points/signals and then appears to be stuck with some points chattering away. There is no control over the points at all but I can run trains. Occasionally if I pull the power plug out of the eLink and then push it back in, I can get control of the points. Most of the time it produces an error with the connection or pops a message up that there is a short circuit.

A better description of the points chattering would actually be that it's a constant pulse.

I will add that this problem has always been there since I installed the R8247 controllers and points.

Could there be a fault with the elink unit ?

I will add that I got my Railmaster .ini file back by copying it from my laptop.

Any ideas ?

Cheers

Mike

[Chrissaf]

With ProPack, for the points to fire at start up you must set an order for the points as well as having the 'fire points at start up' check box ticked.

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In the track design window. Right click each of the points in turn to open the configuration dialogue box. Look for the box where you put in the firing order number. This is probably currently blank. Give each of your points a number going sequentially from 1 to n (putting in a zero prevents the point from firing).

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Save your track plan, and close and restart RM making sure that the points firing at start up check box in the system settings window is ticked.

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This issue has been covered on the forum more than once in the past. But the forum 'search' function is not very intelligent.

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PS - This is not an RM.ini file issue.

[96RAF]

Check that you haven't got your acc decoder ports set for on rather than pulse. Constant current to a solenoid will make it act like a crude buzzer until it burns out.

 

You can reset an acc decoder same as a loco decoder by writing value 8 to CV8 but this probably can only be done with an Elite direct and not through RM.

 

Rob

[Chrissaf]

Just to confirm that you can reset a R8247 Accessory Decoder using just RailMaster standard edition. This is something I have done more than once in the past. Ignore the fact that the R8247 is NOT a loco and just use the loco CV writing screen as if the R8247 was a loco. Then just write 8 to CV8......don't bother with a 'read CV' activity first......oh and don't even bother to call up a loco, not even a dummy one, just go straight to the CV reading / writing screen using the ( i ) icon.

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I don't have ProPack, but I believe ProPack includes a reset R8247 accessory decoder button on the Accessory Decoder configuration screen.

[mikejj101]

Thanks for the replies regarding this issue.

First off - all the points firing order boxes contain a '0' so the points should not fire - am I correct in assuming this? Trouble is when I power on the RM software - all the points fire and then just pulse - not buzz - pulse. Difficult to describe really. There is not enough power in the pulses to actually move the points just that you can hear them clicking away.

The points decoders are set to pulse not 'on'. 

I'm beginning to think there is something wrong with the eLink unit as it doesn't behave as it should. I've just been up to Kidderminster and bought another eLink (quite reasonable as it's been split from a trainset.) I'll give it a try later and let you know of any progress.

Once again thanks for all the advice.

Cheers Mike

[96RAF]

Just re-reading your further details from earlier and you say the elink fires all the points at once and then the pulsing starts. When there is a firing order set the elink should fire them sequentialy so I wonder if you go into each point setting and give it a firing order rather than zero then enable startup firing and see what happens then. It may be a bug in RM.

 

With two elinks you can separate your loco running and points control onto their own bus and make best use of the available power. Speaking of which are you using the 1-amp or 4-amp power supply for your elink.

 

If it's the 1-amp PSU and all those points were firing at once then maybe the overload protection is kicking in.

Rob

[mikejj101]

OK - I'm back to report the new eLink still results in the same problem.

My next plan is to create a new basic track in the planner and only have one point in there. 

Following the settings as described by several advisors - 1 point with a single firing order of 1 point and a setting in the planner of setting points on start up. 

I'm using a 4 AMP PSU.

[Chrissaf]

Post the contents of your "railmaster.ini" file. This will assist immensely in helping to diagnose some of the possible controller configuration issues that are known about. Particularly, as in another of your posts you mention eLink controller error messages.

[mikejj101]

Well that didn't work either so now to on the next plan of action as there is obviously something amiss with the installation of Railmaster.

I have a Windows 10 laptop that I installed Railmaster on originally when it was running Windows 7. The evaluation version has now expired so my plan is to re-install a fresh copy of Windows 10 as the free upgrade versions of Win10 do have issues with admin rights and permissions. I discovered this issue when trying to create a new user within Win10 free upgrade. You cannot do it.

My intention is to de-register the Railmaster off the desktop PC and then re-register on laptop.

I'll be back with an update on progress.

[Fishmanoz]

Can you please clarify that you have set the points firing order as suggested and that they still all fire at once etc?  Or only done on the test layout with 1 point set to 1 and still not working. 

 

Can you also also confirm that all other aspects of RM work correctly and that you are running the latest version by downloading and installing from the link at the top of this forum. In fact, even if you have done it previously, i suggest doing it again now. Then I'd also suggest you check your ini file as per the last post in the Setting Up and Getting Started sticky post second from the top of the forum.  And if those extra lines aren't at the end of the file, delete them and re-write them there with the correct 0/1 values for your setup.

 

If RM is running correctly, then unlikely to be an admin rights issue with your W10, although if you are lucky, AC our resident Windows expert may see this and comment.

[mikejj101]

Can you please clarify that you have set the points firing order as suggested and that they still all fire at once etc?  Or only done on the test layout with 1 point set to 1 and still not working. 

 To Answer this - After that test still not work right - point fires and then pulses.

Can you also also confirm that all other aspects of RM work correctly and that you are running the latest version by downloading and installing from the link at the top of this forum. In fact, even if you have done it previously, i suggest doing it again now. Then I'd also suggest you check your ini file as per the last post in the Setting Up and Getting Started sticky post second from the top of the forum.  And if those extra lines aren't at the end of the file, delete them and re-write them there with the correct 0/1 values for your setup.

 I did re-install RM and all the loco control etc... works fine. The RM.ini file is as standard install with no mods. Points still not playing ball.

If RM is running correctly, then unlikely to be an admin rights issue with your W10, although if you are lucky, AC our resident Windows expert may see this and comment.

There is light at the end of the tunnel now.

I've installed RM including the Pro Pack on my fresh install of W10 on laptop. Connected up to eLink box and it's all now running fine. Obviously there was a fault in the communication between the Win7 PC and the eLink box. I'm going to try and find the actual cause of the problem but suspect it may be USB port related. I say that because after I removed the connection to the eLink box and plugged in a camera on that USB port - the PC would not recognise the camera.

I can't thank you enough for all the help and advice you have given. 

[mikejj101]

Another issue has just arisen - bought some new Peco points and find that the surface mounted point motors I have do not have enough grunt to change them !

Apart from removing the spring - does anyone know of a fix for this?

Cheers

Mike 

[Chrissaf]

Are they Peco PL11 point motors?

What Accessory Decoder are you using.....R8247 perhaps?

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Removing the point spring is unlikely to offer a robust solution as the point motors do not (I believe) provide a locking action to replicate the point spring function. Therefore they are likely to experience an amount of bounce back.

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The R8247 is notorious for having a weak internal CDU. My own R8247s couldn't pull the skin off a rice pudding. They were absolutely hopeless at operating my Peco PL10WE under-board point motors. In the end my only solution, other than binning the R8247s and using a non Hornby Accessory Decoder with auxiliary power supply input, was to use the R8247 ports to operate an external relay that in turn operated my Peco point motors with a separate external CDU.

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Note the PL-10WE have higher resistance solenoid coils compared to the standard Peco PL-10E motor. I found out to my cost that the "W" motor version seems to need a higher firing voltage to operate robustly. The coil resistance of the PL-11 may be similarly high and the reason (if you are using them) for your issue.

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PS - All my point and decoder testing was done on the workbench BEFORE the points were laid (with the point motor mounted directly to the point using the factory mounting lugs). Thus there were no alignment issues and the point movement resistance was minimal.

[mikejj101]

Hi Chrissaf,

Yes, PL11 motors and the R8247 decoder box. It's quite strange really as I already have some Peco points and they change with no problems - it's just the 4 new ones I bought whilst at the Footplate in Kidderminster. They have so much resistance that it is difficult to change them by hand !

Something I have noticed is that different PL11 motors have different amounts of kick. I'm on a mission now to sort through and find the ones with the most punch.

Most of the Hornby points are OK - I do have a couple that are tight but I've not used them so far.

Your idea of firing a relay to then fire a CDU is a definite possibility.

Thanks for the info.

[Fishmanoz]

You say the points are very tight, possibly a warranty issue?

 

PS.  This is not a point setting on startup issue and would have been better as a separate topic in DCC forum.

[96RAF]

Have you got the tight ones pinned down too firmly or are the twisted slightly. Are they tight to move by hand if you lift them off the layout.

 

Rob

[mikejj101]

I'll move this tight point issue over to a new topic.

Mike Jones

[Fishmanoz]

Needs to be done by a mod to take all the discussion to date with it.

[mikejj101]

Needs to be done by a mod to take all the discussion to date with it.

OK - I didn't mean I would move it - What I meant to say was I'll start a new topic.

I'm a little miffed by the new RM 1.66 ! That will be another new topic.

Cheers.