Foxee1980 Posted January 21, 2018 Share Posted January 21, 2018 Ok.. So I've purchased an Elite controller from ebay, tts decoder for my A1 Tornado, bought a Railroad mallard with TTS, bought a standard decoder for my Class 06 which hasn't yet arrived. This is what I have done so far:1. Taken the capacitors out of the power track2. Fitted the TTS decoder to the A1, discovered that the speaker doesn't fit so changed this for a sugarcube type speaker.3. Reset the Elite to factory settings as it was used from eBay. 4. Added the DCC clips to the point to make the whole track live. These are the issues that I have had:1. There seems to be dead points on the track where the locos won't pick up a signal... I have checked and rechecked the integrity of the connections and can't find anything. There is one point in particular where the train just stops dead unless going at considerable speed. 2. The qualify of the speaker in the Tornado is appalling... Can anyone suggest any better ones? 3. The Tornado seems to have a huge problem reversing... Stops every second and requires a wriggle on the track for it to go again but then stops again almost immediately. I am at a loss as to what the issue is here.... 4. After 10 minutes of running, the mallard stopped on the track and I heard a loud clicking sound. I pressed emergency stop... Removed it from the track, could see anything so restarted it, after another few minutes it happened again. I think the coupling rods had seized. Now the pins and the rods are loose. This is going back to he shop. Just bad luck?I'm feeling a little bit stressed out by it all... I've gone from a working DC setup with 3 locos working well to a DC setup with 1 working loco that can't reverse!Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chrissaf Posted January 21, 2018 Share Posted January 21, 2018 It sounds like your track needs a thoroughly good and extensive clean (this includes the loco wheels). DCC control is less forgiving than DC. For DCC to operate robustly, every part in the DCC signal circuit needs to be spotlessly clean and bright. Whereas DC power will work its way through dirt and grime, DCC does not do this so well. The motor 'Back EMFs' in DC can generate some sparking between the wheels and track, the sparks punch their way through the muck. In DCC, the decoder block these motor Back EMF's. This is a very simplistic description comment..Coupling rod screws coming loose, seems to happen a lot and there are many posts reporting this issue. If the heads of the pins are hexagonal, then they are threaded screws. Invest in a 12BA (2.5mm) nut spinner to keep them tight..The point that always stops the loco dead probably needs to be looked at carefully. Many report on the forum that putting an additional track pin in the centre of the point can effect a cure..Sounds like the Tornado has poor contact pickup problems on the back of the wheels. Again dirt / oil / grime (including pitting from sparks when operated under DC) can be an issue when operated under DCC. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
96RAF Posted January 21, 2018 Share Posted January 21, 2018 In the first 2 you said you changed the speaker, then in the second 2 you said it was rubbish. As we don't know what was fitted apart from it was a sugar-cube (generic cube speaker or specific sugarcube brand) I’m not sure how we can help you.Loco problems invariably turn out to be lack of essential routine maintenance.Rob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Foxee1980 Posted January 21, 2018 Author Share Posted January 21, 2018 It was just a generic sugarcube speaker from ebay. The track and converted loco are less than a month old... Is it really possible that dirt could be causing it? Many thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Foxee1980 Posted January 21, 2018 Author Share Posted January 21, 2018 I'm going to update the Elite shortly as I've noticed that the firmware version is 1.0 on startup - perhaps this will help as well? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chrissaf Posted January 21, 2018 Share Posted January 21, 2018 The track............... less than a month old...Is it really possible that dirt could be causing it?.Yes, if it has never been cleaned at all in the month since you bought and installed it. Even a layer of dust settling on unused track can affect DCC. Some people clean their DCC track before and after each running session..If firmware is version 1.0 then that definitely needs updating before trying other things first.https://www.hornby.com/uk-en/forum/updating-firmware-on-the-elite .Better quality SugarCubes.http://www.youchoos.co.uk/Index-Shop.php?L1=Speakers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2e0dtoeric Posted January 21, 2018 Share Posted January 21, 2018 Nit-pick - Chrissaf put - that definitely needs updating before trying other things first.I'd rephrase that slightly, to needs updating FIRST before trying - - - :-)-Reminds me of the instructions for a petrol generator - do this, do that, do the other, but before you start the engine, put some oil in first! :-P Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Foxee1980 Posted January 21, 2018 Author Share Posted January 21, 2018 Ok - So I've updated the firmware on the Elite... Thanks for the instructions Chrissaf.Sadly, the Tornado is still having issues, I've posted a video here: I definitely think this is an issue with the loco because the the Mallard didn't have any issues (before it seized up!) Maybe I messed up putting the decoder in somehow?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WilliamDavid Posted January 21, 2018 Share Posted January 21, 2018 I have four Tornados, and I found the two green ones BR Late and BR Early, were having trouble on the points and reversing. I fitted pickups to their tenders, and now have no issues.A bad decision of Hornby to not fit them. My Bachmann Tornado, however, has no tender pickups, and runs fine.Not Hornby's finest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Foxee1980 Posted January 21, 2018 Author Share Posted January 21, 2018 OK - so you think it is a design issue with the Tornado. If this is case then surely the product is not fit for purpose?I wouldn't know where to start if I were to try and install pickups to the tender! How do you think I would get on if I complained to Hornby about it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
St1ngr4y Posted January 21, 2018 Share Posted January 21, 2018 Before abandoning the Tornado completely, one more thing to check - that the point where it sticks is absolutely flat. Does it stick on any of the other points on the layout?Ray Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chrissaf Posted January 21, 2018 Share Posted January 21, 2018 Just purely based upon watching the video I would still be looking at the track, just because the Tornado is the only loco affected is in my view not conclusive proof that the loco is faulty. Granted, it might have a pickup design issue compared to your other locos that traverse the point OK, but the Tornado always stutters in exactly the same position on the track. To me, that points to the track not being 100% in that location for some reason. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Foxee1980 Posted January 22, 2018 Author Share Posted January 22, 2018 Ok thanks guys - back to work today so I've got limited time to do anything as its in my sons room. I'll post an update as soon as I've had the chance to looks again! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WilliamDavid Posted January 22, 2018 Share Posted January 22, 2018 I think the Tornado, without tender pickups, is rather susceptible to any imperfections in the levelness of the track.Mine were mainly troubled by the points, such that I replaced them all.I still had problems, yet no problems with the Bachmann.I tried loosening the bottom plate holding the main wheels to give more play, and I'm sure this improved things. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Foxee1980 Posted January 23, 2018 Author Share Posted January 23, 2018 Ok so good news... I added an extra nail to the centre of the point as per one of the suggestions above and hey presto, over it went without any hesitation! What a diva of a loco! However, it still won't reverse without stalling every half a second... Any suggestions for this or would I be looking at adding pickups to the tender, an if so, how the hell do I do that? :) Thanks again for all the help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2e0dtoeric Posted January 23, 2018 Share Posted January 23, 2018 Start by ensuring that the existing pick-ups are in contact with the wheels, even when you gently slide them sideways by the amount allowed by the chassis. It doesn't take much of a torque twist to break the contact if the contacts are a bit flat - or dirty! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Foxee1980 Posted February 1, 2018 Author Share Posted February 1, 2018 Ok so I have an update of some positive and some negative. The Tornado problems are all resolved, it will even reverse now without any issues. I loosened the plate underneath as per a suggestion on here and it seems to have done the trick. I sent the Mallard back to Rails at Sheffield and the replacement arrived yesterday. I ran it in... 15 mins at a moderate speed in both directions and it has been working fine. However I am today having the same 'clicking' problem that I had previously when trying to reverse. Something seems to be jamming somewhere and it is causing the gear from the motor to slip. I have removed the shell and you can visibly see the motor moving as the gears slip. I'm wondering whether the shop attempted a repair and sent me the original train back rather than a replacement? Surely I can't be that unlucky unless this is a regular fault? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Foxee1980 Posted February 1, 2018 Author Share Posted February 1, 2018 Also... Just to say. I'm really happy that I converted to DCC. The Elite Controller is brilliant.I even managed to chip a Class 06 in pullman livery which I'm happy about 😎I have an accessory decoder and point motors on order as well! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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