loksound 5 compatibility

[martin_scott]

Hello learned forum members

I have Railmaster 1.72 on windows 7 operating an elink with firmware 1.07. I just bought a loksound 5 but i’m struggling to increase the volume of the chip.

The guide (https://locomansounds.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/02/Quick-start-guide-Class-A4-V5-2002-2901.pdf) says I have to double-click the function key F1 to increase the volume but I can’t get it to work. I’ve tried both with and without the on/off suffix.

I’ve tried modifying CV63 as per the loksound guide but the software says enter a value between 1-64 – not 128 the supposed max volume.

Any thoughts or advice would be welcome.

Stay safe,

Martin

[Chrissaf]

Read Page 41 of the current RailMaster manual about sound Macros. See extract below:

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By default the Function keys in RailMaster are in the main set up with a default Macro that repeats the Function command after a pause.

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In the example above (as shown on Page 41) the Macro for F2, is to Pause for 1 second then send F2 again.

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I suggest you look at the Macro that is assigned to your F1 key (click on the Function button label to open the Macro dialogue box). The Macro that is assigned may be corrupting your ability to double click F1 in such a way that the decoder recognises it as a double click.

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Let's say for arguments sake that your F1 has the Macro P1~F1 but your Loksound V5 decoder needs to see a double F1 command at significantly less than a 1 second interval to see it as a valid double click. Because of the Macro, your sub 1 second second press is then probably being ignored.

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I would try deleting the Macro found (assuming one is present - make a note of it in case it needs reinstating), such that the Macro dialogue box is blank and then save the settings to your loco. Note: that the Macro configuration is saved in RailMaster to be used by your RailMaster throttle 'Function Button' for this loco and not saved in the decoder.

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This however may then upset your ability to turn the sound on using the single F1 press. Some experimentation will be required. In theory (to be confirmed through experimentation) deleting the Macro should turn the F1 button into a 'latching' function the same as it would be if it had the 'on/off' text on the button. Thus turning on the sound when no 'on/off' suffix text on the Function button label is present.

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Let us know if this clue leads to a solution.

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Just for your information, the Function button Macro feature can be a very powerful tool when understood how to use it.

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[Chrissaf]

Martin,

Your 'Blue Button' reply was held back for image approval and duplicated my very long reply uneccessarily [now removed]. The Blue Button is best avoided. Please note the TIP below:

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TIP: As a relatively newbie poster on the forum, just be aware that the 'Blue Button with the White Arrow' is not a 'Reply to this post' button. If you want to reply to any of the posts, scroll down and write your reply in the reply text box at the bottom of the page and click the Green 'Reply' button.

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Particularly as my reply includes an image, using the 'Blue Button' may result in your reply being held back for image approval, even though it is an existing image.

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See also – further TIPs on how to get the best user experience from this forum.

https://www.hornby.com/uk-en/forum/tips-on-using-the-forum/

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[Exetersteam]

I am very interested in this thread because I am spending part of lockdown exploring what I can do with Railmaster.

I have a Class 22 with and ESU Loksound 4 decoder and the high and low sounds are on seperate buttons (also sound too long)  I want to make them sound consecutively with one button. The high horn is F2 and the low F3. I entered the macro P1~F2~F3~P1~F3 but all that happens is the high horn sounds twice, albeit for a reduced 1 second. I did try messing about with combinations of macros but ended up with the high horn stuck on permanently and had to reset everything. Any ideas welcome.

Sorry if this is seen as a thread hi-jack and if so I will start a new one.

Thanks

John

[Chrissaf]

Decoders can be slow to respond and can miss out commands that are too close together. Particularly function commands specific to sounds. I suggest adding another P1 command between the F2 and the F3 so that it goes:

P1~F2~P1~F3~P1~F3

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I assume (you didn't say) that this Macro is on the F2 button.

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What I don't know is what is the minimum value of P that can be assigned i.e Is a value less than 1 valid, such as 0.5 for example. So that you get P1~F2~P0.5~F3~P1~F3

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I should try P1 to start with just to see if you can get the sequence you want correct first, then play about with the P values to see if the timing is indeed alterable. You might even need to make the new P1 longer than 1 second to get the sequence to work, albeit without the correct timing. As you say, some experimentation is needed.

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EDIT:

I note that HRMS have used the combined 'High & Low' Horn as a documented example Macro on page 42 (bottom of the page). But I also note that they have not put a P pause between the two Functions. So at least as far as the manual is concerned, your Macro is correct with the exception that you have reduced the default P2 pause to P1.

[Exetersteam]

Thanks Chris, I will give it a try.

 

John

[St1ngr4y]

Thanks Chris, I will give it a try.

 

John

 

John,

 

You do not mention whether your F2 and F3 descriptions include the words on/off.

 

Ray

[Exetersteam]

Hi Ray

No they do not include "on/off". Should they?

John

[Chrissaf]

F0 for lights on - yes

F1 for sound on  ...yes

But Not for 'Horns'.

[St1ngr4y]

For the last hour or so I have been doing some experimentation with loco function macros, and in particular, the example being quoted by John. I used some USB monitoring software to see what information is being sent from Railmaster to the DCC Controller. As a result of this monitoring, I would suggest that function macros are not working at all. The commands being sent for F2 (containing a macro referencing F3) are the same  in total as those sent for F3 (containing no macro). For interest, RM sends a Function ON command, followed 1 or 2 seconds later by 2 consecutive Function OFF commands for a non-latching function.

During this experimentation, I found out something that I didn't know, which is that RM won't let you employ a macro for a latching (on/off) function. But this raises a question for me about the macro quoted by John and revised slightly by Chris:  P1~F2~P1~F3~P1~F3. Let us just have a think about latching and non-latching functions for a second. At the lowest level, every loco decoder can be sent 2 commands for each function - an ON command or an OFF command. If you define a function in RM as non-latching (no on/off), when you press that function on the throttle (or execute an equivalent command in a RM program), RM will send an ON command, wait a second or so, then send an OFF command. If, however, you include on/off in the description to make it into a latching command, RM will only send one command for each press of the button on the throttle. RM will keep track of the status of each function for each loco, so if the status for the function is currently OFF, the RM will send an ON command, then if the status is currently ON, then RM will send an OFF. The background colours on the function button will change between grey (off) and green (on) when latching functions are used. For non-latching functions, the button remains grey when pressed. So, getting back to the macro, my first question is, has RM sent any command before the execution of the macro. If so, being a non-latching function, has it sent an ON and an OFF, or has it only sent an ON? The implication is that something should have been sent, otherwise why would the macro start with a P1? Then we get to the next item in the macro - another F2. The implication here is that an ON had been sent before the macro started, and this command is an OFF. So what should it send at this point? - an ON, an OFF, or both? The fact that the second half of the macro has two commands for F3 implies that these commands within the macro are acting as if they are latching i.e. each Fx command toggles it on/off. 

 

Anyway, as I said earlier, any macro doesn't seem to be being obeyed. If anyone can quote their system as having working function macros, then please let us know. Otherwise, I would suggest, John, that you report this as a fault through the RM Help Request system.

 

Ray

[Exetersteam]

Thanks for this Ray. I have, as you suggested, contacted RM Support.

I will of course let you know what comes back.

John

[Exetersteam]

Had this back freom RM Support:-

 

"Dear JohnTry just F2~F3 or F2~P1~F3 although there may be a pause which is too long.Presumably those two functions are not latching, i.e. they go off on their own?Please reply to this email rather than create a new one so that we can see the thread.  This saves time having to find and collate previous emails to see what has been done.RegardsRailMaster Support Team"

 

Sadly it doesn't work so have gone back to them.

 

John

[St1ngr4y]

Hello John,

 

I tried the two suggestions made by RM Support, and although there are messages being passed when a macro is present, they don't include any reference to F3, only F2. There is a definite fault there which needs to be sorted by HRMS.

 

Ray

[GWRNSW]

Purchase a Lokprogramer and set it up in there. Then just read it on your railmaster software. Programing is made simple on that Lokmaster, (you don't need to mess around with CV's in the early 30s) to free up the higher sound settings CVs :-)  The only drawback with ESU is that they don't want to recognise other makes of decoders!  (Don't mention The War? They still hate the Brits! :-( )

[96RAF]

Lokprogrammer has a drop down list of which decoders it supports but I did hear that they can sort of handle TTS decoders.

 

Back to the plot - TTS decoders have a time to play out, hence any following sound will not play until the preceding one has timed out.

Do thenESU decoder one shot sounds follow this logic or because they are polyphonic they can play sounds as close together as you like.

[St1ngr4y]

I suppose this is what can happen when a thread is "hi-jacked". I remember being involved with the discussion on Function Macros in RM, which was introduced by Exetersteam, but it wasn't until this morning that I read the original question about double-clicking F1 to increase the sound volume on a Loksound 5 decoder.

 

So this mornings post by GWRNSW had me confused until I realised he was referring to the original post, not the "hi-jack" post.

 

Having now read the original post, I have one or two points to make about it. First of all, I would like to ask if the "normal" use of F1 is to switch on and off the sound, as it is with most sound decoders? For a double-click of F1 to mean anything to the decoder, its firmware must be set to react to a "F1 on" followed very quickly be a "F1 off". Bear in mind that the DCC controller is constantly sending packets of information to each locomotive showing the current status of each function (on or off) and the speed/direction. SO, a double-click of F1 can't be sending two ON commands in quick succession, or two OFF commands in quick succession, otherwise the decoder wouldn't be able to tell the difference betrween these and the "normal" constant repetition which occurs anyway.

 

To achieve this double click using a macro, then maybe it is simply a question of putting F1 as the one and only entry in the macro i.e. no Pn command. BUT, RM will only allow the use of function macros on non-latching functions i.e. those which DO NOT have on/off as part of the description. So for this to work, the description of F1 cannot include on/off. This in turn means that F1 cannot be used in the normal way of turning the sound on or off.

 

My conclusion is that a double-click of F1 in RM cannot be used to increase the volume.

 

Ray