Hornby Elite - wireless throttle and app control

[Luminaire]

The Hornby Elite is a nice bit of hardware, but the Hornby system currently lacks the wireless upgrade path and modern mobile apps of some of the competition. But it turns out this can actually be fixed. It's possible to fool wireless controllers and apps made by Roco into talking to an Elite. It's not even that difficult, but for some reason the parts of this puzzle don't seem to be all listed together anywhere - so hopefully this post will help start some people off.

Roco's WLANmultimaus and mobile/tablet apps are pretty decent, but would normally expect to talk only to a Z21 DCC command station (pricey!). So we need something to fool them into thinking they're talking to a Z21. The secret sauce here is a PC, connected to your wifi network and your Elite via the USB port, running the popular and free Rocrail layout control software. Rocrail has a unique talent in that it can control an Elite via the USB port but it can also pretend to be a Z21 - receiving commands in 'Roco', translating them to 'Hornby' and passing them on. Bingo - wireless DCC control with an Hornby Elite at the centre.

The pieces of the puzzle:

Rocrail has a good setup guide including configuring use with a Hornby Elite and the USB configuration.

Link: https://wiki.rocrail.net/doku.php?id=stepbystep-en

Rorcail can be crazy complicated for running a layout, but you just need the bare minimum to get it to talk to the Elite. We'll do all control through the Elite itself or the Roco handheld/apps.

Hidden in the depths is the key page on how to fool the Roco devices into thinking they're talking to a Z21.

Link: https://wiki.rocrail.net/doku.php?id=roco:roco-wmz21-en

Note a key missing piece in that guide - when adding the wmz21 select the 'PADA' addressing mode otherwise you won't be able to contol points

Then setup the roco device/app to point to the IP address of the PC running Rocrail (your fake Z21).

I've not tested this thoroughly, but I have locos moving and functions all working, and points correctly setup in the Roco apps. I'd be very interested to know if anyone else has/does tried this and anything you found.

The Elite if great for its price and this adds something that is missing from the native Hornby ecosystem, which makes it all the more feasible for larger layouts.

[96RAF]

@luminaire

Thanks for highlighting the hack. I have Rocrail loaded and use it with an Elite on occasion.

I wrote that original Wiki for using the Elite with Rocrail - a very long time ago now. The guide has been updated in various details by others since.

I was also involved in getting the points addressing sorted hence the tick box for Standard / Classic modes to correct the +3 addressing offset. MADA/PADA/FADA brings back memories of previous fiddling to get them to work.

I will take a look at the Roco workaround and see what I can make happen.

Some questions first.

1. Is the Rocrail server shown here real or just the software package.
2. Which device are we using the Roco app on - PC or say mobile phone?
3. Elite USB is plugged into PC, so where does it connect to and configure as ‘Any Command Station’ below.

[St1ngr4y]

Should be able to get it to work with a Hornby eLink as well.

Ray

[Luminaire]

@96RAF thanks so much for all your work on the Rocrail/Elite stuff, they have been so very useful in getting my layout setup how I like it, I'm really grateful to you for that.

I'm standing on the shoulders of far smarter people than I in this. When hooking up the Elite I tried the various addressing modes in the Z21 emulator library in Rocrail and found PADA to be the one that let me control points as well as locos, but if you've delved into this before you may know if there's a more correct answer or if maybe the addressing mode could depend on how something else is setup.

Personally I've only tried one hardware setup so far, and only for basic operation (locos, switches - no programming or CV changes yet, which I plan on doing through the Elite still just to minimise 'moving parts').

I've got the Roco Z21 app running on iPhone and iPads (just installed from the App store)

A windows 10 (pro) mini PC running Rocrail server software (and Rocview just for config)

The mini PC has the USB attached to the Elite (the Elite is the 'Any command centre' in the image from the guide) and is attached by Wifi to the same home network that the iPhone/iPads are.

[Luminaire]

@St1ngr4y I wondered that but there seems to be quite a few posts around saying that the eLink isn't always compatible with things like Rocrail where an Elite is.

I imagine Hornby wouldn't be thrilled if it did work though, as somehow having an Elite in there feels like it's the beating heart of the thing whereas a eLink in the same spot just becomes a glorified dongle and booster.

[96RAF]

@Luminaire

Let me check if I have this right so far..

This is my interpretation of your use of the Rocrail diagram.

Is this what you have done so far.

If so I can try to go from there, but without the Z21 device, however I have a plan.

To date Elite works (worked last time I tried) fine with Rocrail for operation of locos and points. I have not tried auto-ops as I have no LD kit, although route analyse and setting also works (worked) fine. Elite uses Xpressnet protocol as its standard setup in Rocrail.

With regard to the operation of points PADA was found to be the simplest way when using Hornby R8247 acc decoders as the port numbering was sequential, whereas some of the other protocols required both module and port sequencing.

I have loaded Rocrail as RocWeb on a USB stick but some of the setup is far removed from what it used to be. It may take me a while to get reorganised with it.

Ray has sussed out the eLink Masons' handshake protocol and could in theory get that box to work with Rocrail also, however when I tried as a straight swap with a working Elite it was sending all commands five times, as noted on their forum.

[Luminaire]

That diagram captures it about right, yep. Only detail different is the PC is also connected to the router by wifi but that should be academic.

I’ve had more of a play with it today using the Z21 iPad app and it’s a really neat setup for operation so far. I have the Elite positioned by my shunting yard for a nice physical experience operating that, but controlling cruising locos and points whilst wandering around the layout benefits from the really nice-to-use roco app.

[96RAF]

@luminaire.

I loaded the DigiPro Z21 app onto my PC but can’t get it to connect to any of my ‘wireless’ kit, using the IP addresses (un-named kit) my router is reporting in use.

I have Rocrail back on its feet, but have not yet set up the Z21 emulator per your suggestion, as I have nothing to use as input.

I would like to skip the router connection and simply have the wireless handset talking to Elite via PC/tablet wireless connection.

More experimenting to do methinks.

Edit:

Until I find an app that will talk to my limited wireless kit there is really nothing more I can do. Rocrail supports multiple controllers but in effect what you have set up is using the Elite as the track device and the Z21 as a walkabout controller to the Elite via the app and WiFi rather than the normal hard-wire link. This is essentially how RM works with wireless hand sets as far as I know.

If your set up works for you then good as it saves you the cost of RM and a hand-held licences.