atom3624 Posted January 12, 2022 Share Posted January 12, 2022 Well if needs be, a blanking plate can surely be fitted, as I have in other 'TTS fitted' locomotives I have - Lord Nelson, C ot N TTS, etc.What does 'can speed up, slow down the chuffs' mean?If there's a power-drain-related chuff rate, then running light will not correspond to running loaded, no matter how torquey the motor is. Wheel proximity sensors are required surely.Al. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ColinB Posted January 12, 2022 Share Posted January 12, 2022 I must admit and I put it on another thread that these locos seem awfully cheap to have a sound decoder in them but 96RAF says SS stands for Steam and Sound so I have no reason to believe differently. If you take for instance a Zimo or LokSound they are about £100, the current TTS RRP is abput £50. If they have improved the TTS I suspect its price will be more that the current TTS decoders. Trouble is these locos will probably be late, nearer the end of the year or possibly next year, so we have a long time to find out. In the case of the Black Five the price quoted is really cheap if you take the RRP of the old Black Five add on £50 for smoke generator and then say at least £50 for the TTS decoder but the whole package retails for £230, so that make the loco less than £130, which doesn't seem right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
96RAF Posted January 12, 2022 Share Posted January 12, 2022 Odd to me also @Colin that the Black 5 is so much cheaper than the other two, as it is not to my mind that much more simple a design to produce, so why the big £-difference, unless the new tooling has seen benefits in cost.@atom - presumably the speed up/speed down of chuffs can only indicate a measure of adjustability for synching purposes, although the on chuff or off chuff is determined by BEMF monitoring. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
37lover Posted January 12, 2022 Share Posted January 12, 2022 @ XJR1300,I for one make several grammatical and spelling mistakes when posting on forums, but then again I don't criticise Hornby's quality very often. You might want to review and edit your 15:49 posting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fazy Posted January 12, 2022 Share Posted January 12, 2022 maybe Hornby as designed the new black 5 to be less labour intensive and as such cheaper to build. Colin B Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ColinB Posted January 12, 2022 Share Posted January 12, 2022 @Fazy I doubt it. If they had they would add that to their profit. I even double checked to make sure it wasn't a Railroad version, they could put a three pole motor in that would lower the price. They did that on the Mallard with a flywheel. I would have thought a big chunk of flywheel was more expensive than the difference between 3 and 5 pole motors cost, but I don't know. The whole entry for Black 5's is very confusing. It could be they know virtually everyone has a Black 5, so they lowered the price to tempt people to buy them. I have no idea, to me it seems a mistake but I will wait to see. In the mean time it appears really great value for money, so if you want one, order from Hornby then the price should be fixed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fazy Posted January 12, 2022 Share Posted January 12, 2022 You could be right well have to wait and see. Mind I’ve had a look at water steam generators and can be picked up as little as £10 so that’s on thing though I’m not saying Hornby are using the same ones but a starting figure. Plus some people have got them not only doing the chimney but the cylinders too. Maybe a sign of things to come if Hornby can deliver these at the price and amount needed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ColinB Posted January 12, 2022 Share Posted January 12, 2022 The one Jenny Kirk was trialling cost a £100 although that involved sending it away to a company that retrofitted it into your loco, so labour would be high. I bought the catalogue today it is easier to read in a catalogue, these steam models aren't due until 4th quarter, so going by recent events that means 2023. So definitely if you want one preorder it on the Hornby website, I dread to think how many price rises could effect it between now and then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
96RAF Posted January 12, 2022 Share Posted January 12, 2022 The cost is not in the ultrasonic disc, it is in miniaturising of the electronics and providing a bespoke water tank and installation module, then lashing it all together with a capable sound decoder.I have yet to fully understand how the chuff synch is done, whether by pulsed (PWM) output from a function wire, or is it on the disco sound to light principle, or is it driven by BEMF which normally associates chuffs on or off according to load. Outwith the thinkability of my tiny brain cells. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fazy Posted January 12, 2022 Share Posted January 12, 2022 Some of the smoke generators seem to have tanks ready built in, and made for O and OO gauge locomotive. There’s a topic on RMweb with some videos links. I have to put my hands up, I could probably fit the thing to a model and maybe wire. but to get it all sink to both wheels rotation and sound I haven’t a clue. Maybe you two can understand it better and Enlighten me. The blue stuff that bites isn’t my strong point.the topic is on the Hornby pages Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
37lover Posted January 12, 2022 Share Posted January 12, 2022 @ColinB, I bought the catalogue today it is easier to read in a catalogue, these steam models aren't due until 4th quarter,Perhaps progress has been better since the catalogue was approved for printing. This website, right now, states the R3983SS is due Summer 2022. Officially in the UK Summer is 21st June to 23rd September - I would call that the 3rd quarter!But, as you suggest, we might be lucky if it turns up as a (belated?) Christmas present. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
atom3624 Posted January 12, 2022 Share Posted January 12, 2022 1 day over, not unusual for Hornby, and it's Q4!I'm certain they're as keen as anybody to get all of their new products onto the market as quickly as they reasonably can, but I suppose we have to be realistic.Perhaps they have taken into account the 'recent happenings' so it will be 100% accurate.Al. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ColinB Posted January 12, 2022 Share Posted January 12, 2022 I have been buying Hornby products for years, I don't think they have ever met a date. I don't think Triang did either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
37lover Posted May 20, 2022 Share Posted May 20, 2022 Apologies for dredging up an old thread but the latest forecast delivery date on this website is now showing Summer 2023! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ColinB Posted May 20, 2022 Share Posted May 20, 2022 Thank you 37lover for the info, I noticed that the HD City of Lichfield has slipped to 2023. There is not much more to say. I suppose the only thing is that I doubt the prices will go up much more, as I think Hornby is probably at the point where another increase could kill their market completely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ColinB Posted May 20, 2022 Share Posted May 20, 2022 Thank you 37lover for the info, I noticed that the HD City of Lichfield has slipped to 2023. There is not much more to say. I suppose the only thing is that I doubt the prices will go up much more, as I think Hornby is probably at the point where another increase could kill their market completely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ColinB Posted May 20, 2022 Share Posted May 20, 2022 Thank you 37lover for the info, I noticed that the HD Princess has slipped to 2023. There is not much more to say. I suppose the only thing is that I doubt the prices will go up much more, as I think Hornby is probably at the point where another increase could kill their market completely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andys steam dayz Posted May 20, 2022 Share Posted May 20, 2022 Looking at the hornby range for 2022 it looks like most of the range has been moved back to 2023.This could be to do with the Covid problem within China at the moment.I think Hornby need to hold the prices as they are at the moment any increases may impact on there future sales. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
96RAF Posted May 20, 2022 Share Posted May 20, 2022 According to a recent blog broadcast with the designer the Black 5 is only just in the detailed design stage, so no chance of that popping over on a boat any time soon.Pity as I had my eye on that one at the launch price. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
96RAF Posted May 20, 2022 Share Posted May 20, 2022 According to a recent blog broadcast with the designer the Black 5 is only just in the detailed design stage, so no chance of that popping over on a boat any time soon.Pity as I had my eye on that one at the launch price. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ColinB Posted May 21, 2022 Share Posted May 21, 2022 So if the Black 5 is only just at the detailed design stage, they don't know yet if they can actually make it, especially as it is a change in technology. There were a very many products where I worked where they got "canned" because the technology did not work in a production environment. So who knows when it may appear. As to the price if Hornby sticks to its original policy, then if you preordered it the price should not change. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
atom3624 Posted May 21, 2022 Share Posted May 21, 2022 I'd be interested to see how easily the body can be removed for 'routine maintenance' without damaging anything - not a strong point of Hornby Super Detailed steam locomotives.The extra detailing is always admirable, but it should be designed in as a model to permit a practical application.Al. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bugler999 Posted January 2, 2023 Share Posted January 2, 2023 I see from the latest update on the website, the black 5 will not be around until winter 24/5 which is another 12 months on from the reply I received from Hornby recently after an enquiry as it was due last Nov/Dec. I struggle to understand why advertise something as available at a particular time and then keep moving it back. Yes I understand delays re covid/chips etc but maybe being a little more upfront with customers would be appreciated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarkRedCape Posted January 2, 2023 Share Posted January 2, 2023 What I don’t understand is why the Black 5 has been pushed back to 24/25 while the FS and the P2 release dates haven’t changed.If it was an issue with any of the internal gizmos, they’d all be 24/25. Bodies for all three trains exist, so I very much doubt it’s an issue there.I’m expecting the dates on the FS and the P2 to move to 24/25 too. And if we see more locos with steam generators come out in the 2023 catalog, who knows what far distant release dates they’ll have. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Going Spare Posted January 2, 2023 Share Posted January 2, 2023 The body of the Black 5 is smaller than the pacifics - it could be proving problematical cramming everything in? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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