Hornby Class A1 R3284TTS service sheet and start delay

[Deem]

I received Hornby R3284TTS today through post, bought from eBay.

I am quite happy with the Loco and just want to add the service sheet to folder, I can't seem to find the service sheet.

Anyone have it or guide me, I would be grateful.

Regards

Moderator note - title amended to reflect ongoing change in topic discussion

[96RAF]

This one for Tornado TTS but is probably close enough.

https://support.hornby.com/hc/en-gb/article_attachments/360016354319/hss_406_tornado_tts_.pdf

[Deem]

Thanks 96RAF, I saw it yesterday on hornby website and thought it looked close enough but wasn't sure, just saved it to service sheets folder on my pc,I just like to have all the service sheets of all the locos I have on hand because you never know when you need it.

Regards

[Deem]

96RAF

below are the internal pictures of the Hornby R3284TTS which is almost the same as for Tornado TTS but couple of things are different.

[96RAF]

No tender weight and the loco forward weight is different. You would have to be careful if ordering spares from that sheet, e.g. wheels would different colour, etc.

It is sort of a mix and match of sheets 380 and 388.

[Deem]

Hello

I have bought another Hornby R3284TTS from eBay, all seem to be working fine, Loco was running wrong direction in DCC mode so I changed the CV29 Value to 7 which have sorted that matter.

My question or advice I need is,

This particular Hornby R3284TTS Loco in DCC mode takes good few second or a while to move in either direction compare to all my other DCC ready or DCC fitted Loco's.

What could be wrong or what CV value do I need to change to improve the response?

[Deem]

I have just tried Hornby Class 08 with Hornby 6 pin decoder, Cock O North P2 with LiasDcc Decoder, Hornby R3086with LiasDcc Decoder also my other Hornby R3284TTS and all seem to response much quicker or takes much less time to move compare to my latest purchase of Hornby R3284TTS.

Any advice will be much appreciated.

Regards

[96RAF]

We seem to have drifted off the original topic, but its your discussion so . . .

TTS - Check the value of CVs 3 and 4 which should be set to value 15 in order to allow time for the cylinder blow down to sound before the loco moves off.

If you change these values significantly up or down on a TTS steam decoder the loco will either move off before the chuffs start or the chuffs will start before the loco moves.

The same applies to TTS diesels, the lag allowing for brake release to play before the motor revs up and the loco moves.

[ColinB]

If your loco is fitted with a Hornby TTS decoder even with the sound off, if will be sluggish moving off because even though the sound is off, the logic in its software waits for the loco to steam up ready to go. I noticed it with my TTS decoder when I switched the sound off.

As to chassis for the A1/A3/A4/Tornado, I have been doing a lot of work on these lately. I had a spare chassis what I thought was a Tornedo one. When I ordered the valve gear I found that the latest chassis for a Railroad A3 and A4 is wider at the front than the one for a Tornado. The motor and the rest is the same, although the A4 has a couple of metal cross members missing (easy to snap them off). My chassis was in fact a Railroad Flying Scotsman one. When I finally acquired the Tornado one I could see the difference. As 96RAF has mentioned the weight is different between the Tornado and A1/A4 chassis. Hornby don't seem to update their Service Sheets very often so often you have to look at 2 or 3 to find the actual fitted parts.

[Deem]

Thanks 96RAF for explanation.

Nice to hear from you ColinB.

It looks like I don't have much choice or much I can do in terms of loco moving any quicker.

I will take out the A4 Mallard with TTS and check that tonight to see how long that take to move?

[morairamike]

TTS decoders need the control to set to 3/128 and above to move the loco. Positions 1, and 2 allow the loco to go through its brake release steam blow etc.

Even with F1 at Off, the loco will still not move till 3/128.

On sound fitted locos, I have three, one Howes Class 20 and two Marks trains. class 121.

If F1 is on there is a delay but if F1 is OFF then they move off at 1 on the dial.

To demonstrate sound to those who come to view my trains, I start them off with sound OFF and then say to the viewers that more realism is added by .... Hit F1 and the sound is instant.

[Deem]

Hello

Further update

Thanks for your reply morairamike

I took out Hornby R3395TTS and tried on my layout, I would say response of this loco seem more slower to me compare to R3284TTS.

R3284TTS takes between 3 to 4 second before loco will move either direction

R3395TTS seem to me takes 1 or half a second longer compare to R3284TTS will move either direction

Both with all sound off - fully serviced

Hornby Class 08 (NON TTS) with Hornby 6 Pin decoder start to move within half a second or maybe 1 second.

I changed the R3395TTS speed to 128 and it seem loco is taking longer to move compare to speed of 28 in decoder.

Regards

[ColinB]

As I implied earlier the delay is a function of the software in the DCC decoder. All decoders seem to be different. The easiest solution to test it out is disconnect the TTS decoder and put a Zimo standard decoder in its place. I say a Zimo because this is the only decoder I use that doesn't have lags in its system when the decoder is straight out the box with no CV changes. As I said before, I know TTS has a lag because when I am testing a loco built from bits the delay quite often catches me out. I found some of the early LokSound sound decoders are even worse.

[96RAF]

TTS - Have a look at CV201, as you can see default is 25 = 2.5 seconds).

[Deem]

Thanks ColinB

I don't see myself to buy Zimo Sound decoder for around £100.00 to £120.00, so maybe just leave it is as it is for now, until I have the money to spare and spend on Decoder.

Thanks 96RAF

I will test that tomorrow because I just changed an LCD on Apple MacBook and installing new Big Sur after formatting the SSD. So my work table is fully occupied. Once I finish that I will reattach the DCC controller to my layout and check.

[ColinB]

I wasn't suggesting buying a Zimo sound decoder, I was talking about the bog standard £22.00 job, which used to be £20.00. It was only to prove to yourself what the delay is, due to DCC. When you have finished testing you put it in one of your other locos. A Zimo £120.00 sound decoder will probably have the same delays as TTS, although I must admit it never seems so obvious. Most of my locos have TTS, although I must admit since the two price rises they are not as popular as when they were only slightly more expensive than a standard decoder.

[Deem]

Thanks 96RAF

My Dynamis DCC controller can't read the CV values so there was no way for me to check what CV 201 value was previously - however I programmed the CV 201 value to 0 and voila loco is responding straight away. With or without sound on - response is instant now. I will change the CV 201 value on all my TTS Loco and will update later.

Thanks ColinB

I didn't read your post correctly so apologies for that, I was going to try LiasDCC decoder but as changing CV201 value have resolved the issue, I don't need to do anything else.

Regards

[Fishmanoz]

Deem, you seem to be ignoring the reason for the default start delay of 25 (2.5 secs) being to synch the loco moving off with the sounds of the loco readying to move. this is also supposed to work in tandem with CVs 3 and 4, again to synch the sound sequence with realistic movement. There is a lot of info on CVs and their defaults in the downloadable leaflets.

But your locos so your decision. And at least TTS gives you the choice of changing from the default.

PS. Mods, can I suggest adding “and Start Delay” to the thread title for future reference.

[Deem]

Thanks Fishmanoz

I have changed the CV201 to 25 and response is still instant so I am happy with it, in Bachmann Class 20 - Factory Fitted Decoder without sound.

Later I will try same with TTS fitted decoder loco to see the difference and update later.

Regards

[Fishmanoz]

Deem, just remember the 25 default relates specifically to TTS. You would need to look at the specs for other sound decoders to see how they handle it and, for non-sound, it’s entirely up to you whether you need a delay or not and which CV might control it.

Cheers, Fishy