Hornby Railroad BR 4-6-2 'Duke Of Gloucester' Class 8 with TTS Sound R3244TTS

[AusMod]

Hi guys,

I'm thinking or ordering this loco. I realise that being a new model, its details will not be in the RM loco database. I'm seeking advice as to how I find the necessary data to enter into RM. Can any of you wise men please help?

Thanks

Norm

[RDS]

You may find that when the Loco is available that RailMaster Support will have added the details to RM

[idlemarvel]

I would find the nearest match (another class 8), set the address as required, then add the sound functions that are I assume documented with the model.  The speed curves etc may not be exact but they will be near enough for most layouts.

[96RAF]

Pending incorporation into RM database just call up the normal DoG (R3191 I think) then as advised by idlemarvel amend the Function descriptions to suit those in the manual supplied with TTS DoG. Some are listed in the pull downs, if not just overtype paying attention to any that need On/Off adding.

Of interest if you add a '/' in any diy description RM may call foul as it is limited to the On/Off statement. 

Note that TTS allows for 2 different speed curve regimes in CV150. If you find your TTS loco is not handling speed and sound very well on your layout then you can choose between value 0 or 1.

[AusMod]

Thanks for the advice guys. It's just what I was looking for.

[hans_van de burgt]

When would this new Hornby Soundecoder be available as an accessory for other locomotives?

Grzz, Hans

[Fishmanoz]

Hans, take a look at the TTS threads in the DCC Forum, where this question of yours rightly belongs rather then on the end of this thread. There you'll find lots of discussion about the decoder not yet being available separately, only in particular locos, ane suggesting Hornby will be on a winner when they do make it available separately. 

Note, not being critical about your thread placements, just trying to help you get the best out of the forums. Some people only look at some forums of particular interest to them. 

[Graskie]

Something I'm not sure about. I have a TTS DoG but don't really want to open it up to see exactly what's in there. Is the TTS decoder hard wired in or is it in a standard socket which would allow for replacement by any other existing makes?

[Fishmanoz]

Don't know the answer Graskie but given the chassis for the non-TTS railroad and detailed models already comes DCC ready, wouldn't make much sense to make this one differently with the decoder hard wired. 

Do Hornby hard wire any decoders?

[96RAF]

Grakie

Go to the Service Sheets download page using the link at bottom of this page and fetch HSS405 Class 8, which is the DoG TTS.

Clearly shows the decoder is a simple 8 pin plug in and the speaker in its little enclosure.

Rob

[hans_van de burgt]

It's a pitty! Today I spoke with the customer services at Hornby.
No, there are unfortunately no plans to release the TTS sound decoders as part for older locomotives.
It would be at the other hand a hugh opportunity when Hornby did it although.

And when it's a separate plug in decoder, what is it against it?

Grzz, Hans 

[96RAF]

@hans

Unfortunately at the moment the decoders are one time programmed using a particular loco's sounds, but I reckon generic steam and diesel sounded decoders would still sell well, especially to the likes of me with cloth ears that can barely tell the difference between coal and oil fueled noise.

[idlemarvel]

Agreed, a cheap generic diesel and steam sound decoder would sell well, if the rest of the decoder functions were okay.

[Graskie]

Perhaps I can help, RAF. Coal noises generally come from steam locos and oil fuelled noise from diesels (lol).

[Fishmanoz]

The significant point here is programmed. It is most unlikely any sounds are hard wired in. To me this makes little sense as it would mean short runs of different chips for each loco type and so high cost, which is the opposite of what they are achieving with this chip. If Hornby can program them, ultimately others will be able to as well if they have the right interface to the chip.

So what they intend now and what is the case further down the track may be quite different. We will just have to wait and see. 

[96RAF]

As things stand with TTS which I am led to believe are a one time program (OTP) device, to produce your own loco varieties you would need to:

1. get hold of the blank chips - unlikely to be made available to Joe Public by Hornby.

2. Have the right kit to burn the sounds onto the chip - most people won't have the kit as it is probably not just a software package.

3. Have the catalogue of sounds in the right format - not a show stopper.

What you can't do with OTP devices is reburn them - which is a show stopper - think shop bought CD.

According to HRMS you can't even re-assign Functions, so the thing is as it comes and apart from the odd CV is non fiddleable with.

[96RAF]

Except for oil fuelled steam locos and diesels with boilers for steam heated carriages. None of which helps with the cloth ears.

[idlemarvel]

From that service sheet the spare part number for the (8 pin) decoder and speaker is X11615

[96RAF]

DoG TTS 1:1 scale

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KOTQUHA8hgE

Wouldn't want to be a coal shoveller. Being a driver would be well outwith my response skill set.

Rob

[96RAF]

It would still be a DoG TTS programmed bit of kit - if you can get hold of it of course.

Be interesting to see what the other TTS variants are coded as (A4, P2, etc)

I could put up with that or any other steam TTS in a similar loco - say B1 or N2.

Retro fit would be a doddle given availabilty of sound ready tenders for a particular loco.

Any loco with an 8 pin decoder socket would just need an adaptor cable comprising an 8 pin plug harness to 4 pin plug (to transit  loco - tender) and 4 pin socket to 8 pin decoder socket. Easily made up from existing X-items.

Any dead tender without pickups could probably be converted using live tender parts to help overall pickup efficiency.

[hans_van de burgt]

To buy an official separate Sound Decoder of 84,- BRP with the possibility of self programming... Or a good functional cheap pre-programmed chip of e.g. the R3244TTS in my Class N15?

I think a lot of people would choose for the cheap alternative. I think it's hardly to name it a compromise.

Grzz,

Hans

[hans_van de burgt]

Uh sorry, I ment of course the Gloucester Class 8.

Grzz,

Hans

[idlemarvel]

Yes, and a diesel (like network rail class 37 tts) would be even easier to retro-fit.

[Fishmanoz]

So it is still a fact that a foundry somewhere is producing a blank chip which then has to be programmed, OTP or otherwise, whether by Hornby or someone contracted to them. This could just as easily be done as a retrofit kit as well as to be sold in the loco. Or someone else could be licensed by Hornby to do a kit. 

For a start though, there is a lot more profit in a loco plus decoder then there is in a decoder. They hopefully also establish the reputation of TTS this way at the same time that the higher loco returns are offsetting the initial costs. 

Having done all of that, they can then look at marketing a retrofit kit for a wide range of locos. That will get them volume returns on the chip way beyond the number of new locos they can sell. 

But as I said, we'll have to wait and see. It's understandable they wouldn't tell us this is their strategy while they are still looking for the higher returns on the locos. 

[96RAF]

Can't fault any of your logic Fishy, given also that preparing and manufacturing each TTS variant for market must be a fairly time consuming exercise, all of which will likely be completed before any effort would be applied to retro kits.

Generic kits would likely follow the same process apart from, instead of building it into a loco it would be bubble packed for direct sale.

Also Hornby would have to produce a fairly comprehensive but broad brush installation quide to go with the kits and/or put similar guides onto their Support site as they have for normal decoder conversions.