DCC Track don't work?

[wayne_nicholls]

Hi, does anyone know why a layout wont work on DCC?

Ive plugged my DCC in and the display is flashing and making a noise, but if i split a track piece it works ok. i have 3 tracks side by side and one up and round, but when i connect the one that goes up and round, it doesnt work.

Why?

[2e0dtoeric]

Not a lot of information there, Wayne, but at a guess, you have a short circuit somewhere.

Does the one  - 'up and round' - come back to the start point, a bit like a teardrop? If so, that's the problem, you need some other bits before that will work, - two sets of insulating tracks, and a reversing module.

If the train can go round and round for ever, in a circle, it must be something else.

Which DCC controller are you using?

How many loco's on the track?  (Engines, not complete trains!)

[Fishmanoz]

Welcome to the forums Wayne. 2e0 almost certainly has it right - you have made a reversing loop in your layout. Easy to tell even if it is a complicated one - if you can start a train off at a point on the layout in one direction and run it around such that it can return to that original point going the other way, you have a reversing loop. And if you follow that same path along one rail, you'll see it ends up joining to the other rail, causing the short.

 

The only way to handle such a loop is to have a section within it, longer then your longest train not just loco, which is isolated by insulated rail joiners on both rails at each end. Then you have to be able to switch the polarity of the DCC signal In this section.  You switch it to match the polarity of the signal where the train enters the loop, then it must be switched the other way to match where it leaves before it actually starts leaving.

 

the elegant but expensive way to do this is to use a reversing loop module as 2e0 says. It senses the polarity and automatically switches it to match. Manually, you can do it with a break before make double pole double throw switch. You connect this to your DCC supply and put one polarity on one side going to the section, and the other polarity on the other. You can then switch to match the polarity where your train enters, stop the train in the section and switch it the other way to match where it leaves. 

 

And note if you go for the RLM and you are using Select or eLink, the module only works reliably with the 4 Amp supply, not the 1 Amp that comes with both of those. 

 

PS.  Everyone else has been giving long answers to people this morning, so I thought I'd join in. 

[idlemarvel]

If you want more info read this on reversing loops with DCC

http://www.brian-lambert.co.uk/DCC%202.html#Reversing

Also here is the Hornby product info for their Reverse Loop Module R8238

https://www.hornby.com/downloads/view/download/item/151

 

[ModelerXYZ]

More information please... it sounds like there is a short circuit on the track. 

[PJ_model_trains]

It does ModelerXYZ

 

But that short circuit could be caused by the reverse loop discussed above if a reverse loop module is not used.

 

If he doesn't have a reverse loop, he may have more than one power connection to his track, with one in the opposite way round reversing the power connections.

 

We need Wayne to read the above and reply.

 

PJ

[Fishmanoz]

KISS here guys. 

 

You must have got bored before you got to the end of my post PJ. You don't have to have an RLM, just a switchable isolated section. 

 

And if one disconnection cures the problem, far more likely to be a reversing loop than a second reversed power connection. An offending connection will still be connected to the layout at the other end of the track on which it is connected, whereas one break will eliminate the reversing loop. 

[PJ_model_trains]

And if one disconnection cures the problem, far more likely to be a reversing loop than a second reversed power connection. An offending connection will still be connected to the layout at the other end of the track on which it is connected, whereas one break will eliminate the reversing loop. 

That is true!   Well said Fishy

[PJ_model_trains]

KISS here guys. 

Not the sort of statement I would have put on the forum fishy

The reply is certainly, no thank you!

[Graskie]

I bet his breath smells of fish, don't you?

[PJ_model_trains]

I bet his breath smells of fish, don't you?

 

Well if it is not his 'soles' or 'eels' I would hate to smell the other 'plaice'

[Fishmanoz]

KISS - Keep It Simple Stu..id.  If that's not simple enough for them Admin, please replace the dots with a 'p' for me.  Hopefully not offensive in this context.  Surely the KISS principle isn't just an Aussie thing?

 

and if there are many more fish jokes, I'll have you all battered, with (DCC) chips thanks!

 

[PJ_model_trains]

KISS - Keep It Simple Stu..id.  If that's not simple enough for them Admin, please replace the dots with a 'p' for me.  Hopefully not offensive in this context.  Surely the KISS principle isn't just an Aussie thing?

 

and if there are many more fish jokes, I'll have you all battered, with (DCC) chips thanks!

 

 

That's pretty good for you this time of day  ;o)

What ever time of day that may be for you LOL

No offence by the above it is an English joke Fishy

PJ

[Fishmanoz]

All bright and scaly-tailed here after my morning coffee. Only cloud on the horizon is that hostage situation in town which I haven't checked on since getting up. 

[PJ_model_trains]

We are a bit KOI today fishy

[2e0dtoeric]

Are you codding, threatening to batter ALL of us, Fishy?

[PJ_model_trains]

KISS - Keep It Simple Stu..id.  If that's not simple enough for them Admin, please replace the dots with a 'p' for me.  Hopefully not offensive in this context.  Surely the KISS principle isn't just an Aussie thing?

 

and if there are many more fish jokes, I'll have you all battered, with (DCC) chips thanks!

 

 

Fishy 

 

It is a pity this forum doesn't allow, personal messages, it would have been easier to email a member to say things rather than add them here. But we don't have PM's and I think your comment was thoughtless and that it could offend. For those reason I add the following...

 

One of the problems with the Internet is things said in one country can offend someone in another.

 

Reading KISS here guys to me,and I am sure some others, means you are referring to kiss your back side!

 

The fact you put the two words after it made your comment more personal, had it been left at KISS it would have probably been less a problem.

 

The fact you have explained what the statement meant... KISS - Keep It Simple Stu.id, should simplify what you were saying but I felt made things worse. I feel what you wrote was uncalled for as it can be taken wrongly in more than one way. As it comes over, you are in effect calling people on the forum Stu.id!!!

 

A bit tactless I think Fishy, you could easily upset people with both statements. Not something I would have said on the forum for what I consider obvious reasons. I don't KISS and I am not stu.id! Taking the p I think.

 

I think the statement made is best not said in the first place.

 

PJ

[wayne_nicholls]

Thanks guys/media/tinymce_upload/IMG_1270_2.jpg

[Fishmanoz]

In that case PJ, my sincere apologies. I can assure you that no offence was intended. 

 

By way of explanation, the acronym is attributed here some years ago to a Rugby League coach, recently deceased and of some renown. He used it in the context of explaining that game plans for his players were not complicated. Even on original telling, it was considered funny in a dry way, not offensive. 

 

Since then, it has entered the lexicon as a mildly amusing way of saying don't over-complicate things, and without hint of offence. That was the context in which I used it. 

 

Wikipeida gives an earlier attribution to the U.S. Navy and others and notes that the second S is intended to mean the opposite of the literal.  You can find this entry by a Google search using "KISS principle" as your search term with the principle avoiding your having to look through many entries on the band of that name.

 

Again, my apologies. 

 

And another example of how our common language divides us. 

[wayne_nicholls]

Thanks guys, not sure if it a loop as youve all described. Ive got a 3 oval lane track layout, with an up anover/round coming off lane 2, doing the whole circuit round and rejoining on the 3rd lane. ive tried to upload a photo but not sure if its worked!!

Am looking into the loop module, but need more info before i buy one, might change my layout again...lol

[Fishmanoz]

Test your up and over as I suggested earlier Wayne to see if it is a reversing loop or not.  My betting is you'll find it is.

 

Youll also find find heaps of content in here on the RLM and how to set it up if you do a forum search on it. 

[PJ_model_trains]

In that case PJ, my sincere apologies. I can assure you that no offence was intended. 

 

By way of explanation, the acronym is attributed here some years ago to a Rugby League coach, recently deceased and of some renown. He used it in the context of explaining that game plans for his players were not complicated. Even on original telling, it was considered funny in a dry way, not offensive. 

 

Since then, it has entered the lexicon as a mildly amusing way of saying don't over-complicate things, and without hint of offence. That was the context in which I used it. 

 

Wikipeida gives an earlier attribution to the U.S. Navy and others and notes that the second S is intended to mean the opposite of the literal.  You can find this entry by a Google search using "KISS principle" as your search term with the principle avoiding your having to look through many entries on the band of that name.

 

Again, my apologies. 

 

And another example of how our common language divides us. 

 

[PJ_model_trains]

Thanks guys, not sure if it a loop as youve all described. Ive got a 3 oval lane track layout, with an up anover/round coming off lane 2, doing the whole circuit round and rejoining on the 3rd lane. ive tried to upload a photo but not sure if its worked!!

Am looking into the loop module, but need more info before i buy one, might change my layout again...lol

Hi Wayne

 

What you are describing sound like you have a reverse loop.  

Look at your track that goes round and rejoins. One side of the track is live the other neutral. Now follow it round, with your eye or your finger and see if it meets the opposite track on its return. Live has to meet live as it would in an oval. If it meets the neutral you have a reverse loop and need a reverse loop module.

 

There is, as Fishy says, lots on the forum about reverse loops and Hornby do a reverse loop module which is very easy to fit.

 

If you still need help, continue to add your questions, there are plenty of good guys on here to guide you.

 

PJ

[trainlover23]

Thanks guys/media/tinymce_upload/IMG_1270_2.jpg

YES there is a reverse loop Take the flyover out and have three straight circles

[2e0dtoeric]

Yes, a reversing loop, counting from the right, the fourth and sixth sets of points are the problem.

If you take the right turn at the fourth point, go up the gradient, round, over the top, and down again, where the green engine is, you will see that it has swapped directions.

What you need to do is fit a reversing module to the high level loop, and insert two isolating breaks into the track, one by the green engine, and one just past the fourth point, before the climb starts.

Problem solved.

 

I hope you intend supporting that high-level track better than that!