Hornby Power Booster How And When To Use Question?

[Dwarfboysim]

HI,

I was just wopndering what the rule of thumb was on using a Hornby Power Booster and what the best way is to use it.

 

Thanks,

Dwarfboysim

[96RAF]

The first rule of thumb is that a Booster MUST only be connected to an electrically isolated section of track separate from the track section powered by the main controller.

 

Second rule is NEVER connect the BOOST terminals on your controller to your existing track thinking it will give it a boost. It will only give your controller an unwanted boost into never-never land and probably kill it.

 

A booster provides additional power only to this isolated section, but echoes DCC signals sent from the main controller into this section.

 

The Hornby Booster can be connected to the main controller by various methods and only ONE of these should be used at a time, not belt and braces. Its worth downloading the manual for the Booster from this web-site downloads / digital area which explains all this.

 

Third rule of thumb is if you really need a Booster then you have a really big layout and probably know all about boosters anyhow.

[Fishmanoz]

The simple rule of thumb is RAF's third, you may need a booster once your layout is big enough to fill both car spaces in your double garage.  Until then, forget about using one.

[RDS]

... what the rule of thumb was on using a Hornby Power Booster ...

Why do you think you need one, just out of interest?

[St1ngr4y]

I have two DCC buses on my layout, one for the track and one for my accessory decoders. I use a Hornby Elite controller. The track bus is connected via a Power Booster, and I have been running successfully with this setup for a couple of years.

However, in the last day or two I have encountered an obscure fault which at first, I wrongly attributed to Railmaster (sorry HRMS :-)). The fault concerned Traintech 4-aspect signals. I found that switching POINT number 46 caused SIGNAL 302 to switch between g & r, and POINT 47 caused the same signal to switch between y & yy. I was able to repeat this fault with another Traintech signal, and the common factor was that the difference between the addresses of the point and signal is always 256 (i.e. 2 to the power of 8).

Today, however, I found that this also occurs when I use the Elite alone i.e with Railmaster and the pc switched off. HRMS have been unable to reproduce this problem, so I am now starting to question whether this combination of buses and Power Booster can have any adverse effect on operation.

Is there anyone out there who has any similar DCC setup?

Ray

[96RAF]

I'm sure we had some forum discussion a long time ago about odd addresses giving strange results and it never fully bottomed out.

That had to do with address such and such being the power of so and so as well.

People with better memories than me will no doubt track it and provide a link.

Just seems odd that it woked fine before and now it doesn't. Other people have reported similar but different with RM recently.

[St1ngr4y]

I'm sure we had some forum discussion a long time ago about odd addresses giving strange results and it never fully bottomed out.

That had to do with address such and such being the power of so and so as well.

People with better memories than me will no doubt track it and provide a link.

Just seems odd that it woked fine before and now it doesn't. Other people have reported similar but different with RM recently.

That was me as well, I'm afraid - it concerned Traintech signals with addresses which were a multiple of four. It was for that reason that, on the advice of HRMS, I re-numbered the offending signals to their current values a month or two ago. The thing is I only just noticed this happening in the last week or so, so I guess it could have been happening since I gave the signals their new numbers.

Ray

[MetmanUK]

I have two DCC buses on my layout, one for the track and one for my accessory decoders. I use a Hornby Elite controller. The track bus is connected via a Power Booster, and I have been running successfully with this setup for a couple of years.

However, in the last day or two I have encountered an obscure fault which at first, I wrongly attributed to Railmaster (sorry HRMS :-)). The fault concerned Traintech 4-aspect signals. I found that switching POINT number 46 caused SIGNAL 302 to switch between g & r, and POINT 47 caused the same signal to switch between y & yy. I was able to repeat this fault with another Traintech signal, and the common factor was that the difference between the addresses of the point and signal is always 256 (i.e. 2 to the power of 8).

Today, however, I found that this also occurs when I use the Elite alone i.e with Railmaster and the pc switched off. HRMS have been unable to reproduce this problem, so I am now starting to question whether this combination of buses and Power Booster can have any adverse effect on operation.

Is there anyone out there who has any similar DCC setup?

Ray

I also use my power booster to run my accessory bus - at the moment it's used for point motors but I am about to add TrainTech signals.

[St1ngr4y]

Hi Metman,

Maybe you could try an experiment for me when you have a Traintech signal installed. It' s address would need to be 256 greater than a points port address.

Ray

[MetmanUK]

Hi Metman,

Maybe you could try an experiment for me when you have a Traintech signal installed. It' s address would need to be 256 greater than a points port address.

Ray

Hopefully I'll be able to try this in the next few days.  I'll certainly report back.

[Fishmanoz]

Interesting discussion on a different use for a booster.  Clearly you can do this and at least two have, but it doesn't mean you have to.

 

Again, boosters only become necessary if you have a very large layout.  Also in general, separate busses for locos and accessories are a matter of choice for the operator, not a necessity unless you have a power limitation issue with a large number of points being thrown at the same time, not just a large number of points on your layout.  Points draw little current except when being thrown.

 

Then running that separate bus with a booster or a separate controller is a matter of choice.  It is up to you how you decide to go with this, and I can't see an advantage one way or the other.  You just set up RM to match, with the single controller if using a booster and two controllers on A and B when you have them.  Maybe Ray and Metman can tell us why they decided to go the way they have?  

[St1ngr4y]

I don't know if you noticed, but Metman uses his Power Booster for his accessory bus, while mine is used for my track bus, which includes Traintech signals which clip into the track.

Rightly or wrongly, I bought a booster simply because of the size of my layout which is located in my attic (about 25' x 10').

Ray

[MetmanUK]

Interesting discussion on a different use for a booster.  Clearly you can do this and at least two have, but it doesn't mean you have to.

 

Again, boosters only become necessary if you have a very large layout.  Also in general, separate busses for locos and accessories are a matter of choice for the operator, not a necessity unless you have a power limitation issue with a large number of points being thrown at the same time, not just a large number of points on your layout.  Points draw little current except when being thrown.

 

Then running that separate bus with a booster or a separate controller is a matter of choice.  It is up to you how you decide to go with this, and I can't see an advantage one way or the other.  You just set up RM to match, with the single controller if using a booster and two controllers on A and B when you have them.  Maybe Ray and Metman can tell us why they decided to go the way they have?  

I was experiencing severe problems getting my Peco points and motors to operate without at least a 20 second gap, even with a dedicated CDU (I couldn't get the Hornby accessory decoder so was using a single manual lever).  i found ADS8s worked but was concerned about the frequent recharging of their dedicated CDUs.  Given the number of points planned and my expectation of powered accessories like signals, I decided to separate them from the track, at least for now.  I have wired the layout so that I can move to the alternative use (2 power regions) should I wish.

[MetmanUK]

I don't know if you noticed, but Metman uses his Power Booster for his accessory bus, while mine is used for my track bus, which includes Traintech signals which clip into the track.

Rightly or wrongly, I bought a booster simply because of the size of my layout which is located in my attic (about 25' x 10').

Ray

Initially I swapped the transformers (1amp / 4amp) over so that the track had more power but had to swap back (at Hornby's suggestion) when the points ceased to operate.

[Fishmanoz]

Thanks to both for that.

 

Ray, you still haven't reached the rule of thumb double garage size.  But you do need booster or controller for the second bus anyway.  While it makes no difference to RM, the booster solution allows you to operate with the single Elite on both buses.  That's an advantage I didn't consider first up.

 

Metman, remember CDUs recharge at low current, that's the point about them.  And only for a short period so can't imagine you have more than a few at any one time.  There's no doubting you have more power available though to give you some reserve.

[St1ngr4y]

Hi Fishy,

One advantage which you may not have thought of.....

If I have a short circuit on the track e.g. due to a train fouling a wrongly positioned electrofrog point, the red light comes on on the Power Booster, but I can still operate the points via the accessory bus. The down side is that the Power Booster doesn't have either an on/off switch or a reset button, so to reset it I have to pull out the cable from the power supply transformer then plug it back in ;-)

Ray

[MetmanUK]

Thanks to both for that.

Metman, remember CDUs recharge at low current, that's the point about them.  And only for a short period so can't imagine you have more than a few at any one time.  There's no doubting you have more power available though to give you some reserve.

True except that the 1amp transformer wasn't man-enough to power the 2 ADS8s and around 20 Cobalt Digitals.

[Fishmanoz]

Hi Fishy,

One advantage which you may not have thought of.....

If I have a short circuit on the track e.g. due to a train fouling a wrongly positioned electrofrog point, the red light comes on on the Power Booster, but I can still operate the points via the accessory bus. The down side is that the Power Booster doesn't have either an on/off switch or a reset button, so to reset it I have to pull out the cable from the power supply transformer then plug it back in ;-)

Ray

 

Yes Ray, a well-documented benefit of boosters that I hadn't mentioned.

[Fishmanoz]

Thanks to both for that.

Metman, remember CDUs recharge at low current, that's the point about them.  And only for a short period so can't imagine you have more than a few at any one time.  There's no doubting you have more power available though to give you some reserve.

True except that the 1amp transformer wasn't man-enough to power the 2 ADS8s and around 20 Cobalt Digitals.

 

So using both solenoids and slow action Metman?  My layout will end up that way too.  I can see this would have been an issue setting on startup.  Did you have problems when operating the layout too?

[MetmanUK]

Thanks to both for that.

Metman, remember CDUs recharge at low current, that's the point about them.  And only for a short period so can't imagine you have more than a few at any one time.  There's no doubting you have more power available though to give you some reserve.

True except that the 1amp transformer wasn't man-enough to power the 2 ADS8s and around 20 Cobalt Digitals.

 

So using both solenoids and slow action Metman?  My layout will end up that way too.  I can see this would have been an issue setting on startup.  Did you have problems when operating the layout too?

Yes, I have solenoids in the fiddle yard and Cobalt Digitals on the main layout.

The issue wasn't on startup as I was still building the layout and had that feature switched off.  I had added a few more Cobalts and tested them and everything was fine.  A few days later they didn't work and there was a different buzzing from the booster or eLink.  Whatever I tried it had no effect.  I asked Hornby and was requested the swap back the transformers as they recommended 4amp for the booster and everything worked again!