Loco Detection - Different Methods and Systems

[PJ_model_trains]

May be John, may be.

May be probably means similar to coming soon, maybe.  😉

 

[Yelrow]

Train controller ?

[PJ_model_trains]

Train controller ?

You got it in one John.

 

[Yelrow]

PJ, using the original prices, as thats all we have for now, roughly what would be the cost of equipping your proposed layout, with Hornby product. thanks.

[PJ_model_trains]

PJ, using the original prices, as thats all we have for now, roughly what would be the cost of equipping your proposed layout, with Hornby product. thanks.

 

rI expect more than the cost of the system you mentioned John, and it would be a sensor only system. The package you mentioned is computer contolled block control built in, without all the extra wiring and IRJ's. The product you mention is already sensor ready.

 

Hornby have to start looking much closer at other systems, or they will miss out. They were the first with the two aspect colour light signal, donkeys years ago, where are they now? Hornby track was always where people started, but look at the most popular now. Sad really but it would be even sader if they ended up an engine and carriage/wagon company.

 

[Nick_]

@PJ, sorry for thread drift, but surely TrainController requires extra hardware and lots of it?

Without hardware there is no feedback and without feedback the Software doesn’t know where the locos are and thus it can’t know which block each one is currently in ?

[96RAF]

Unless it is purely time based like RM is currently, any software requires hardware to feedback positional data to the central processor to control trains, signals, points, etc.

 

Basic hardware needs to be some form of track located sensors and an interface unit twixt the sensors and the PC/Controller.

 

Price of that lot can be enormous.

 

Unfortunately we have drifted off topic again, which is a pure list of guesses when this system will show its face.

 

Maybe someone would like to start an LD system discussion thread.

 

Rob

[Yelrow]

Rob, we are not really off the topic, as Hornby mentoinned it in their mag, and linked it to forthcoming availability, Hence, Loco  Detection Availability. With this in mind, many would i am sure, like some idea of cost. Given that PJ, has a plan, already posted, the point i was making , is that it could  be costed. I know prices will be well out of date, but it would give  anyone contemplating building a similar layout, a rough idea.   At this moment we have nothing to compare with.. There are those, who have got tired of waiting, and bought other systems. I have no recollection, of  a proposed layout, being costed, on the forum, and here, it could be done. I thought it   could be interesting. 

[PJ_model_trains]

@RAF96

I Rob, I do not believe we are off topic, Loco Detection ot alternative methods are beung considered by many, some have alreay gone down that road, many others are looking and considering alternatives. It is important for Hornby to know this also.  We are all 6 years older than we were when LD was first mentioned by Hornby! So many of us were reired then or coming close to it. I want to enjoy my trains and have the benefit of some form of loco detection. The system mentioned allows the user with software to control their engines and trains in a better way for running routes, it also stops crashing by not allowing other engines into an occupied block, all software driven. Engines are calibrated with the system, the longer the test track the more accurate the result, but sensors are needed for the finer accuracy of slowing and stopping. That is when extra hardware comes in, but only for LD using sensors to obtain these more accurate stops, etc. It is down to the user how accurate a system they want, but as I see it, the block control is a massive move forward, and makes the final LD sensor system much more affordable. 

[PJ_model_trains]

@yelrow

Hi John, I agree the thread is not off topic, but what I have to say is no one can estimate what Hornby's LD will cost because we do not know the prices of the elements needed, they may have changed the way they initially thought of doing it. I would guess that a basic starter kit, which had just a few sensors would be double the cost first stated. Then you have extra sensors, and what is the limitation to the amount of sensors per control card, It could be costly for even an average system, but we don't know what it will cost John, we don't know if it will come, it could be a PR job to keep us interested a bit longer? Remember thse words some three years ago 'coming soon'.

[PJ_model_trains]

@PJ, sorry for thread drift, but surely TrainController requires extra hardware and lots of it?

Without hardware there is no feedback and without feedback the Software doesn’t know where the locos are and thus it can’t know which block each one is currently in ?

The software does most Nick_, it includes most of the items we have requested for RM, smaller icons, less clumsy boxes, more window like, etc, etc. The signals are built into the end of blocks, so they point the right direction as seen by the engine driver. The block detection system I feel is brilliant, no hardware needed, no wiring every block and adding loads of IRJ's, but engines must be calibrated for best accuracy.

 

The only real need for extra hardware is signals and points, same as RM, and sensor control for more accurate stopping, Which LD needs anyway. The main differences I feel are it is much better presented on screen, the software knows where an engine is within a block, accuracy comes down to careful calibration and sensors and controller cards later. I downloaded this software trial version 3 years ago, the latest version shows how far forward they have moved, they have listened to users and built in what was asked for, Hornby has not done that with RM.

 

The software is not cheap, but it is packed with easy to use Windows style controls for the user, creating a track plan is so easy, programming every engine and block takes time but that is part of the setting up procedure, once done it is time to play. Creating routes again is easy because it is block to block controlled and before you start the system knows how many routes are available, more than we realise on medium and larger layouts. Have I purchase it, not yet, I am still in the 30 day trial, but like others before me, I am fed up of waiting for Hornby, 6 years is a long time, and even not we do not know if it is PR buying time or genuine, and when it does arrive we can be certain it will cost a lot more than there original estimate all those years ago.

 

[RDS]

That means we are all at least 33 months older Fishy.  😮

I don't think it would be a good idea to quote the original proposed cost for buying the LD system. 

Meanwile, TrainTech are moving forward, if Hornby don't have word in LD my Easter next year I think I can see myself adapting to TT. 4 to 5 years at least since LD was mentioned, we are all getting older and can't wait forever for a proposed, coming soon system, that has never come. 

As for myself, we moved home earlier this year, we've had a few issues since moving in, therefore I don't expect to be able to start, layout 3, until probably February, March. I do miss my trains. Meanwhile it has been nice to watch the TV show on a Friday evening in the UK.