Showman6677 Posted May 9, 2019 Share Posted May 9, 2019 Good morning everyone. I have a 1980’s R063 Brittania with I think a tender mounted Ringfield motor and wondered whether it is possible to fit a X9659 standard decoder.Any help would be greatfully appreciated.Colin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The son of Triangman Posted May 9, 2019 Share Posted May 9, 2019 Perfectly possible, however you will need a decoder that can handle a 1 Amp stall current and the loco must be in good running order on DC before conversion as DCC will show up/magnify any running faults. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Showman6677 Posted May 9, 2019 Author Share Posted May 9, 2019 Margate-Richmond, thank you very much for your reply.It will be good to see it running with the rest of my engines, so I will get myself a suitable decoder and give it a go.Colin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ColinB Posted May 11, 2019 Share Posted May 11, 2019 I don't know if your ringfield motor is the same as in my old locos, but there is a screw that connects one of the brushes to the chassis of the loco. You need to insulate this and provide a separate feed or else you might blow up the decoder. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Howbi Posted May 11, 2019 Share Posted May 11, 2019 There are nylon screws available to replace the metal original to provide the insulation necessary........HB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Showman6677 Posted May 11, 2019 Author Share Posted May 11, 2019 Thank you ColinB and howbiman, that was going to be my next question now that I see that it has a live chassis.Is there a standard part number for the screws or would I need to go to my local hobby shop?Colin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fishmanoz Posted May 12, 2019 Share Posted May 12, 2019 There are 3 different types of Ringfield needing different conversion treatment. Google Brian Lambert, go to his DCC pages where you’ll find the 3 covered including how. The screw is not a standard part. I think you may be lucky though because MR who sent your original reply is very knowledgeable to the extent he probably realised yours doesn’t need the screw. But you need to check as if you do have continuity from left brush to tender chassis, then you will blow up a fitted decoder, no might as ColinB suggested. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
96RAF Posted May 12, 2019 Share Posted May 12, 2019 Peters Spares have the nylon screws in their own number parts range but there is on the forum a link to some much cheaper ones.I found the PS items a tad tight and needed careful ‘working’ to get them in without shearing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Showman6677 Posted May 12, 2019 Author Share Posted May 12, 2019 Fishmanoz and RAF96, thank you both for your help. I will search the link to see what I can find and I have downloaded Brian Lamberts pages, so it looks as though I have some reading to do!Colin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
96RAF Posted May 12, 2019 Share Posted May 12, 2019 If you need the nylon screws here is a direct link https://www.petersspares.com/peters-spares-ps13-nylon-screws-for-hornby-ringfield-dcc-conversions-pack-of-10.ir Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Showman6677 Posted May 12, 2019 Author Share Posted May 12, 2019 RAF96, thank you for that but having taken the body off of the tender I see that I have a ringfield 2 motor with a brass plate held on by 3 screws. Would I be correct in thinking that I need to replace al 3 screws to isolate the motor from the chassis?Colin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DEREK123 Posted May 12, 2019 Share Posted May 12, 2019 Hi ColinI am sure this needs confirming !!On your R063s Tender are ALL wheels courrently insulated ie Tires and plastic backs to wheels ? IF YES then the answer is NO as you will have 2 wires form the loco to the Tender ( left and right rails power) so the motor terminals are the grey and orange and the loco to tender feeds are black and red.The loco /tender is a soldered but semi permanent link ... is that so with your loco ?I have a Black 5 R061 which uses the mark 2 Ringfield but it has only a single rail feed from the loco so the wiring would be different for me to convert to DCC .I hope that is correct and useful.CheersDerek Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
96RAF Posted May 12, 2019 Share Posted May 12, 2019 RAF96, thank you for that but having taken the body off of the tender I see that I have a ringfield 2 motor with a brass plate held on by 3 screws. Would I be correct in thinking that I need to replace al 3 screws to isolate the motor from the chassis?Colin Follow Brian Lamberts guide for that ringfield variant. The nylon screw (singular) is used to isolate the left hand brush from the motor housing which is usually live to the wheel pickup. Prime directive is both motor brushes MUST be isolated from the track pickups before hooking a decoder into the loop. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Showman6677 Posted May 12, 2019 Author Share Posted May 12, 2019 Hi Derek.No, my tender has tyres on one side only so a single feed from the loco.colin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Showman6677 Posted May 12, 2019 Author Share Posted May 12, 2019 Hi RAF96.I have been through BL guide but cannot find any info regarding this particular motor.It has a brass plate covering a 3 pole armatur, and you need to remove this plate to access the brushes. The plate is held on by 3 brass screws. There is a capacitor soldered between the brush terminals and a wire from the drawbar soldered to one brush terminal. It is a live chassis with tyres on one side and a single feed from the loco.colin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DEREK123 Posted May 12, 2019 Share Posted May 12, 2019 Hi Colin / Rob The Spec sheet is 98A .... I have attempted an upload. ....it might help .... I think the Model 2 Ringfield in BL s Document is not the one you have.Hope this helpsCheersDerek /media/tinymce_upload/ed5e79fac8b52720cbd51add2b5e3023.jpg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DEREK123 Posted May 12, 2019 Share Posted May 12, 2019 Hi Colin / RobIt is Spec Sheet 98A ... I have posted but its up for moderator approval .... the nylon screw (s) would be different .... Colins description of the motor is correct, and it is not the same as Brian Lamberts Derekhttp://www.hornbyguide.com/service_sheet_menu.aspFollow link and search .... best if you copy & paste to your browser. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Showman6677 Posted May 12, 2019 Author Share Posted May 12, 2019 Hi Derek,thank you for the link and yes you are correct.I found a different forum while trying to figure out how to do the conversion and there was a suggestion to isolate the brush caps but I couldn’t get into the link. I did find a phone number so I might give it a call tomorrow.Is this something you’ve heard of?colin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The son of Triangman Posted May 13, 2019 Share Posted May 13, 2019 This motor is sounding very familiar, the loco is 1970's not 80's. It is the mk2 early ringfield with the brass front plate and brass brush caps. They are tricky to insulate, but can be done. The brush caps must not touch the brass faceplate. You solder the motor control wires (grey and orange) to the cylinders that hold the brushes rather than the caps (freezer spray is recommended as it stops any melting of the surrounding plastic). There should be no electrical connection between the live chassis (negative) and the faceplate. Nylon screws and washers will be needed, these can be found v.cheaply from electronic suppliers and on ebay, much cheaper than model shop suppliers. Use of a multi-meter is essential. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Showman6677 Posted May 13, 2019 Author Share Posted May 13, 2019 Margate-RichmondI guess I was a little out with the date, but you’re right about the motor design.This might just be a little out of my league but I will see what I can do.Thanks everyone for all your help in the meantime.Colin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DEREK123 Posted May 13, 2019 Share Posted May 13, 2019 Hi ColinYou could try the Brian Lambert's suggestion of "heatshrink" around the screwheads/shoulders if you can't locate decent nylon screws . I don't think isolating the brush caps a good idea. It is very tricky sometimes replacing brushes and springs on this motor , so go gently , slowly and good luck.Let us all know how you get on please especially if you are successful with the conversion.(Another option is to use a later tender which has the later Ringfield 2 which BL is describing )BFNDerek Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fishmanoz Posted May 13, 2019 Share Posted May 13, 2019 I would be taking MR’s latest advice. Those of us who know him from the forums know that he has run his own model shop and repair business in the past so knows exactly what he is talking about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The son of Triangman Posted May 14, 2019 Share Posted May 14, 2019 This is the motor in the flesh, it isn't the easiest motor to convert, the brass faceplate doesn't make life easy. . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Showman6677 Posted May 14, 2019 Author Share Posted May 14, 2019 To Derek123, Fishmanoz and Margare-Richmond, I thank you all for your advice and I will start by taking the easy option and buying myself a later tender that is easier to convert.Derek, thank you for the upload. It is the upper R063 diagram. If I am able to find a solution to converting the earlier motor, I will come back with the information.cheers for now Colin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The son of Triangman Posted May 14, 2019 Share Posted May 14, 2019 I am doing a tutorial on making this motor DCC as it seems to be a popular one to do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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