Will Triang Hornby train set still work?

[GBDT]

Hi. While sorting out my loft I came across my very first train set. It's a Triang Hornby set from around 1959-60. I remember the transformer going bang about 10 years later but I never renewed it. If I want to use the set again, will the modern transformer/controllers work with the old set? Or will the old trains work on todays layouts. 

Cheers, GBDT

[LCDR]

The older trains need a bit more power than the modern ones with more efficient motors. This has discussed here many times.

 

Why did your old transformer controller go 'bang'? Has it affected the old train?

 

The small wall plug type transformers will probably not put out sufficient power so you need to look for a more powerful unit. Hornby make the HM2000, which will do the trick, or you could look at a Gaugemaster unit. 

 

You may be able to find a second hand HM Clipper but you will need to get it checked out (PAT tested) by a competent electrician.

 

If the locomotive has not been used for 50 years it will need servicing. All the bearings will have dried out, and unless the loft is bone dry there may be some corrosion to deal with. Have you inspected it yet? The motor magnet may have weakened so you may need to get it re-magnetised. It may need to be sent away to  Scalespeed or one of the other firms who offer this service.

 You may find this useful.

 https://www.hornby.com/uk-en/forum/beginner-question-set-not-working

 

[Going Spare]

The answer to both questions is 'probably not'.  The electric motors used then draw more power than modern Hornby controllers put out except the HM2000 but there are suitable controllers from other manufacturers.  The wheels then used were far coarser than today's, meaning that whilst they may run on modern plain track, they almost certainly will not run through modern pointwork.  Even on plain track, the flanges may hit the rail chairs because the height of the rail has been reduced.

GS 

[96RAF]

If it is a train set then it will likely have come with the old track which if cleaned up carefully will perform adequately.

[LCDR]

My main concern would be corrosion, rails from that period wre plated steel and moisture tends to accumulate in attics and if it settles on iron or steel it can quickly cause rust.

[GBDT]

Thanks everyone for all your comments. 

 

My train collection was stored either in the house or for the last 30 years in the loft. It is dry up there but it is cold. They were all in either their original boxes or boxes that were lying around. I really don't want to spend too much time or money on them if thats what it takes to get them running. My plan is to buy a new Hornby train set and buildup from there. Finding somewhere to put it is the next problem! The loft is an option as long as I only stand up in the middle ;-).

 

Cheers,

GBDT

[LCDR]

We would be curious about which set you have and whether you manage to get it going. 

[GBDT]

We would be curious about which set you have and whether you manage to get it going. 

I'll be back up in the loft this week. I'll get the train set info, etc. I'll try and take some photos as well.

I tried the 9volt battery test on one loco and the wheels spun round :-)

Cheers, GBDT

[LCDR]

Thanks for update, 

[GBDT]

Been back up in the loft  😆

 

My first train set was the Goods train set R3E, from 1958-9.

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It came with a Class 3f tank locomotive, an open wagon, a Shell petrol tank wagon, a cable drum wagon and an ER brake van.

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My second train set was the Transcontinental train set R3H, from 1959. Consisting of 2 diesek locomotives (1 powered, 1unpowered), a standard coach, and a Vista dome coach.

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This set also came with a strange track which didn't fit my usual Triang track. It looked like it included the ballast layer and the track.

/media/tinymce_upload/35a25fe9423f2c953745f08abd85efdf.jpg

My third 'set' was bought individually. Based on a NATO theme it consisted of a helicopter wagon R128, a searchlight wagon R341, a rocket launcher R343, pulled by a 0-6-0 diesel shunter R152. I thought I had the exploding wagon as well but it wasn't there.

/media/tinymce_upload/113ab5495b315566b4717d149328b58b.jpg

 

/media/tinymce_upload/57fa59c363067798d39e8adeaec18dc4.jpg

 

/media/tinymce_upload/7a8c4d8c09a6ba7da7af42606c03d356.jpg

 

 

I als found a Utility van R227, a track cleaning wagon R344 and a Hornby Dublo metal restaurant car. I found a match for this on Ebay which identifies it as an LMS Stannier Restaurant car.

 

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Also found a GW Lord of the Isles locomotive.

Cheers

GBDT

 

[GBDT]

Posted a reply a day or so ago. How long does it take to check photos!

Anyway, this is the text of the post without photos.

Been back up in the loft

 

My first train set was the Goods train set R3E, from 1958-9.

 

It came with a Class 3f tank locomotive, an open wagon, a Shell petrol tank wagon, a cable drum wagon and an ER brake van.

 

My second train set was the Transcontinental train set R3H, from 1959. Consisting of 2 diesek locomotives (1 powered, 1unpowered), a standard coach, and a Vista dome coach.

 

This set also came with a strange track which didn't fit my usual Triang track. It looked like it included the ballast layer and the track.

 

My third 'set' was bought individually. Based on a NATO theme it consisted of a helicopter wagon R128, a searchlight wagon R341, a rocket launcher R343, pulled by a 0-6-0 diesel shunter R152. I thought I had the exploding wagon as well but it wasn't there.

 

I also found a Utility van R227, a track cleaning wagon R344 and a Hornby Dublo metal restaurant car. I found a match for this on Ebay which identifies it as an LMS Stannier Restaurant car.

 

Also found a GW Lord of the Isles locomotive.

 

GBDT

 

[LCDR]

You have some interesting stuff there, I hope you are able to make it all go. 

 

Triang track came in four types depending upon age.

 

The very earliest had integral ballast and sleepers made in silver grey plastic. At first it would only couple one way round so the best you could do was an oval, but fairly quickly they changed the coupling arrangement so that it could be used in much more versatile ways, and added points and crossings etc. The track was called Standard, or Universal once it became variable. 

 

Using the same Geometry about 1958 they removed the ballast base leaving just the sleepers and a connecting web in black plastic. This was Series 3, and lasted until 1962 when the next version appeared. It could be joined with Universal despite the difference in height because a foam rubber 'ballast' strip could be put under the Series 3 rails.

 

In 1962 Super 4 track system appeared which had larger but more closely spaced sleepers in brown plastic.  It was possible to join Series 3 and Super 4 by removing a little bit of plastic from the end, but it was difficult to use the track interchangably because Triang altered the geometry including changing the radii of the curves and lengths oif the straight pieces. 

 

The last of Triang's track system used the same geometry as Super 4, but used a much smaller rail section (code 100) and the sleepers were altered to HO scale.  To joint Super 4 to this new Series 6 a special adaptor track was needed which fortunately Triang had introduced at the time they took over Hornby Dublo. Sleeper colour reverted to black. (There was no actual series 5 sold to the public) .

 

[Ruffnut Thorston]

That's a fair collection!

 

The "strange track" could be Tri-ang Railways Standard Track, if the Ballast layer is grey plastic, and includes the sleepers.

 

If it has 3 rails, it could be early Trix, a black plastic (Bakelite) base, or Hornby Dublo 3-rail, a metal tin printed base

 

Both set numbers indicate sets supplied originally with Tri-ang Railways Series 3 track.

This has black plastic sleepers, widely spaced, and a heavy section rail.

 

The metal restaurant car could have metal wheels? If so, it will short circuit on 2-rail track.

Or it may have black plastic wheels, which would be ok on 2-rail track.

Tri-ang Railways use 2-rail track.

 

The Hornby Dublo couplings are different from the Tri-ang Railways couplings.

 

If the Tri-ang Railways sets were made prior to 1959 the rolling stock will have the earlier MK2b (open loop) couplings, while the NATO wagons will have the later, from 1959 onwards, MK3 (closed loop) couplings, similar to the current Hornby wide tension lock couplings.

 

The Lord of The Isles will have MK3 couplings. If it is the first issue, 1962, it may be fitted with a Seuthe type smoke unit.

 

The NATO wagons later became part of the Battlespace range.

 

EDIT: Typing while LC&DR was posting.

 

Image approval is Admin's job, and is not working as smoothly as it one did, as it seems that the post needs to be filled as the previous Admin has moved on.

[LCDR]

/media/tinymce_upload/27a3f36739ad46c985fd5b60b7eb0572.jpg

This is the two types compared / joined.

 

(NB as a long standing and trusted contributor I am allowed to post pictures without Admin approval, unfortunately new members have to await approval, and as Sarah has said there is a vacancy for an administrator at present so things take a little longer, sorry) 

[Jimbo1707820979]

How can one become a trusted contributor ? I have posted a lot of photos and this would really help in posting some more.

[atom3624]

Perhaps greater than 1,000 consecutive contributions without conflict?

 

Al.

[Rog RJ]

Contact the forum admin and ask to be considered for automatic photo posting privileges.

[walkingthedog]

Just ask that's what I did. 

[Arabian Knight]

Hi I had a set that hadn't been used for 50+ years used some train oil had no problems with a modern transformer using the old track on modern and older trains.

[GBDT]

That's interesting about the track. Because my first train set had, what I now know to be series 3 tracks, I thought that these were the Triang tracks. my second set had, what I now now as standard tracks, and together with what I thought was a north american engine, I'd assumed that they were North American tracks! Stop laughing! I was very young ;-).

 

LC. you mention code 100 track. Is this a special size or a Hornby/ other makers name for todays tracks? 

 

Sarah. Yes I seem to have a variety of couplings. Is it possible to change them to more modern couplings? 

 

Have started to buy some new rolling stock and an engine. Need to buy a train set to give me the track and controller, etc. Was planning on getting the new Flying Scotsman set - part of the 2020 collection - but it is not due out until June. main problem is that I have no where to set it up. I have an idea to use the loft once I have put in some better flooring. there is not much hieght in the loft, so i may end up crouching or kneeling when using the trains. I also haven't told the wife of my plans!!

Cheers

[JJ73]

Same Here - about a year ago When Adam was still here - I sent an email - asking for automatic photo posting privileges & said that all the photos that I'd sent were good & I even said pretty please with a cherry on top - that had seem to do the trick!!!

[LCDR]

Code 100 refers to the height of the rail, and generally (but not always) describes rail with a flat bottom profile as well. It is the vertical height in thousands of an inch, so is 0.1 inches tall. 

 

Common modern rail section are -

Code 100 - 0.1inch used in modern set-track and flexible track in UK and Europe (this is the modern and commonly used type sold by Hornby, Bachmann, Peco etc.)

Code 83 - 0.83 inch used by US modellers

Code 75 - 0.75 inch, used in fine scale UK flexible track and components

Code 55 - 0.55 inch used in N scale flexible track

 

[Ruffnut Thorston]

It is not easily possible to swap the Tri-ang Railways MK2 couplings as the mounting is usually a part of the chassis on most locos and rolling stock.

 

The later MK3 type can be swapped for the Screw On type of narrow tension lock couplings made by Bachmann.

 

Also available from Bachmann is a slightly older design, that originated with Mainline (Palitoy), and was also used on early Bachmann models.

The loop on these couplings is a bit wider than the narrow type, and narrower than the Tri-ang and Hornby MK3 wide loop.

 

A lot of the Tri-ang Railways and Tri-ang Hornby models have the couplings riveted on to the chassis.

 

Some have the two outside mounting pins rivetted over

Others have an eyelet rivet in the centre hole, with pegs in the two outer holes.

 

Locomotives tend to have fixing screws.

 

To fit a replacement coupling to a riveted mounting would involve, for the eyelet type, drilling out the eyelet, and sourcing a small but and bolt (or rivet) to attach the new coupling. Or it is possible to rely on glue.

 

The ones with the two outer pins rivetted over are a bit more of a problem.

 

The metal MK3 couplings can be prised off with a suitable tool. This can tend to wreck the coupling.

 

It MAY be possible to fit a replacement coupling by forcing it on, and then re doing the rivetting with a suitable punch.

Or, glue could be used.

 

Either way, changing the couplings is not so easy.

 

It is probably a better idea to keep it all original, and either sell the old stock on, or just run it together....

 

It really depends on what you wish to achieve.

 

We have old stuff, and new stuff.

 

But we don't tend to mix the two together.