User Unfriendly DCC

[CaptCluster]

I would like to stick up for all the humble victims of Hornby DCC systems that seem to feel guilty that the product that they have paid for doesn’t work.

 

Not everyone likes to spend hours backward engineering the thought processes of software nurds. Surprisingly, some people buy train sets to play with toy trains, without having to learn a new language as unfamiliar as that used on planet Zog.

 

I have noticed, time and again, patronising comments from ‘experts’ to the effect of ‘it’s all in the PDF that should be installed on your desktop.’ And the poor recipient meekly apologises for his lack of knowledge and laziness. Well, stuff that, when someone buys a product for hundreds of pounds that needs tens of hours experiences and study before the manual can be even understood, let alone be acted upon, the product should carry a health warning for those who have got a life which, fortunately, I haven’t, as I am retired and a kept man. And before the ‘O, right; too old to be computer savvy,’ kicks in, I have been on the dam things from pre windows DOS and have no trouble jamming new stuff in the box from time to time to update using quality PC hardware with efficient software.

 

I suggest that Hornby sack their entire programming staff, or contract, and find someone who can program a user friendly version that will not result in frustration, annoyance, loss of reputation and future custom. If a better programmer cannot be found, I can certainly find one – seriously – he doesn’t have very good social skills but he could sort this mess out for you in his spare time.

 

One more thing, from what I have read in the blogs, I suspect there is much to be gained from upping the amps. If this is the case, why is Hornby continuing to supply an underpowered transformer with the elink?

[2e0dtoeric]

Which bit of DCC don't you understand, Captain?

 

My first layout for over fourty years is DCC, and I've had no problems with it.

 

Mind you, I've not tried the computerized gimmick of e-link, just the Elite controller, which does all the controlling I need. If I wanted a computer to play trains for me, I'd spend a few years learning COBOL or whatever, but I'd rather call up a loco on the keypad, dial up a speed, and watch it go.

 

Agreed, the instruction book could be written better, but if you take your time with it, and don't guess what you think it is supposed to say - based on previous computer experience -there is no problem. No matter what electronic gadget you buy, the instructions for it are written by techies who know what is supposed to happen, and what to do if it doesn't, and not by an English Professor who knows how to put words together in the proper order, for the purpose of exchanging information!

 

 

 

(p.s. - before anyone complains that fourty doesn't have a 'U', I know, but four does, fourteen does, and in my dictionary, a forty is the little housy where soldiers play. their little games!)

[Fishmanoz]

Admin, this is one that would benefit from a move to the RM forum where the good Captain can have better access to the friendly RM people who won't just refer him to the manual.

[Fishmanoz]

CC, as 2e0 suggests, let us know what particular areas you are having trouble with so we can give you some targeted tips.

 

Concerning the 1 Amp supply, you may be interested to know that the RM programming team (usually referred to here as HRMS) run their large test setup just from 1 Amp. However, there used to be a driver issue with some configurations but that has been solved using an RM-specific driver first released with v1.56.

[Yelrow]

HI, Capt Cluster, as an ardent Elink user, i find your post, very surprising. When a new product is launched, there are bound to be the odd quirk, which Hornby Railmaster support, worked round the clock to fix. The latest updates, have put everything right, and elink now works a treat. The manual, like all those written by programme designers, is not  that basic, but those on this forum, work tirelessly to ensure we understand it. DCC, given the very nature of the beast, was never going to be plug and play, and if thats what you want, stick to the select controller. Regarding the 4 amp supply, this was allways going to be necessary, when you started adding multiple points and turntables, as it is for other makes. It is fair to say, that in some earlier cases, it appeared to help the elink, but that was in some specific cases, like in france, and cyprus, . Hornby still run their test track on 1 amp..  DCC is not for us all and never professed to be, i and many others, still have large DC layouts. I dont think any DCC user feels guilty if their product does not work, first time, we would all be amazed, and annoyed, if we had nothing a little difficult to go at, before our new hobby took off. Have you ever tried to fly a remote controlled helecopter. Frustrating, yes, technically challenging, yes, expensive, yes, but we new all that before we parted with our money. Surely thats what a hobby is about, particularly in retirement, filling in time, whilst staying abrest with modern technology to keep the mind active. I do not regret a pound, or a minute spent on this element of my hobby. If i did, the patience and dedication, of Hornby support, coupled with that of my fellow forum members, would more than compensate. lighten up. john

[westernwill]

Well said, John, I totally agree with you.

I struggle with modern smartphones but that's just me not particularly wanting to learn about them.

I only restarted with model railways this year and it has been a steep learning curve but I have enjoyed (almost) every minute of it and look forward to the challenge of Loco Detection next year (well I am an optimist).

Lots of help on here for anyone stuck, although I would always suggest reading the manual first. It might not solve your problem but it will help in phrasing your question better. bryan

[idlemarvel]

I would like to stick up for all the humble victims of Hornby DCC systems that seem to feel guilty that the product that they have paid for doesn’t work. Not everyone likes to spend hours backward engineering the thought processes of software nurds. Surprisingly, some people buy train sets to play with toy trains, without having to learn a new language as unfamiliar as that used on planet Zog. I have noticed, time and again, patronising comments from ‘experts’ to the effect of ‘it’s all in the PDF that should be installed on your desktop.’ And the poor recipient meekly apologises for his lack of knowledge and laziness. Well, stuff that, when someone buys a product for hundreds of pounds that needs tens of hours experiences and study before the manual can be even understood, let alone be acted upon, the product should carry a health warning for those who have got a life which, fortunately, I haven’t, as I am retired and a kept man. And before the ‘O, right; too old to be computer savvy,’ kicks in, I have been on the dam things from pre windows DOS and have no trouble jamming new stuff in the box from time to time to update using quality PC hardware with efficient software. I suggest that Hornby sack their entire programming staff, or contract, and find someone who can program a user friendly version that will not result in frustration, annoyance, loss of reputation and future custom. If a better programmer cannot be found, I can certainly find one – seriously – he doesn’t have very good social skills but he could sort this mess out for you in his spare time. One more thing, from what I have read in the blogs, I suspect there is much to be gained from upping the amps. If this is the case, why is Hornby continuing to supply an underpowered transformer with the elink?

I have some sympathy with your point of view, and I can feel your frustration, but (you knew there was a "but" coming) this is a complex subject and the resulting software is necessarily complex.  DCC can be easy, if you stick to DCC controllers like Select or better the Elite, it's all pretty straightforward with quite short and fairly simple manuals that tell you all you need to know. 

Once you introduce a computer into all this, especially WIndows, you open a whole can of worms.  There are so many variables in any one computer setup, with enormous variations of hardware and software.  Then you have the model railway side of it, with an equally enormous number of points, signals, decoders, locos from different manufacturers which have combinations of open standard and proprietary connections, and you begin to understand the complexity, and why sometimes it just doesn't work out of the box, like we'd all like it to.

Take a deep breath, read the manual from cover to cover (it only takes an hour), and try again.  The people on this forum have been there done that got the t-shirt and on the whole try and help in an unpatronising way.  We all have our own personal issues with the software, it certainly isn't perfect, and you can see the frustration in the forum sometimes, but on the whole once you get the basics working it's a good system, and certainly good value. 

[RDS]

I have been using RailMaster since Feb 2013 and I have found it to be extremely reliable when used in conjunction with my Elite.  From what I have read on the forum, the support from the RailMaster support team at Hornby to users with problems, has been superb.

[Michael_A]

I have to agree with CaptCluster.

DCC is a very technical and confusing topic, and the assumption seems to be if you can't undersatnd it you shouldn't use it. Fair enough, but then make it clear that the DCC and RailMaster part of the hobby requires some electronic and computer skills.

As for software, well it's amateurish, flaky, and unstable. Its 2014. Why I need to have my i7 quad core laptop 100% dedicated to a 1980's RS232 interface, albeit via USB, is a mystery to me. I can buy a 30 quid printer, plug it into my PC and off it goes. I can buy a 100 quid camera, install the software and lo and behold I get a robust interface, and software that both works and is intuitive, and doesn't look like something written for an Amstrad or a Sinclair. I can also scan, read e-mail, load songs to my MP3 player, browse the web, copy files to an external hard drive, all at the same time.

I know this is budget DCC, and good value it is at that. But we must spare a thought for our friends who are given such high expecattions in the advertisng of DCC and RailMaster, then find, through no fault of their own, they don't have the knowledge or geek skills to make it work.

 

 

[Yelrow]

Michael A , hi, plug and play, to which you are referring, usually, is brought out by massive companies, like Apple, and Microsoft, HP, etc.  If this is what people want, thats fine, but the likes of Lenz, and ecos, where this occurs, will triple the cost of entry into  your hobby. For those who struggle, and if the forum is anything to go by, its not many, The immense and superb level of Hornby Support, , not offered by these other people, so generously, more than makes up for the  odd problem that people come across. A lot of the regulars on this forum, are in  there 60s, and none are computer geeks, yet with the help supplied, freely, we succeed john