Hornby Rewards and Pre-Orders

[Bulleidboy]

I think Rob (RAF96) reported this the other day, but I cannot now find it, but I have just received the following email:

Since the launch of Hobby Rewards a few weeks ago, we have seen thousands of customers joining the new Hornby Hobbies loyalty program and getting rewarded for the hobbies they love.

Many customers have contacted us about the availability of points for products they pre-ordered prior to the launch of Hobby Rewards, but had yet to receive. We can confirm that we will retrospectively award points for any existing pre-orders that were held by customers on November 22, 2022, the day we launched Hobby Rewards.

This will be applied retrospectively next month. As anyone with an existing pre-order was awarded an extra 200 points when joining Hobby Rewards, these points will be deducted from your total points when applied.

In order to receive your points, you will need to be an existing member of Hobby Rewards. If you are not already a member, please sign up here to guarantee your pre-order points.

Kind regards

The Hobby Rewards Team

[Brew Man]

Thanks, BB. I mentioned this a few minutes ago in the thread below, but it is good to have it as a separate thread for clarification.

Maybe good to re-title it, 'Hornby Rewards and Pre-orders'.

[Bulleidboy]

Thanks Brew Man - Amendment made. BB

[What About The Bee]

I went back through the rules, terms and conditions. I think these are the relevant paragraphs.

÷÷÷Snip÷÷÷

The points will be added to your Hobby Rewards account at the time of payment. These Points will appear as Pending until the end of our 14-working day return period. Pending points will become active after this time. Should you choose to return any items in your order, the pending points for those items will be withdrawn.

You will earn points on any pre-orders. These will become active 14 working days after receipt of your product. During the wait for delivery of your pre-order, these points will appear as pending.

÷÷÷End Snip÷÷÷

So I am not sure how a pre-order will appear in my Rewards account prior to payment being taken. Do they show up as pending, even though the payment has not been taken?

Bee

[RB51]

If you go to Hobby Rewards>Hobby Points [using the wheel top right] all are listed there. Tap any order number for your account page and scroll down for order information. R-

[Bulleidboy]

I assume everyone who has signed up for the Hornby Rewards, will get whatever points are due on their pre-orders placed in the "pending box". Once payment has been taken and the order has been delivered and the fourteen day pending period has expired, the relevant amount of points will be added to your account.

Bare in mind there must be thousands(?) of pre-orders to which points have to be allocated to the pending area of each individuals Hornby Rewards Account.

As with pre-orders, just sit back and wait for it to happen - no need to panic.

[DarkRedCape]

Not sure I’ve seen this asked/answered yet, but can you use reward points exclusively by themselves?

For example, if I go to buy a loco, and it says would I like to use my reward points, and I have enough points to cover the cost of the loco, can I use only reward points to make a purchase, or does it have to be along side a monetary order?

If my current pre-orders are added, I’ll have enough to buy 6/7 locos with reward points alone.

[Bulleidboy]

I could not see anything in the T&C's that says you could not "pay" for a model using just Reward Points - assuming you have enough points.

[What About The Bee]

I'm not fussed or panicked about the points. Hornby said they are going to do it, I believe them. It will happen when it happens.

I just was curious about the system and I learned something. For whatever reason, I had never investigated the "Hobby Points". Thank you Roger, for pointing that out.

In so far as using your points to pay for a locomotive outright? Why not! If you have managed to acquire that many points, then absolutely yes. I agree with BB, nothing in the terms & conditions prohibits that.

Bee

[DarkRedCape]

So it just occurred to me, if Hornby are now going to include all existing pre-orders, the people who cancelled and re-ordered and now potentially face price increases and maybe even disqualification of receiving reward points did it all for nothing?

[JJ73]

This is the bit i don't under stand :- "This will be applied retrospectively next month. As anyone with an existing pre-order was awarded an extra 200 points when joining Hobby Rewards, these points will be deducted from your total points when applied."

Are they going to deduct points & why??? 🤔🚂

[Bulleidboy]

@JJ

I would guess that at the initial launch of this Reward scheme Hornby decided to give anyone who joined, who had existing pre-orders, 200 points (£2.00). Following lots of questions etc., Hornby decided to give Reward members the correct number of points equal to the value of their pre-orders, which in many cases is likely to be in excess of the 200 given. In deciding to do that, they are taking back the initial 200 given.

[What About The Bee]

So it just occurred to me, if Hornby are now going to include all existing pre-orders, the people who cancelled and re-ordered and now potentially face price increases and maybe even disqualification of receiving reward points did it all for nothing?

 

 

Yes, exactly.

Not only was there zero gain, but the potential for swallowing a price increase is high.

I've also been concerned that there could be a penalty, because of the obvious manipulation. Hornby will easily spot this and the terms and conditions specifically warn about attempts to game the system.

Bee

[What About The Bee]

Programmatically

Sequentially examine all customers

If (customer canceled and then reinstated multiple pre orders after program inception) then

(

Potential system manipulation found. Add customer to list for human intervention.

)

That is a trivial piece of database code. Likely less than an hour to properly write and test. List of potentials produced for study that day.

I do understand that there could be an innocent explanation for canceling and re-instating an order, that is why there should be a human based decision in the last act. But multiple pre-orders? All in a row? Short duration of manipulation, task based? That person will be easily spotted.

DRC, I believe you mentioned 40 pre-orders? I know you stated that you just let it ride, but if you had canceled 40, and then reinstated 40, that isn't indecision on a particular model. Canceling 40 could be financial distress, but did your finances change so suddenly that you could re-instate those same 40? In 2 hours? More than likely, it would be perceived as gamesmanship. Your mileage may vary.

I do not wish ill on anyone. Yet actions have consequences.

[DarkRedCape]

I have 34 pending pre-orders with Hornby, hopefully 35 soon, and I never considered cancelling and re-ordering any of them.

I’d end up paying out more due to all the price increases, so I’m definitely not saving money by doing it. I’ve had some of my pre-orders for well over a year and the possibility of losing my place in the queue and potentially ending up with no loco at all simply wasn’t worth the reward points. Which, apparently, I’m going to get now anyways.

[What About The Bee]

Just in case I have ruffled any feathers by mentioning DRC and the large quantity of pre-orders, I will state forthrightly that it was for illustrative purposes only. Hopefully it was taken that way.

I also just let my pre-orders ride and now, happily, I will get the rewards points as well. 🙂

Hornby must have sensed the discontent about pre-orders (maybe even from the Forum) and did the right thing by us. Well done Hornby!

Bee

[JJ73]

@BB :- Thank you for that - I think I understand a bit more - but they can't take away 200 points away from me b/c I have already spent it!!! 😄🚂

[Bulleidboy]

From the revised T&C's.

Consequences of misuse

In the case of improper use for which the Member is responsible, Hornby Hobbies Ltd retains the right to terminate the membership or withdraw Points or Rewards, refuse to issue Points or a Reward or refuse to accept the redemption of Points or a Reward.

[What About The Bee]

JJ

You can rest assured that Hornby will take the 200 points. You will be the only person to ever end up with negative Rewards Points. 😄Please do update us with a screenshot, that will be most entertaining!

Bee

[JJ73]

@ Bee :- If that does happen - then I will!!! grinning

[DarkRedCape]

Just noticed that my most recent loco arrival added 0 points to my Reward Points. It shows up on the points statement page, but it shows as costing £0 and added 0 points. The order was placed on February 25th.

I assume that this order shows up now when it didn't previously because Hornby are now including pre-orders placed before the introduction of the Reward Points system. Just have to hope stuff like this is updated when they amend peoples accounts.

Anyone else have an order that shows as £0?

[Brew Man]

I think it has been previously mentioned that points will be awarded 14 days after delivery of orders.

[What About The Bee]

Hi Brew Man

I think DRC has it right.

The points DRC earned ARE pending. They just happen to be zero! At the end of the receipt period, those non-existent points will become active.

DRC thinks it part of this grey zone, in which there is a change over in how the system works. I happen to agree with this.

Hornby will straighten this out. Confidence!! Some patience on our part will be required and a pinch of verification too.

I'd be much more concerned if this was the end of January, but this is just days after the correction announcement.

÷÷÷÷

Speaking of the rules though, the T&C state, as Brew Man reports, 14 days after receipt. An email I received from Hornby Hobby Points today states

Pending points will become active 21 days after receipt of any corresponding order.

This is a disconnect, an obvious conflict and should be corrected at the web team

Bee

[Going Spare]

I think the actual quote is 14 working days, which brings it closer to 21, but I grant you there is a disparity.

[DarkRedCape]

The last time I checked my pending Reward Points (maybe a week ago) the only things on the list were the 200 points for joining, and the points for the Collectors Club Coronation. So having my latest order, the City of Lichfield Dublo on the list shows that the system is working fine and is just a work in progress. In my opinion at least.

As mentioned already, there is a lot of accounts to update and a lot of points to award. I’m in no rush for the points, they’ll arrive when they arrive.