Augustus Caesar Posted November 22, 2014 Share Posted November 22, 2014 Well folks, some of you may well have attended the first day at Warley so how did it go and do you have anything exciting for us regards news of new stuff and anything good for Christmas or even early 2015? Now I do realise there is another day to go and some may not be there until tomorrow but any news will be exciting so come on fellas spill the beans... :-) News of any new retooling like a Class 37 (keep pushing it guys don't I?) and new deisels... new TTS locos? Anything? :-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
walkingthedog Posted November 22, 2014 Share Posted November 22, 2014 One of the problems with Saturday at Warley can be getting near the stands of Hornby etc. There's so much to see elsewhere I used to avoid them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PJ_model_trains Posted November 22, 2014 Share Posted November 22, 2014 I agree WTD . You want to try with a power wheel chair! Last year I watched young kids carry stools so they could step up (where they found a small gap) to see a little more. Good on them! . From down where I sit all I could see was blokes back sides, not a pretty sight and not what I was hoping to see. 'Only one person' stepped aside and asked if I wanted to get to the front, 'he was moving on'! . I don't complain, first time I have said this on here and probably wouldn't had you not said what you had. . To be honest, I saw more on YouTube after the show than I did at the show. . PJ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2e0dtoeric Posted November 22, 2014 Share Posted November 22, 2014 I always find it offensive how legged people cannot 'see' chair drivers. I had similar treatment when I was pushing my disabled wife around in one. They would shove in front, and stand right where all she could see was the buttocks, and on the rare occasion they spoke, it was to me, totally ignoring her, and usually to say go away spelled differently, when I objected to their behaviour. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graskie Posted November 22, 2014 Share Posted November 22, 2014 If it's a power wheelchair, can't you just ram people to get them out of the way, PJ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The son of Triangman Posted November 23, 2014 Share Posted November 23, 2014 I didn't go, too expensive and too far away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Augustus Caesar Posted November 23, 2014 Author Share Posted November 23, 2014 I've been to a good few shows now and each time a wheelchair user has approached a display where I am and cannot get a view I usher them forward and let them in where I stand... after all I can see over them... so what's the problem with folk? Just plain ignorance!! I always talk to the person in the chair too... my wife worked with folk with disabilities of all kinds and she always addressed the person she was talking to and not about! I learned that much from her and more. It is a fear thing for some folk when they shy away from talking to the actual person in a chair for example and it shouldn't be of course. It's great to get a reaction and thank you too but I don't look fo it. Seems like this was too expensive for a lot of folk and too distant. We need more of these nationally at a large scale instead of small shows. These ones don't allow for mere mortals to attend if you don't have your own transport. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PJ_model_trains Posted November 23, 2014 Share Posted November 23, 2014 I always find it offensive how legged people cannot 'see' chair drivers. I had similar treatment when I was pushing my disabled wife around in one. They would shove in front, and stand right where all she could see was the buttocks, and on the rare occasion they spoke, it was to me, totally ignoring her, and usually to say go away spelled differently, when I objected to their behaviour. We all want to see the trains 2e0 but some want to see the last one of the day as well as the first. Sadly, the way the world is today it is a case of being first no matter what. I do understand both sides, some people find it bad enough with wheel chairs, but now there are lots of scooters as well, and they take up more room, as for my chair it can turn on its own circle and I can get through narrow gaps no problem but, there has to be a gap. Another problem I have is sitting so low if I get to the front I cannot see a lot. Hence I quoted the nice example of children carrying steps so they can stand higher to see. I appreciate this as something I have to live with and am to polite to force my way in. . I have lots I could moan about with my health but, try not to. Instead I try make jokes out of things, it helps the day go by. Well I call em jokes but being Graskies apprentice on here now I am not so sure ;-) . I had to laugh at your comments also 2e0, not funny really, just adding another edge. Re-read your comment, I found it funny although I do not make a joke of your poor wife... you said 'They would shove in front, and stand right where all she could see was the buttocks, and on the rare occasion they spoke' What their buttocks!!! ;o) . PJ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PJ_model_trains Posted November 23, 2014 Share Posted November 23, 2014 If it's a power wheelchair, can't you just ram people to get them out of the way, PJ? Hi Graskie . Two wrongs don't make a right and I would be worse than them wouldn't I. . We all go to see the trains and layouts, we all pay to see them so would like to think we get our money's worth. . PJ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PJ_model_trains Posted November 23, 2014 Share Posted November 23, 2014 I didn't go, too expensive and too far away. Fishy didn't go either ;o) . He says he is going on holiday to USA, lucky man. I keep watching 'I'm a celebrity get me out of here' wondering if he is hiding in the trees. . PJ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PJ_model_trains Posted November 23, 2014 Share Posted November 23, 2014 I've been to a good few shows now and each time a wheelchair user has approached a display where I am and cannot get a view I usher them forward and let them in where I stand... after all I can see over them... so what's the problem with folk? Just plain ignorance!! I always talk to the person in the chair too... my wife worked with folk with disabilities of all kinds and she always addressed the person she was talking to and not about! I learned that much from her and more. It is a fear thing for some folk when they shy away from talking to the actual person in a chair for example and it shouldn't be of course. It's great to get a reaction and thank you too but I don't look fo it. Seems like this was too expensive for a lot of folk and too distant. We need more of these nationally at a large scale instead of small shows. These ones don't allow for mere mortals to attend if you don't have your own transport. Hi AC . There is a lot in what you say. It is clear you have knowledge or experience with disabled, even though through your wife, it comes through clearly in what you say. . Ignorance yes, but also not knowing what to do or say is another issue, although being polite and sharing, even the space we stand in to see things, shouldn't be hard to do. . Good point you said, you let them through after all you can see over them. Some cannot see this (they paid to see the trains and the trains they will see). . I notice some small clubs (maybe one member has knowledge of someone with a disability, maybe a partner, a friend, or even themselves) they open their doors to disable an hour before they allow others in, it is naturally not long enough for a disabled person to get round and see everything but it is a good gesture. There are however some who moan but, in life there always will be. . PJ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The son of Triangman Posted November 26, 2014 Share Posted November 26, 2014 My problem with Warley is that it's a 240 mile round trip from here, and expensive to get in and park. From a business point of view the price of trade stands there is massive and you need a good sized stand to cover the costs, so it has to be viable to be there. A lot of the ordinary traders according to a friend put their prices up on models for sale to compensate as well, a friend noticed big increases on a lot of the s/h model prices there. There needs to be a few similar sized shows around the country which the majority can reach without having to spend an arm and a leg and traders can sell at without breaking the bank for a stand. I'm concentrating on local shows next year. Once you get above the £50 per foot of stall per day price for a stall you have to really sell some stuff. Local shows can be free for traders or up to £36 per foot for the more expensive ones. Shows like Warley are invariably around the £100 - £150 per foot per day. So a 24ft stand could cost you around £2400 - £3600 per day, that's before you make anything! We stick to the local shows where a pitch will cost you around £15 - £30 per 6ft, so a 24 foot pitch, can cost us around £60 - £120 per pitch, you then have expenses such as travel costs, the odd overnight stay in a cheap B&B or travelodge style accomodation, that's all before you make a penny profit. I avoid the big shows are they simply too expensive, even the food is expensive at them as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveM6 Posted November 26, 2014 Share Posted November 26, 2014 My problem with Warley is that it's a 240 mile round trip from here, and expensive to get in and park. From a business point of view the price of trade stands there is massive and you need a good sized stand to cover the costs, so it has to be viable to be there. A lot of the ordinary traders according to a friend put their prices up on models for sale to compensate as well, a friend noticed big increases on a lot of the s/h model prices there. There needs to be a few similar sized shows around the country which the majority can reach without having to spend an arm and a leg and traders can sell at without breaking the bank for a stand. I'm concentrating on local shows next year. Once you get above the £50 per foot of stall per day price for a stall you have to really sell some stuff. Local shows can be free for traders or up to £36 per foot for the more expensive ones. Shows like Warley are invariably around the £100 - £150 per foot per day. So a 24ft stand could cost you around £2400 - £3600 per day, that's before you make anything! We stick to the local shows where a pitch will cost you around £15 - £30 per 6ft, so a 24 foot pitch, can cost us around £60 - £120 per pitch, you then have expenses such as travel costs, the odd overnight stay in a cheap B&B or travelodge style accomodation, that's all before you make a penny profit. I avoid the big shows are they simply too expensive, even the food is expensive at them as well. TSOT, I didn't realise that was the level of fees the traders were having to pay, but on reflection it ain't going to be cheap to hire the NEC. But, I reckon it is good value all the same. Yes, it's a long drive for some (300 miles for me) and the car park seems expensive but it is secure parking with a door to door shuttle bus thrown in - so I don't begrudge it. I read that at £14, the entrance fee works out at 14p per layout - so again, pretty good value. I also attend as many local shows as possible and while they offer trade support, it is not as extensive as the larger shows. Let's face it, at shows like Warley the punters get the chance to see what's on offer from a much wider selection of dealers who wouldn't necessarily attend a local show. So how do I make it pay? Well for a start I don't buy anything that I can get from my local shop at the same price. What I look out for are items from traders I don't see anywhere else and keep an eye open for show offers - yes they do exist - where the discount goes towards covering my costs in getting there. For example, this year I bought four locos from Dapol and saved nearly £60 on shop prices. Food prices; I guess the vendors have similar overheads to the stall holders so again, it's not going to be cheap - but nearly £5 for a bacon roll is a bit excessive. Mind you, it tasted good! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LCDR Posted November 26, 2014 Share Posted November 26, 2014 Having never been to Warley I cannot comment specifically, but I do find big exhibitions frustrating because of the 'push and shove' just to get to see a layout or a trader. People are often very rude, and little kids get trampled on by grown ups who should know better. I go to the York show every year because it is within walking distance, and to little local shows now and again, but I won't travel half way up the country just to get jostled, after queueing for 45 minutes in the rain to get in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PJ_model_trains Posted November 26, 2014 Share Posted November 26, 2014 The Fees at NEC have always been very high. The problem for a retailer is the amount he/she has to sell to make a profit, taking into account also stock has to be take to the show and returned and restocked afterwards. . I have attended many shows at the NEC, mainly trade shows for retailers where wholesalers exhibit their merchandice. The difference between these shows and the retail shows like Warley are that the wholesaler although taking large orders and pre-orders they also received new leads, new businesses added to their books. With Warely this is not the case but again, it is much smaller and a different type of show. . PJ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gazah Posted November 26, 2014 Share Posted November 26, 2014 Good afternoon all, Attended Warley for the first time last weekend, I went with my wife and 6 yr old son, just getting into trains! 1. Was it value for money and the travel expense to get there and park, Yes i would say, the exhibitors were very friendly and always happy to talk and happy to chat to a 6 yr old also 2. Good to see exhibits children could gets hands on too 3. Plenty of sellers so was easy to find good deals, strange that next door sellers can have some much of a price differnce so need to shop around the show. 4. Access, was fine, crowded yes but it was a Saturday so was to be expected, however couple of comments, some older viewers seem to give little recourse to being patient or polite, elbows at the ready they would push in past women and children to get ther view or get the item on sale and if you made a comment regarding this the look was enough to kill the Greek Gods!! 5. I have no issue with wheelchairs what so ever those who are unfortunate to be disabled need the same access as us all able bodied, BUT mobility scooters should be banned, sorry my son was ran over by one and the guy did not stop or even know he had run his foot over they cause major issues on the outside let alone in a crowded hall. 6. Will i go next year? - yes but will be ready for it this time Looking at York also bit closer too!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PJ_model_trains Posted November 26, 2014 Share Posted November 26, 2014 but nearly £5 for a bacon roll is a bit excessive. I laughed at your comments SteveM6 . You could justify the cost of things for your day at Warley... until it hit your stomach LOL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PJ_model_trains Posted November 26, 2014 Share Posted November 26, 2014 Good afternoon all, Attended Warley for the first time last weekend, I went with my wife and 6 yr old son, just getting into trains! 1. Was it value for money and the travel expense to get there and park, Yes i would say, the exhibitors were very friendly and always happy to talk and happy to chat to a 6 yr old also 2. Good to see exhibits children could gets hands on too 3. Plenty of sellers so was easy to find good deals, strange that next door sellers can have some much of a price differnce so need to shop around the show. 4. Access, was fine, crowded yes but it was a Saturday so was to be expected, however couple of comments, some older viewers seem to give little recourse to being patient or polite, elbows at the ready they would push in past women and children to get ther view or get the item on sale and if you made a comment regarding this the look was enough to kill the Greek Gods!! 5. I have no issue with wheelchairs what so ever those who are unfortunate to be disabled need the same access as us all able bodied, BUT mobility scooters should be banned, sorry my son was ran over by one and the guy did not stop or even know he had run his foot over they cause major issues on the outside let alone in a crowded hall. 6. Will i go next year? - yes but will be ready for it this time Looking at York also bit closer too!! Hi Gazah . Good report of your expereince ;o) . Interesting again comments regarding 'little recourse to being patient or polite, elbows at the ready they would push in past women and children to get ther view or get the item on sale and if you made a comment regarding this the look was enough to kill the Greek Gods!!' . These are people who like their trains but are not helping others coming in to the hobby. There are lots of them, lets hope some are reading these messages. Having said that, they don't know or think they are wrong so it won't change. Sad really. . I knew someone would mention scooters. I am very careful with my chair, lots of practice! But I have seen some on scotters not just at shows but, more and more in supermarkets, thank goodness they don't have a long wheel base, some don't have a clue where their back wheels are and jerk start as though out of control. . Glad you and your son enjoyed the day, hope your wife did too. ;o) . PJ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gazah Posted November 26, 2014 Share Posted November 26, 2014 Good afternoon all, Attended Warley for the first time last weekend, I went with my wife and 6 yr old son, just getting into trains! 1. Was it value for money and the travel expense to get there and park, Yes i would say, the exhibitors were very friendly and always happy to talk and happy to chat to a 6 yr old also 2. Good to see exhibits children could gets hands on too 3. Plenty of sellers so was easy to find good deals, strange that next door sellers can have some much of a price differnce so need to shop around the show. 4. Access, was fine, crowded yes but it was a Saturday so was to be expected, however couple of comments, some older viewers seem to give little recourse to being patient or polite, elbows at the ready they would push in past women and children to get ther view or get the item on sale and if you made a comment regarding this the look was enough to kill the Greek Gods!! 5. I have no issue with wheelchairs what so ever those who are unfortunate to be disabled need the same access as us all able bodied, BUT mobility scooters should be banned, sorry my son was ran over by one and the guy did not stop or even know he had run his foot over they cause major issues on the outside let alone in a crowded hall. 6. Will i go next year? - yes but will be ready for it this time Looking at York also bit closer too!! Hi Gazah . Good report of your expereince ;o) . Interesting again comments regarding 'little recourse to being patient or polite, elbows at the ready they would push in past women and children to get ther view or get the item on sale and if you made a comment regarding this the look was enough to kill the Greek Gods!!' . These are people who like their trains but are not helping others coming in to the hobby. There are lots of them, lets hope some are reading these messages. Having said that, they don't know or think they are wrong so it won't change. Sad really. . I knew someone would mention scooters. I am very careful with my chair, lots of practice! But I have seen some on scotters not just at shows but, more and more in supermarkets, thank goodness they don't have a long wheel base, some don't have a clue where their back wheels are and jerk start as though out of control. . Glad you and your son enjoyed the day, hope your wife did too. ;o) . PJ Hi PJ Hope you did not take offence at my comments regarding wheelchairs non meant!! Scooters are a social hazard in my view but that said it wont stop all of us enjoying our new found ( or re found in my case) hobby!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PJ_model_trains Posted November 26, 2014 Share Posted November 26, 2014 Hi Gazah . No offence taken, no worries. . I totally understand, I see it a lot, maybe because of my situation I watch others. Trouble is secondhand scooters are coming down in price, there are more of them... Beware it will get worse!!! . No offence when I say... some men are bad on scooters but get a woman on one!!!!! . On that note I will close ;o) . PJ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PJ_model_trains Posted November 26, 2014 Share Posted November 26, 2014 It makes more sense if you read last message on previous page!) . Come back..... Calm down..... I didn't mean get a woman on a scooter ;-) . I meant beware when you see a woman on a scooter. . Some people are woman mad! . (Just joking, I didn't think the forum would allow the 3 letter word looks similar to six) . PJ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Seagull Posted November 26, 2014 Share Posted November 26, 2014 evening all...my pal and i went to warley on train from chester on the saturday.....much easier and less stressful than the car.........we have been going later each time, and it does seem to make a difference, as the crowds have thinned, or are sitting down......as with any event of size, food and drink inside is always expensive...we took sandwiches and bought cold drinks inside.....yes some people do think that the show is put on for thier exclusive benefit, and wont wait or barge thru ,,.........you know who you are......non of the forum members, obviously.......struck this time by the fact that i can now barely remember a layout that took my eye......and it was good to see all of the varied traders and seeing the wide variety of ways to spend our hard earned Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trainlover23 Posted November 29, 2014 Share Posted November 29, 2014 My problem with Warley is that it's a 240 mile round trip from here, and expensive to get in and park. From a business point of view the price of trade stands there is massive and you need a good sized stand to cover the costs, so it has to be viable to be there. A lot of the ordinary traders according to a friend put their prices up on models for sale to compensate as well, a friend noticed big increases on a lot of the s/h model prices there. There needs to be a few similar sized shows around the country which the majority can reach without having to spend an arm and a leg and traders can sell at without breaking the bank for a stand. I'm concentrating on local shows next year. Once you get above the £50 per foot of stall per day price for a stall you have to really sell some stuff. Local shows can be free for traders or up to £36 per foot for the more expensive ones. Shows like Warley are invariably around the £100 - £150 per foot per day. So a 24ft stand could cost you around £2400 - £3600 per day, that's before you make anything! We stick to the local shows where a pitch will cost you around £15 - £30 per 6ft, so a 24 foot pitch, can cost us around £60 - £120 per pitch, you then have expenses such as travel costs, the odd overnight stay in a cheap B&B or travelodge style accomodation, that's all before you make a penny profit. I avoid the big shows are they simply too expensive, even the food is expensive at them as well. I have seen some rubbish posted on this forum but the figures quoted above are totally ficticious but then look at the poster. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
walkingthedog Posted November 29, 2014 Share Posted November 29, 2014 Does seem a trite expensive. Have to sell an aweful lot of stock. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trainlover23 Posted November 29, 2014 Share Posted November 29, 2014 Son of Triang Mans figures are pure fiction I don`t know were he gets his information from but is NOT accurate Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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