Triang Super 4 track Why?

[walkingthedog]

There's an echo in here.  😆

[Triumph Owner]

OK, I'll give it a miss then. Taking me an age to list all the other (non railway) stuff anyway.

 

Paul

[walkingthedog]

You can sell things on the model railway forum. 

[Rog RJ]

You can sell things on the model railway forum. 

Only if you area member with 10 or more previous posts to your name.

Just joining to sell things isn't allowed.

[walkingthedog]

Yes Rog I forgot to mention that, thank you. 

[Ruffnut Thorston]

/media/tinymce_upload/86cbed3dc680d1aed2162de8b91a208b.jpg 

 

If you mean the track in this picture it IS Series Three fibre based flexible track, R199 sold in yard lengths. Yes they had it in those days too! I suspect a bit of air brushing to make it look shinier than it was in real  life. (Air brushing = an ancient form of Photoshop!)

I still have a few lengths of this, now somewhat tarnished and distorted.

 

Thanks LC&DR...

 

That i sthe one type of track that I have not seen "in the flesh", but I was aware of it! 😉

 

At least I got the Fibre Sleepers right?

[The son of Triangman]

Fibre sleepered track, remember it well, horrible stuff, the fibre used to warp with age so you would end up with a sleeper base that looked like a sucession of hills. Was glad they went over to proper plastic bases.

[LCDR]

 Certainly fibre based track suffered badly from distortion, especially in damp conditions, although in my experience  Triang was worse in this respect than Wrenn. I used a lot of Wrenn track in the 1950s and 1960s before changing to Formoway. The Triang sleepers were skinnier than Wrenn, I suspect to match the plastic based track.  I used to stick the Wrenn track to cork sheet with Evostick, something that the polystyrene based series 3 track did not take too kindly to.

[Ruffnut Thorston]

Hi LC&DR.

 

We have some Wrenn fibre based track, and points (the points are still on the backing boards!).

 

Also some Trix Twin 3-railed fibre based track.

 

The Trix Fibre track would make a good test track (but a bit sharp radius) as it coud be wired for two rail, Trix Twin, or straight 3-rail.

 

I do seem to remember hearing that this had indeed been done by someone.....

 

[LCDR]

 I too still have some Wrenn track including points both on and without the red backing boards and yards lengths of track with both steel and nickel silver rail too. (I even have a little quantity of  three rail Wrenn which could be used as you suggest.) I just wish I had space (and time) to build a Wrenn layout. It was always my favourite for appearance until Formoway appeared. Sadly Formoway points were not particularly reliable and the range was limited.

[Dentrix]

Will the latest fishplates fit series 4 track please I’m a bit of a novice trying to cobble together some minic motorway & series 4 rail track Den

[LCDR]

 Sadly the answer is NO. Triang Universal / Standard track as well as Series Three and Super 4 used a heavy section steel rail with a thick foot. It is at least  code 125 although try as I may I have never been able to get Peco code 125 rail joiners to fit on it.

/media/tinymce_upload/f0396c04030e62065e287478542e5797.jpg

 

 

/media/tinymce_upload/aee783108eef02eebc6e92ff792b9e7e.jpg

[Forum-1211528]

 Sadly the answer is NO. Triang Universal / Standard track as well as Series Three and Super 4 used a heavy section steel rail with a thick foot. It is at least  code 125 although try as I may I have never been able to get Peco code 125 rail joiners to fit on it.

/media/tinymce_upload/f0396c04030e62065e287478542e5797.jpg

 

 

/media/tinymce_upload/aee783108eef02eebc6e92ff792b9e7e.jpg

The Triang Bakelite track will connect to nothing except the same track no connecting it to Super 3 or Super 4 track and as far as Super 6 is consirned forget it but I agree Super 4 is a univercial track anything will run on it!

Everything from Fifties Triang to Modern Hornby locos but the bonas is you can connect it to modern Super 6 track and old stuff runs fine even Trix TTR locos!

[LCDR]

I am not familiar with "Tri-ang Bakelite" .

 

The original Rovex track ("Series 1") was cellulose acetate plastic base which was a silver grey. It did not use fishplates but there was a bent metal strip attached to one rail which contacted the underside of the adjacent rail to maintain electrical continuity. The rails were held adjacent to the next piece purely by the mechanical action of the fishtail connector moulded into the plastic base. Because the track was designed with a fishtail prong at one end and a socket at the other there was only one way that rail sections could be joined. There are good illustrations in Hammond's "bible" and I still have a few pieces but not enough to make a full oval. This prevented reverse curves being made.

 

It was replaced by "Series 2" which was "Universal" , also known as "Standard",   because it didn't matter which way round you fitted them because the redesigned prong and socket was duplicated at both ends. This still had a grey cellulose acetate base but the colour was less silver and more grey, Eventually points, crossings  and larger radius curves were added, enabling quite complex layouts. At some point the plastic material was changed to Polystyrene which was much more stable. Over time cellulose acetate shrank and distorted, hence the 'banana' carriages and mutilated locomotives .  Cellulose acetate track bases which shrank  became about 4mm short in length and 1mm narrow across the rails. This resulted in gaps between adjacent track pieces. The diamond crossing and some points distorted quite badly. 

 

Series 3 track reduced the amount of plastic in the base. Gone was the ballast although the sleepers remained very much the same. Sleeper spacing was the same unrealistic too narrow and too widely spaced. The track colour changed from grey to black. It was alledgedly a cost saving exercise by Tri-ang.

 

Super 4 replaced the Series 3 and introduced a new geometry as well as more realistic sleeper size and spacing. Sleeper colour was changed to brown The Super 4 geometry was later used in the Series 5 and Series 6 track (Series 5 was short lived and was slightly different in respect to the ends to the later Series 6 which we still use)

 

Super 4 still used the heavy plated steel rail section first used in Series 1 with the same heavy fishplates introduced with Universal track (Series 2) The method of attaching the fishplates to the rail had changed over time. Super 4 fishplates were spot welded underneath, whereas Universal and Series 3 depended on a punched dimple and a metal tab holding it in place, this may have started with later Series 3. This rail will easily rust, especially the fishplates, and may give problems with electrical continuity.

 

Of course Series 5 / 6 which we now use has code 100 sized rail, much smaller and neater but it needs an  adaptor to use with earlier rail section. Code 100 rail was first used with Tri-ang TT gauge track. Nowadays the metal used is nickel silver which does not rust like the old plated steel track.

 

Trix I beleve used Bakelite track base, this was a three rail system. 

[Ruffnut Thorston]

Series 5 was the original name for what became System 6.

 

It seems that no Series 5 track was ever marketed... though the R. Numbers had been allocated.

 

For example, the planned R.506 curve became the R.606 curve

 

It could just be that "System 6" had a better  ring to it and the marketing department persuaded a change in name?

 

As there were rumours of a new track system being developed, it seems that a marketing ploy using the introduction of the third radius Super 4 curved tracks, with advertising stating "5 good reasons..." was used to hopefully make people think that the third radius curves were the new track system, so as to avoid a crash in sales of Super 4 track....as it says in Pat Hammond's books... 😉

 

The original made in Britain System 6 track retained the half sleeper and clips that were used on Super 4 track, but smaller.

 

The R.476 ( I think) Converter Track was originally made to connect Hornby Dublo track to Super 4 track, and had HD type sleepers at the code 100 end of the special sloping rail castings.

Later versions have the System 6 type half sleeper, and I do think that the last ones had the Roco type of sleeper at that end.

The Super 4 track end retained the Super 4 type of sleepers.

 

When track manufacturing was contracted out to Roco, "made in Austria" track had a similar end sleeper arrangement to today's Hornby track, with a whole sleeper, and no clips. Only the rail joiners, fishplates, holding track sections together.

The Roco track sections also introduced the current lack of a clip fit gap between almost every sleeper, to just a pair of slots, marked on the underside with little arrows...

[LCDR]

I tend to think of the 'half sleeper' version of Series 6  as Series 5 (OK I know that isn't correct but it does help to distinguish it from the later full sleeper ends we have today) . The problem with the half sleeper arrangement was it was fragile and would break off with rough handling. 

 

The other big change during this period was the move from plated steel to nickel silver for the rails, which seems to have occured some time after Magnadhesion was discontinued. I remember when I first got the Triang L1, in 1962 and tried using it on Formoway track which was nickel silver. It could hardly manage two Kitmaster Mark 1s. Without steel track to grip to the wheels simply spun. I wrote to Triang about this and their suggestion was to stick a plate of thick plastic card on the front of the tender which pressed down on the cab floor, to transfer some of the weight of the tender on to the driving wheels. I did try that but it wasn't particularly successful.

[Ruffnut Thorston]

Hornby first used nickel silver rails as a special "Silver Seal" range of track, aimed at the more seasoned modeller.

I think it started with flexible track, and then points and, possibly, a diamond crossing came later.

 

M-R has photos of SS track it seems...

 

The half sleeper version of System 6 track seems to only have been made at Margate, the present arrangement starting with the Roco "made in Austria" track, and continuing into present China made nickel silver track.

[ColinB]

I didn't read all the post so I don't know if this has been mentioned before. Hornby did make converter tracks, I used then quite recently on my old Triang Turntable. I liked the old Triang Turntable as it looked more real than the current Hornby one. Unfortunately, while trying to fix it (motor kept sticking), it fell off the bench and disintegrated (plastic had gone brittle), but up to that I used the converter track between the Triang Super 3 track and the Peco track. I now have a Heljan turntable, only as it is the quietest available, but I still have to use converters to go from code 100 code 75 track on the turntable, so things don't change.

[ColinB]

I didn't read all the post so I don't know if this has been mentioned before. Hornby did make converter tracks, I used then quite recently on my old Triang Turntable. I liked the old Triang Turntable as it looked more real than the current Hornby one. Unfortunately, while trying to fix it (motor kept sticking), it fell off the bench and disintegrated (plastic had gone brittle), but up to that I used the converter track between the Triang Super 3 track and the Peco track. I now have a Heljan turntable, only as it is the quietest available, but I still have to use converters to go from code 100 code 75 track on the turntable, so things don't change.