Hornby R1234M, Hogwarts Express Train Set.

[new lad on block]

Hi All, A look at the main differences of the new Harry Potter set, compared to the earlier versions.

I will take photos firstly to show the locomotives which came in the sets.

Photo shows first set in the series, on top R1025M, cost £60.00 in 2002, and the latest set R1234M, costs £199.99.

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photos shows contents,New set does not have the Hogsmead Station Halt,siding is smaller, no trackmat,but has a rerailer.

Note set still has old style controller, in new set.

 

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Photos of the three different versions of the locomotive.Top first version 2002 to 2006.Middle, front light added 2007 to 2010. Bottom completely retooled model of Hall class as in Railroad range.There are also two versions of the gold plated version, not shown.

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Photo to show differences of base, and tender connections,also new model slighly smaller.Nem couplings.Brake rods etc.

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Photo, front view, shows lights on latest two models.More detail, no coupling on latest version

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Photo top view,smaller cab, more tapered boiler, extra detail on tender top.Latest version is smaller.middle loco is latest one.

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Will upload photos of coaches later.

[walkingthedog]

Price differences are interesting. Of course the Hall version is more accurate. Not sure why they used a Castle originally. 

[new lad on block]

Hi, I can only speculate but when the first set came out in 2002, the Hall  tooling Hornby had was from 1966.Perhaps it was worn out, hence they used the nearest tooling, Castle from 1997 tooling.

The new Hall tooling was in use from 2015, infact Hornby produced R3169 Olton Hall, in a similar red livery of Hogwarts Castle.

Prices, I have a price list from 2002 and does not give a R.R.P. for the set,but the loco was listed at £70.00, coaches £17.00 each.

I remember buying the set at £60.00 as it was cheaper than buying a solo loco.

Again the reason for the good price may have been, it was Hornby's first Harry Potter set so untried. Also another set was due out the following year in 2003.R1033 Chamber of Secrets.

[atom3624]

The only thing which puts me off the latest set is seeing that R8250 !!

 

Al.

[new lad on block]

Coaches, those in sets are, one composite same running number in late and early set, one brake, same number in late and early set.

Colours, near perfect  match.Grey roof slightly lighter on new ones.

Late comp coach has following differences to the  early one: nem couplings, bogies different,dark orange line above windows,no  '1' on doors,safety bars across windows, higher; roof different molding.Differnt body molding.Running number position different.

brake coach, both have same body & roof moldings,running number different location, high safety bars,less writing on new model,one less blanked out window.orange line a bove window. Door handrails highlighted on new version.Bogies and nem couplings same as new comp.

photos to show differences.

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[Phil_Spiegel.]

Well, as I look at those photos : I see the CORRECT loco ....ie the renamed 'Hall' as opposed to Castle,  and I see NEM pocket couplings on the coach bogies and loco. Improved power connection between loco and tender. ...also implying improved all / more wheel pickup .  better window rendition too?

 

Wheel standards and the addition of the headlight compared to the very original ....  Hmmm. Should I now change to this Hall rather than my castle versions  that I've just added TTS to??..

 

Not shown:. The internal weight and motor changes between the original and later version using the castle model.   

 

My brother brought me a pinkish Bachmann USA. Harry Potter  Hall version many years ago (not sold in the UK) ... Early Bachmann chassis.

 

Castle may have been used as the loco is called a castle ... So for a BOOK READER may be considered more correct .....especially if original illustrations did not make it one or the other.  The film version of course established the use of the Hall..... But when did that become known compared to model release????

 

Inflation since 2002 has been more than income for many products ... But compatively ?? Similar.      Buy from a dealer who will allow the track to be traded in instantly will reduce the cost.

 

Harry appears to have aged a bit on the box. .... But that won't affect running 8-)

 

Double returns added for C...

PPS Didn't an early promo photo shoot or illustration use a Bullied West Country or similar?

 

[Ruffnut Thorston]

Yes, the first full size "Hogwarts  Express" was a rebuilt West Country, Taw Valley I think.

 

Painted that fetching maroon shade!

 

I don't recall any model version though?

[walkingthedog]

My guess is that most of the book readers would have been happy with a Black 5 as long as it was the correct colour and had the correct name. 

[ModelerXYZ]

My guess is that Hornby originally used castle tooling because the loco is called Hogwarts Castle- despite the fact that the real loco being used for the films was a Hall.

XYZ

[anthony_ford]

I remember reading somewhere that when Hornby issued the first 'Philosophers Stone' sets, they didn't have a Hall loco in production as they had modified their Hall tooling to produce the Castle class.

I had also assumed that the mistake was largely due to the loco being called 'Hogwarts Castle'

[Going Spare]

Not quite corrrct.  The old Hall was introduced way back in 1966 and produced at Margate until 1983, never having been updated from using the X03 motor.  The Castle came to the Hornby stable from Dapol in 1996, having been created by Airfix in 1979, with a ringfield motor and more detailing.  Although a Hall locomotive was used for the films, Hornby's Castle only needed a repaint whereas the old Hall would have required a fair amount of updating to make it acceptable in 2001, and the new Hall was not launched until 2013.  

[The Doc]

Some time ago I owned a Hornby St David (I think it was) which was an attempt at the GWR Saint class.  Other versions included Clevedon Court.  I'm pretty sure the loco body was based on the old Hall dating from Triang days, but with an older Churchward (very open to the elements) cab and separately fitted handrails.  It was tender drive, with the tender and drive unit coming from the old County 4-4-0.

 

So the Hall body was adapted quite significantly, and the mouldings probably couldn't have been returned to representing a Hall class without some expense.  Given that the original was not particularly accurate anyway, using a readily available Castle instead seemed like a sensible cheaper option.  The earlier Hornby castle was based on the old Airfix Pendennis Castle, I believe, but with marginally improved chassis and loco drive - originally a ringfield motor (of Palitoy origins, I suspect) in the firebox, then later a much quieter Hornby can motor, with a lighter chassis that had traction tyres on one set of driving wheels. 

 

Apologies if I have made some mistakes here or misremembered something, but I have owned several GWR 4-6-0s over the years and they all tend to blur into one!