Hush Hush

[The son of Triangman]

I think the deflectors are very vulnerable, JJJ, the packing doesn't protect them enough or is too tight from what I have been told by friends. Overall we should congratulate Hornby on making this long forgotten star of steam. Once the QC issues, packing issues and transport issues are solved, Hornby have a winner.

[The son of Triangman]

A bit off subject, but Colin B made an interesting post.

"After watching the Hornby program especially the episode about Winston Churchill's funeral wagon, you do wonder if everything is being designed just to meet the requirements of someone in the model railway press".

This is interesting and needs discussing more, I have noticed the glossy magazines have lead the enthusiast by the nose over the years since they pushed for super detail models in the late 1990's. Is Hornby being lead by the glossy magazines for greater detail?

Considering the issues with the W1, are we starting to see models getting too fragile to use everyday? All power to Hornby for making a superb model, but have models reached their limit in terms of detail and fragility?

[ColinB]

Yes, I would agree with that. Some of the things they have done have improved the locos like the sprung front bogies. On my layout they have definitely improved running. Some of their modern locos are really good, Duchess and Princess Royal being really good runners, but a lot of the separately fitted parts quite often fall off when you pick the loco up or quite often when you are running it around the layout. According to the forums and Retailer experiences quite a number of them fall off in the box when delivered. Trouble is separately fitted, glue and production line don't mix that well, although having said that you don't hear the same complaints about Bachmann who must do the same.

[atom3624]

Bachmann seem to have a lot more, finer pipework as well, 'though I do notice quite a lot of their additional parts are metal, not just plastic, which makes them a bit more robust.

I love detail, but dislike the price hikes, and hate parts falling off, particularly receiving an apparently perfect locomotive to find a certain small part is missing. One of those nobody will ever notice, but you will every time you look at that locomotive!

I think that was one of the reasons for going 'full fat' Super Detail and Railroad branding.

Al.

[The son of Triangman]

I agree. I think Bachmann have their share of model issues to be honest, it's just not as publicly seen. Their 9F suffers from stripping gears and mazak rot for instance

Hornby are the limelight at present with the TV programs, alas being in the public eye means you are also in the firing line as well. Having run a big London PR agency for 12 years in the past, I know what a double edged sword being in the public eye can be.

Perhaps there needs to be a QC department at Margate again, so the duff models are minimised. It would save a lot of grief for buyer and Hornby alike.

[ColinB]

I think Hornby's issues are more than being in the Public Eye. I would say a fair proportion of their Customer Base bought their pre order models from two Retailers, Rails and Hattons so when they effectively desourced them they alienated their Customer base. Add to that in the case of Hattons the customer didn't find out until in some cases the model was released. Then there was the huge price hike 10%, now I can understand that everything has gone up so they had to do it, but now the customer expects a lot more, the model costs more than many "smart TVs". Then finally they mess things up by taking money out of the Customers credit card a whole two weeks before the article is delivered and when it is delivered the packaging is so poor that the £200+ loco is damaged. Most normal retailers would probably never recover from this, history is littered with them, read about the demise of BSA/Triumph, fortunately this is Hornby but if we look at many major brands that have failed even that is not always a guarantee.

[maw78]

I've just seen some sellers on a particular auction site trying to flog these models for 300 quid !!!! Wishful thinking given the known problems. Sam's trains I think said it wasnt worth the 220 trip.

[ColinB]

@maw78 yes but most people don't know. If you watched Barrie's YouTube video or the Welsh guy's one you would think that they are brilliant. They have level track and probably run it at a reasonable speed, the getting stuck on points only happens at low speed. Plus there are many people that just want an unusual model. From reading the RMWEB forum it appears Hornby have a special team on it, lets hope they do better with the next one.

[VESPA]

The more I have heard about the parts being damaged the more it looks like it is a combination of packaging of the actual loco into the clear plastic tray and the final delivery packaging. Think about the main parts getting broken. Smoke deflectors are being squeezed on putting it into the tray and breaking. Likewise another pinchpoint being the front steps if handled too tightly there. I had a slightly deformed piece of outer valve gear bent inward on one of my recent Clan purchases. That was easily fixed with a gentle reforming. I consider that as a pinchpoint at packaging being put in the plastic case and held too tightly at that point. Regarding the tender and the part getting broken off there, most likely done by forcing the fold over part of the inner packaging because of the speed they require items packed. I was under the impression final boxing up was done here in the UK to save transporting costs from China. I may be wrong. From what I have read about damage problems I think I may be right regaring pinchpoints.

[atom3624]

I suppose location has to 'grip' somewhere - call it a pinchpoint - but the support should be relatively uniform, to spread the load, minimise the effect.

Impacts should have been adequately cushioned - look at the Heljan, Dapol and Hattons big diesels of recent years - the clamshell ice box, inside foam, and additional polystyrene support where considered appropriate - never seen on Hornby packaging.

Al.

[ColinB]

I know on my one the front steps broke off just putting it back into the clear plastic tray and I am incredibly careful. I suspect I misaligned it as I let it sink in, so doing it at speed I can see how you can easily do it. Hornby has a thing with steps, the ones on Britannia tenders always seem to get caught and fall off.

[atom3624]

Hi CB, having said the front steps broke off, or one of them, was it a clean break - 'invisibly reparable'?

Reason I ask is perhaps they can be repositioned, and inset very slightly to avoid the loading gauge issues many seem to be having.

Al.

[ColinB]

It broke off just like the photographs you see taking a slight bit of the chassis with it. Invisible repair with a fraction of "Super Glue". To position them inwards I would have needed to break the other one off. Knowing my luck it would taken more of the chassis with it. They are so flimsy and stick out so far that is is a recipe for damage.

[Huwsie]

It's a shame. A model I was so looking forward to, but now I've cancelled my order because the complaints that are being made are consistent and mostly backed up with video on other websites, and I fear that I would just get someone else's troubled return.. I can't see models that are returned faulty being taken out of circulation / dis-assembled for much needed spares, as they indeed should be.

[CORKY.]

Maybe Hornby will plan a RAILROAD version. I like RAILROAD !.. very usable, not hangar queens.

[ace2507]

Well my Hush Hush finally arrived today, it was paid on the 6th December so just over three weeks for delivery, not all down to Hermes as it didn't show up as dispatched until the 14th. Strangely the packing slip says it should have gone to DPD but somehow it ended up with Hermes. Like others mine was packaged poorly with nothing to fill out the box. On opening the only damage I can see is a crack in one of the smoke deflectors, I've ran the model in and it runs well, nice and smooth with no excess noise. Now the dilemma do I send it back for repair of the smoke deflector or just put up with it, from a distance while running on the layout it is only just noticeable.

[VESPA]

I would be inclined to return it but it is unlikely you will get a replacement. I ordered an Oxford rail WW2 railgun and it had faults so I sent it back to Rails. (at my cost as I didn't realise they had a prepaid returns) I then went to Hattons and looked at 6 others and all had faults so decided that I would do without. That is the luck of the draw. If the crack doesn't bother you, keep it. The value in resale could be vastly reduced. For once I think that I was lucky as mine seems OK. No doubt on closer inspection something will show up faulty.blush

[atom3624]

£220 + P&P ?

I would return it.

If you're remotely like me - hope nobody is!! - then EVERY time you look at it, you'll be looking precisely where that broken smoke deflector is.

Didn't somebody mention there were new bodies being sent to Hornby - thought I'd read that somewhere on one of the forums - hope it's true, as they've stuffed up royally on this one!!

Al.

[Going Spare]

My advice would be to register your complaint with Customer Services, if emailing them attach a photograph, and ask for their advice as to what to do next. They must surely be putting in hand another run of bodies and, as you say yours is a good runner, if you feel confident enough to remove it, Hornby may be agreeable to your damaged loco body being returned by itself in exchange for a good one and save any potential damage to the rest of the loco during the two return journeys process. Give the whole loco a thorough look over before contacting them just in case any other defect comes to light.

[ColinB]

At £220+ it has got to be perfect, you will only regret it later. I agree with Going Spare, contact Hornby, if you fix it for them they save a packet in labour costs. I read on RMWEB that they have a separate team working on the issues.

[508006]

Just for information purposes, I checked out this loco on ebay and the prices are utterly ridiculous.

I noted prices of £300, £400, £500 & even 1 seller advertising the model for over £800. There is reference to the loco in 1 of Barrie Davies youtube videos where someone paid around £824 for the loco, absolutely stupid prices and the loco is not even a limited edition.

[ace2507]

Thanks for all the advice, I'll call Hornby tomorrow, I like the idea of them sending me a replacement body so hopefully they'll be willing to do that.

[ColinB]

I suppose if you really want one and you have tons of cash then paying over the odds doesn't worry you. From my point of view I wouldn't pay anymore than the recommended retail price, even then it is begrudged. I got mine for just under £200 as Hornby honoured their original price. The thing that does upset me is when Retailers do it, I know making a profit in these times is difficult, but you are fuelling inflation. It also gives Hornby a reason to hike the prices by another 10% as they think the market can stand it.

[Robbie-358546]

Well there are some intact ones out there, and in my opinion they are very fine examples of RTR art, for want of a better word. I have bought two of them at slightly below and slightly above RRP and will hopefully receive at least one here in NZ before Christmas. Not holding my breath though, with heavy parcels traffic at Heathrow and few flights.

It feels a bit like being a kid again, waiting for a present at Christmas. If one or both are damaged in transit, or were damaged when packed, I'll either fix or return.

[VESPA]

I think that you have some credible thoughts ColinB. These crazy RRP started to go daft when the likes of Rails and Hattons started in earnest to have specials made and the prices went over the £100 mark a few years back. Since then they are jumping £20 - £30 everytime a new model is introduced. Some have now gone over the £300 mark. It doesn't take much to realise that the main buyers are the silver surfers reliving their childhood of trainspotting etc. Earlier this year, I was determined to make the Hush Hush the last item I would buy. WRONG! I bought 2 Clans and the Churchill funeral Hearse (even though I have the earlier version released about 2-3 years back). Now I am determined to stop buying at these daft prices. Some coaches at £80 seems like a joke from a Christmas cracker. I agree there is a lot of prep for a model but making larger quantities would help keep prices down. There was a lack of supply of Sir William A Stanier with the crazy ebay prices for those. The Hush Hush is another under production and will now be even harder to get hold of with many faulty returns.