Sir Winston Churchill train pack

[Captain_Francisco.]

To return to the "Winston Churchill Funeral Set." I would definitely buy one, anniversary or no! A wonderful set of vehicles collectively or individually. Come on Hornby!

As a matter of interest apropos some earlier comments, I was under the impression

 

that although the "air smoothing" on the "spam cans" was 'spin doctored' to the general public as streamlining, the more practical, and real reason behind his thinking was ease, speed and thus cost savings, in cleaning in the postwar period.

[The son of Triangman]

Interestingly Tri-ang released a memorial coach that year as a limited edition. The GWR clerestory was given a black banding and different number. I have a mint boxed example in the collection.

 

You are correct Captain Francisco the "spam cans" were

 

"air-smoothed" primarily to go through carriage washing plants on the Southern to cut down on cleaning labour.

[The son of Triangman]

The weakness of the spam cans in un-rebuilt form was the chain drive to the middle cylinder arrangement. There were many instances of spam cans catching on fire and local fire brigades having to come out, remove the casing and putting the fires out. The

 

lagging of the boilers used to get sprayed with oil from the oil bath of the chain drives, seals on the oil baths were renown for leaking. On paper the space and money saving chain drive system was good but ini the real work was greatly lacking. That said

 

the "spam cans" were great machines with a superb boiler.

[LCDR]

It was said that OVSB wanted to reduce maintenance and preparation time needed to oil round three independent sets of valve gear and by enclosing the middle engine in an oil bath, in theory at least, lubrication and maintenance period would be significantly

 

extended, and be carried out by fitters and not by drivers.

 

He also wanted to use rotary valve gear, for very much the same reason, but the War prevented him obtaining the necessary parts. Chains were much easier to source so he designed a valve gear

 

to do what he needed using chains and as he already had the oil bath, it was the logical place to put it. After all exactly the same principle was used in internal combustion engines, very successfully, he just scaled it up.

 

As it turned out the conditions

 

under a steam engine were far more severe than under the bonnet of an HGV, and it suffered greater stresses and vibration, which allowed oil to leak out of the bath, and the proximity of the ash pan provided a ready ignition source. The boiler cladding as

 

SoT points out, being soaked in oil acted as a splendid wick.

 

Jarvis' rebuilds from 1956 onwards got rid of both these weaknesses and created what are arguably the finest modern steam passenger locomotives of all time in the UK.

 

[LCDR]

The Winston Churchill commemorative set in 2015 is a rather good idea, but let us not also forget that it will also be the 75th anniversary of 'Their Finest Hour' an event that is not unconnected.

 

Once the hoo-ha of Mallard 75 is out of the way,

 

this may well be the next important anniversary.

[walkingthedog]

When you say next important anniversary I take it you are referring to railways. If not I think next year overshadows everything else.

[LCDR]

walkingthedog said:

When you say next important anniversary I take it you are referring to railways. If not I think next year overshadows everything else.

I am guessing you refer to the outbreak of the Great War, 100 years

ago, which I agree is a very important date but with only oblique railway importance. I do however acknowledge the extreme effect and contribution that railways had on the War, but its outbreak was more to do with a political spat in the Balkans than a railway

event.

My intention was to link the passing of Winston with the speech made by him in praise of the RAF who gallantly fought against overwhelming forces to defend our little island.

[walkingthedog]

Yes I thought you were referring to railways.

 

The reason the Great War started is immaterial. It did start and the outcome was horrific. Although there are events planned to commemorate the start I think it should be low key and 1919 should be the

 

year for celebration in 2019.

[poliss]

1919?

[walkingthedog]

June 1919 Treaty of Versailles signed ending the war. 11 Nov 1918 was only an armistice. Lots of military personnel died between those dates.

[poliss]

If you're going by peace treaties and not the Armistice then surely you'd have to include the later ones?

[walkingthedog]

I'm not going to argue poliss but as a member of The Western Front Association we all look at 1919 as the end of WW1. A lot of memorials say 1914-1919.

 

Lots of treaties were signed but the Versailles treaty is the one that is considered as the end.

[poliss]

My grandad was in the trenches, but he wasn't in The Western Front Association. He used to tell me horror stories about what happened.

[malB]

Of course there is tale that Sir Winston knowing full well he was to get the "Full State" send off when he died insisted [with no doubt a wicked twinkle in his eye] that his train leave London for Handborough [for Bleinham Palace] from Waterloo rather

 

than the operationally more convienant Paddington. If that is he passed away before President former General De Gaulle of France, thus rubbing the French leader up the wrong way by having to stand to attention whilst, waving "Winny" off from Waterloo.....

 

Mind you "Winny" said if De Gaulle was to pass first "they" could send the funneral train from where ever!

 

What ever you think/thought of the man he had a "wicked" sense of Humour to the end.......

[walkingthedog]

poliss said:

My grandad was in the trenches, but he wasn't in The Western Front Association. He used to tell me horror stories about what happened.

I guess he was an honorary member. We had a couple once. One was Bill Stone the

last survivor from the RN.

[Postman Prat]

 

As a 'spin off' from WW1 don't forget we stuck our noses into the war between the White Russians and the Bolsheviks, which took place in 1919. There was even a VC awarded for events connected to this conflict.

 

[mortehoe]

I said to a few Forum members, who I have great respect for that I would keep ( or at least try ) to keep off this thread.

Hornby are not going to make any form of set to commemorate this person.

Any body who can put his name to :

1. Seagulls

 

being trained to POOH on periscopes in Poole harbour.

2. Fast launches that carry " Olympic swimmers", armed with a muslin bag and hammer, so they can be dropped off and swim to the periscope and break the optics in the periscope.

Oh dear.

 

As

 

for his plan for Battleships to shell workers houses in Liverpool, and Glasgow during the General Strike, well hang your heads in shame Hornby even if you think about releasing that engine again.

Time has moved on, and more and yet more truth is out.

I

 

only hope that my Grandfather, was no longer on HMS Queen Elizabeth at the time of the strike, she was supposed to aiming on Glasgow.

[mortehoe]

I promise I will now keep off this particular thread. Sorry guys take your Rose Tinted Glasses off, do some digging. Not one of you will convince other wise, I found out too much.

[LCDR]

Post a new reply...

[Kelvin9]

I have got all coaches plus luggage van just have to get the loco thanks to all for there input

[The son of Triangman]

Kelvin9 said:

 

"went to have a look they will not post to new zealand, why do so many people in the uk hate new zealand"

 

I don't think it's hate of NZ, it's just down to bad experiences of shipping to Aus and NZ, myself and the rest of the

 

family in the business sell the odd item on the site mentioned and have been ripped off by overseas buyers from Aus and NZ, so won't sell to those countries now.

 

If you want a Winston Churchill and can put up with a more cruder model detail wise, Tri-ang

 

and Tri-ang-Hornby made them and they appear on that site.

[Kelvin9]

Have got Winston Churchill funeral train and DCC fitted took awhile to get it all together but looks great,

[Bulleidboy]

Well done.

[kevin_composer]

bulleidboy said:

I'm not sure whether there would be enough interest to make this commercially viable. With a bit of searching around you can almost make up the original train. The loco often appears on that well known auction site, the luggage

van was produced by Hornby fairly recently, and will still be available. I recall from a previous thread that only one coach has not been produced - all the others have appeared in one set or another. If you 'google' the original event, there is a lot of information

available.

[kevin_composer]

Unfortunately Hornby don't model any 1951/2 Pullmans nor those converted with square lavatory windows to match so funeral train not authentically possible. Pullman coaches can't simply be renamed, there are many variations.