New Motor Questions

[Nathan-88675]

Hi there, I got my son two second hand sets and its been great fun but I have had a problem with one car shorting the track ( Mecedes AMG GT3) its out of warranty and I cant see anything wrong with the wiring inside and Ive changed the braids multiple times so I think something is probably wrong with the the motor or at least its worth trying a new motor at this point.

So I was going to replace with this one from scalextric website : https://uk.scalextric.com/products/motor-pack-side-winder-5mm-shaft-c8146

But a few questions -

1. Is it the right size , what does 35mm refer to https://uk.scalextric.com/products/motor-pack-side-winder-5mm-shaft-c8146
2. Can i get it cheaper elsewhere? ( ebay?)
3. And can i get a slower motor?

My son is six and we slow the cars down with the arc air app but be nice to play without app sometimes. Or would I be better ro fit a stronger magnet? WHere can you get magnets?

Sorry for all the questions!

Thanks!

[Andy P.]

Hi Nathan and welcome

Before replacing the motor be sure it is indeed faulty.

Use a 9 volt battery to see if it moves at all.

If you are technically savvy snip the wires and run power to the motor directly from the 9 volt battery.

If it doesn't move or the battery gets hot it is indeed broken.

The 35 mm refer to the length of the shaft protruding out of the can. Some cars require longer ones (for example a rear wheel driven car that has the motor in the front) or shorter ones (an angle winder car needing tire clearance) but most are the standard 35 mm

So to you question 1: This is likely the correct fit

As for number 2: Probably. These are fairly common motors sometimes called 13D or 130 and usually around 10,000 rpms. There are lots of suppliers around. In fact you might be able to get a slower one for your ...

Question 3: You could get a slower motor.

There are stronger magnets usually made of rare Earth metals. They can be bought online at auction sites or with slot car suppliers.

This will cause the motors to get hotter though and prolonged (i.e. hours) of use may even cause them to burn up

Some of the strong magnets are very small and round and you could drill a hole in the chassis and press and glue (hot glue is good as it can be removed with alcohol). You could, for example, mount them near the outside of the car so that they grab when the car slides and not all the time.

This will help keep the motors running cooler.

ARC AIR does not have an APP -free way of slowing the cars down I am afraid. There are other options with the standard power bases as the newest controllers have pwoer settings in them or if they are older you can restrict the power going to the rails etc.

Good luck!

[Nathan-88675]

Hi Nathan and welcome

Before replacing the motor be sure it is indeed faulty.

Use a 9 volt battery to see if it moves at all.

If you are technically savvy snip the wires and run power to the motor directly from the 9 volt battery.

If it doesn't move or the battery gets hot it is indeed broken.

The 35 mm refer to the length of the shaft protruding out of the can. Some cars require longer ones (for example a rear wheel driven car that has the motor in the front) or shorter ones (an angle winder car needing tire clearance) but most are the standard 35 mm

So to you question 1: This is likely the correct fit

As for number 2: Probably. These are fairly common motors sometimes called 13D or 130 and usually around 10,000 rpms. There are lots of suppliers around. In fact you might be able to get a slower one for your ...

Question 3: You could get a slower motor.

There are stronger magnets usually made of rare Earth metals. They can be bought online at auction sites or with slot car suppliers.

This will cause the motors to get hotter though and prolonged (i.e. hours) of use may even cause them to burn up

Some of the strong magnets are very small and round and you could drill a hole in the chassis and press and glue (hot glue is good as it can be removed with alcohol). You could, for example, mount them near the outside of the car so that they grab when the car slides and not all the time.

This will help keep the motors running cooler.

ARC AIR does not have an APP -free way of slowing the cars down I am afraid. There are other options with the standard power bases as the newest controllers have pwoer settings in them or if they are older you can restrict the power going to the rails etc.

Good luck!

 

 

[Nathan-88675]

Hi Andy and thanks for your comprehensive reply

At first I thought the power short was dirt on track but after a while I realised that out of the 4 cars we have its always the Mercedes that causes the problem. It works for a while then intermittent power shorts occur requiring on off power supply to get going again. Its been hardly used so im presuming its a faulty motor from new. The motor itself turns when not shorting the track! I could try your suggestion to see if it gets hot for sure.

Are you sure about the 35mm protruding? thats 3.5cm! Rough measurement of protruding shaft on this car is 10mm with the pinion about half way along.

Regarding magnets i guess i will have to experiment. We have 4 cars: the Mercedes AMG GT3 and Ford GTE are fast and come off the track easily on full power but two other cars we have are Team GT and Team endurance fictional cars and these are much easier to drive. I guess its just different strength magnets then?

Thanks again

[Andy P.]

You are right.. the 35 mm is in regards to the length of the motor including shaft...

I see you have an inline motor and not a sidewinder.

The shaft might be longer on the inliner...

Could you take a picture of the all the wires and the motor?

Something looks a bit odd but I am not 100% sure...

[Nathan-88675]

Gotcha that makes sense 35mm seems the size I would need,

Here's some picture hopefully shows some detail

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Andy P.]

Ahh.. it's a DPR (digital plug ready) car... that is the little white plug behind the front axle.

Do the lights work on the car?

The green and yellow cables at the front look backwards (but that could just be that model).

Does turned the guide 180° or connecting the battery the other way around make a difference?

On the back of the motor there is a "ferritte man" the little round, orange thing.

If the "legs" touch the bod of the motor it will short out.

Slide a piece of electrical insulation tape under the legs to make sure they are not touching the metal can body.

Double check the red and black wires at the back aren't rubbing on the rear axle.

If you have the time, patience and equipment, you can unplug the white plug and check for continuity (Ohms) and then try to power the motor directly from there as well...

[Nathan-88675]

Thanks again

The lights did work on the car, but its got to the point now where as soon as I put the car on track and apply power the PB shorts instantly. (It was shorting the PB intermittently before this latest development!) I dont want to damage the PB so im not going to test it on track anymore!

Motor works with 9v battery

Not sure what you mean by turning the guide 180, wouldnt doing this or swapping the wires just make the motor run in reverse?

I cant see any wires touching or touching the motor (made sure about the ferritte man)

No rubbing on axle either

The closest thing to touching is the solder on the wires coming of the motor with the orange resistor? but its not touching, just close with not wire shrink

When I get a chance i will take it to my friend who can test the car a bit more like you suggest.

[Nathan-88675]

ps . our three other cars are working like a dream thankfully!

[Andy P.]

Well things do expand with heat (except water!) so maybe it is heating up and touching.

To be honest though, I think you have a problem in the light board that.

Best to try and get a replacement I think.

You can contact where you got it or contact Hornby directly.

Yes turning things 180° will make the motor run in reverse in analog mode but in digital mode it shouldn't as they run on AC and not DC. I forgot the car is not chipped yet so your observation is of course correct..

[Nathan-88675]

OK that could make sense if the ligthtboard is faulty I guess I could try just bypassing the board? I dont know much about electronics but I have used a soldering iron for RC cars in the past so should be ok!

I got the two sets second hand so I don't know if Scalextric would be of help? The set had been hardly used, the cars were like new with spoilers intact (this didntlast long with us lol).

[Andy P.]

I am also a but all thumbs and dumb as a brick when it comes to some electrics and electronics so I result to mimicking things I know work. If you have a car without lights you can see how it is wired and just copy that.

The worst thing Hornby would say is "No" so i reckon it is worth asking!

[Nathan-88675]

Update!

I finaly got around to trying to replace the motor, I had already orderd two cheap used motores from ebay before you suggested getting in touch with Hornby. So anyway the new motor seems to have solved all the problems. I soldered it in as a direct replacement , leaving all of the wiring and lights in place.

The stock motor I took out seems to have completely stopped working now!( tested using 9vbattery) So was obviously on the way out and shorting itself some how.

Thanks for all the advice and I have ordered some small round magnets from ebay to play around with hot gluing in place to improve/change handling.

Insidently the new motor that I have installed in the Mercedes seems to be slightly slower and the car is now a dream to drive without the need to reduce the power via the app.hugging_face

[Andy P.]

Glad to hear it!

[Paul-346202]

Taking the magnets out is a great way to slow things down. Unfortunately Scalextic cars don't run well without magnets so you either have to heavily modify them or buy cars that will run without magnets.

Glad you have sorted your motor issue, did you manage to get the pinion gear off okay? You normally use a pinion puller tool to get these off. Your ability to control the cars will be limited by the hand throttle you use. An aftermarket controller will give more control than a Scalextric throttle.

Hot glue the motor in place, I would glue and true the tyres, varnish the front tyres and float the bodies. The GT3 Mercedes are pretty fast cars if you fancy modifying them with slot.it axle and tyres in the future (probably not worth it on a small home track).

[LesD]

I too have the World GT Arc Air set and my Ford GT GTE car has stopped working. I’ve traced the problem to the motor.

but when looking for a replacement there is nothing on the Scalextric Shop that looks anything like it. See photos.

in fact the closest I’ve found is on Amazon and it’s described as a Scalextric motor bike motor!

is the case I would just have to try it an see if it works.

after checking the sizes are very similar of course.

Otherwise use the car as a donor car for future repairs?

[Andy P.]

When the Ford GT came out there was a lot of hub-bub that it has what I think is called a "thin can" motor which has a higher RPM but less torque than the standard motor which I think is called 13D or Mabuchi (I could be wrong).

I do in fact think the motorbike motor is the same.

Someplace like Pendles or Jadlam should be able to clear this up though.

I am not endorsing them just saying they are likely a good source...

[LesD]

Thanks Andy, certainly the motor is long and thin rather than square which is what most others look like.

I do shop at Jadlam and Pendles and you are correct, also helpful.

[LesD]

I got the *motorbike* motor off the well known online forest site and it was a perfect fit, apart from I moved the pinion gear slightly to ensure a good mesh.

car fixed and runs well.