RivaRossi and Jouef CIWL (Compagnie Internationale des Wagons-Lits) cars

[Fred-377206]

For many years RivaRossi and later Jouef made very nice and detailed CIWL cars like sleepers, restaurants, Pullmans and baggage cars. They also make these cars available in sets with names like The Blue Train or The Etoile du Nord. Does anyone know why these trains always have a wrong consist, i.e. a wrong configuration of cars? One would assume it must be possible to find out the correct consist when configuring a set.

Regards

Fred

[Rallymatt]

Are you certain they were ‘always’ wrong? My time in the hobby and in life generally is that although there maybe a perceived specification there are always examples where things ran differently, and someone usually pops up with a photo! In case of CIWL stock and trains (I’m not claiming to be an expert) but they were often a varied mix and sections added/removed as a train made its way to particular destinations. Model companies will also try to utilise the stock they already make so a certain amount of ‘modelling licence’ does creep in

[Fred-377206]

Maybe I should have written "in general "instead of "always" because out of sheer luck a consist could be right. I understand that model companies try to utulise stock they alraedy make, but that should not be a reason to falsify history.

By the way: I am a bit of a CIWL expert and can judge right or wrong CIWL consists. I would not know whether other, non CIWL, sets that are made are correct or not.

Regards

Fred

[LTSR_NSE]

@fred - surely when historical train (not locomotive) names are used on train sets, it is done to evoke nostalgia (in adults) or delight & wonder (in children) rather than to ‘falsify history’?

Especially when sets (usually) contain a company’s most competitively priced selection of products - they naturally will be more interested in including their most popular/sold items, rather than items which (may be more prototypical but also) attract a premium price if only sold separately!

[Rallymatt]

I’d love CIWL stock in TT:120 for High Fell to run the International Through service of the Ports Express between Tyne and Liverpool Docks…all entirely fictional but inspired by All Ports Service and it ‘could have maybe ish’ run 🤣

[ellocoloco]

@LT - The sets Fred (I think) is referring to are certainly not 'value' set products. I don't think there are any CIWL equivalents of the Hornby Pullmans which are of different spec when included in trains sets. If you have a look at the Jouef Blue Train 3 coach set at £225, this is what Fred is meaning.

@fred - Who knows why they get them wrong but I imagine given the period these coaches operated the consists would change yearly or monthly as traffic patterns and maintenance schedules were accommodated. I would also half expect someone in R&D to look at the sleeper/diner/fourgon, pick a running number that fits the model and press 'go' for production without looking too closely as to what the vehicle actually did in its life.

You are lucky though - for the Electrotren RENFE Al-Andalus set, they just took the CIWL coaches and gave them a respray with no thought as to the modifications built into the actual rolling stock. This was particularly annoying as the same year Hornby announced the LMS Coronation coaches which were produced as accurate models of the individual wagons. I held off getting the Al-Andalus set because of this, but eventually gave in. Do'h!

(Edit: Fred, can you have a look at the two Electrotren CIWL Sud Expreso sets, HE4027 & HE4028 that have just been announced for 2024 and please let me know, if possible, how accurate these are?)