bruce_johnson Posted January 24, 2020 Share Posted January 24, 2020 I have got the Centenary Rocket on order as I used to have the original Triang (no Hornby) one with smoke. I also like the 9F, I have the Bachmann version and the latest weathered Hornby Crosti version, both of which are exquisit models; the hornby one does lack a little detail, but to be honest it does not notice too much with the weathering, and for the money it was great value.I have been looking at the Centenary Evening Star to go with the others. The thing is with the Rocket there is new tooling, but looking at the Evening Star it seems to be the old Triang Hornby version albeit with I believe loco drive instead of the original tender drive. Can anyone confirm, or otherwise, this?As an aside but still related. I wonder which would pull the biggest train the P2 or the 9F. I set up an oval of track on my dinnig table (with an 8x4 board on top) and added all my teak and Pullman coaches. The P2 pulled all 18 coaches without a hitch. There was maybe enough room to add one or two more coach but this would have left only inches between the front of the loco and back of the train. When I tried this on the back of the Backmann Evening Star the wheels turned but the train hardly moved. It did though pull all 11 of my mk1 coaches without a problem. I have yet to try it with more and the other 9F with good wagons. May start another thread on this topic (or find one allready in existance). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NWR-Gordon-4 Posted January 24, 2020 Share Posted January 24, 2020 The way to get the most accurate answer, will be to contact Hornby Hobbies yourself. Very few people here will know the answer, due to the product not being released yet, so a model cannot be inspected. GNR-Gordon-4 (HF) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Howbi Posted January 24, 2020 Share Posted January 24, 2020 According to the Collector magazine "The Triang Hornby class 9F Evening Star forms an important part of Hornby's history which is why it has been included in the Centenary Collection" and is fitted with the 5 pole motor in the locomotive.........HB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bruce_johnson Posted January 24, 2020 Author Share Posted January 24, 2020 Thanks howbiman. I've only just joined the club so have not had sight of the Collector Magazine yet. I'll make do with the 9Fs I already have then.Cheers againBJ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ruffnut Thorston Posted January 24, 2020 Share Posted January 24, 2020 The original Tri-ang Hornby Evening Star tooling has since been modified for the China made models. The valve gear, wheels, rods are all different. The handrails and regulator rods are now all separate wire parts. Basically, the "Centenary" model is to be the Railroad version, but with enhanced, better, lining and printed details. I'm not sure if it features etched name plates... Also included is a reproduction of the commemorative plaque fitted on the original below the name plates, recalling the fact that this was the last steam locomotive built for British Railways. It's not the "makers plate", as I think some descriptions say... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JeremiahBunyan Posted January 25, 2020 Share Posted January 25, 2020 Hornby's current BR 9F is actually a greatly improved version. It's definitely far better than the Triang-Hornby one. TBH the current Hornby BR 9F is a re-tool (not recently though). It has the following features:-- fine more accurate connecting rods- wire handrails- flush glazing- loco-drive- profiled wheels- loco and tender pickups- wire handrails- newly tooled loco body and tender- DCC ready with an 8-pin DCC socket- NEM couplings- sprung buffers- higer spec paint application There's images below to show you the differences. /media/tinymce_upload/71427531c22098f2b70f76bf3a1c5a70.jpg /media/tinymce_upload/609375993f2fff0b630b98cb07ad5a53.jpg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JeremiahBunyan Posted January 25, 2020 Share Posted January 25, 2020 The hornby one does lack a little detail. This is because the Hornby BR 9F and the Franco-Crosti 9F are both railroad models, lower spec models. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LCDR Posted January 25, 2020 Share Posted January 25, 2020 There is an argument that says that much of the extra fine details of some of the models sold nowadays, can be a nuisance because with handling it can drop off or become damaged or distorted. The model is really only suitable for showcase use, assuming you can get it out of the packaging without damaging it. Certainly our long standing and experienced friend Son of Triangman was quite vociferous about this, and with good reason. RailRoad models are specifically designed for using rather than sitting behind glass looking pretty, but are excellent representations and will stand a bit of owner enhancement if desired. Things like seperate hand rails and accurate lining and lettering enhance the later models in that range . Hornby has to walk the tightrope between reliability and robustness and detailed accuracy, and in my opinion do this remarkably well. Their models are well proportioned and accurate, something that was hard to find in bygone years. The 9F specifically looks good at 'normal viewing distance' and yet I have confidence that I can place it on my layout and it will run faultlessly. Something that cannot always be said for models from other manufacturers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
walkingthedog Posted January 25, 2020 Share Posted January 25, 2020 I'm not sure why the Crosti is Railroad as they have a lot of fine detail. I have two Crosti's, Evening Star, plus an ordinary Hornby and Bachmann 9F. I have to look at the tender coupling to see which black 9F is Hornby and which is Bachmann as they look the same detail wise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
atom3624 Posted January 25, 2020 Share Posted January 25, 2020 I'm with you on that WtD. Main difference for me is the RHS below cab pipework. (Avatar time?) Al. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bruce_johnson Posted January 25, 2020 Author Share Posted January 25, 2020 Thanks for that JB, I had managed to work out it wasn't the original Triang Hornby with loco drive. Although this was not obvious from reading the blurbl. By contrast the Rocked was listed as new tooling. I must admit to having to re-stick (more than once) some of the extra detailing on my Bachmann Evening Star. That said one cannot keep buying 9Fs, can one? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
walkingthedog Posted January 25, 2020 Share Posted January 25, 2020 Yes you can. The more the merrier. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LCDR Posted January 25, 2020 Share Posted January 25, 2020 Ah well there were 251 of them so if you like them enough ................... 😆 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JJ73 Posted January 25, 2020 Share Posted January 25, 2020 @ J. B. :- Is it me or are the wheels on the older version in the photo smaller than the photo of the newer version??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
walkingthedog Posted January 25, 2020 Share Posted January 25, 2020 Wheels are the same size, I think the angle of the photo makes them look different. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JJ73 Posted January 25, 2020 Share Posted January 25, 2020 Ok then - it's me then - just wondered - thank you 😀 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
walkingthedog Posted January 25, 2020 Share Posted January 25, 2020 No I agree they do look different, it's picture trickery Jj. 😉 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NWR-Gordon-4 Posted January 25, 2020 Share Posted January 25, 2020 I own Hornby Thomas & Friends R9684 Murdoch, which uses the Hornby RailRoad Class 9F tooling and the detail on him is excellent. It's amazing that it is a RailRoad model to be honest with you. The Hornby RailRoad range models are supposed to be have less detail and are supposed to be less delicate, but I doubt there's mich difference detail wise to the Hornby standard range Class 9F tooling and the RailRoad model. I expect there is a difference, but it can't be much, I am sure. GNR-Gorodn-4 (HF) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JJ73 Posted January 26, 2020 Share Posted January 26, 2020 Oh ok Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JeremiahBunyan Posted January 26, 2020 Share Posted January 26, 2020 I'm not sure why the Crosti is Railroad as they have a lot of fine detail. I have two Crosti's, Evening Star, plus an ordinary Hornby and Bachmann 9F. I have to look at the tender coupling to see which black 9F is Hornby and which is Bachmann as they look the same detail wise. Absolutely agree with that. My vote goes to Hornby as their general 9F releases are cheaper than the blue box brand. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JeremiahBunyan Posted January 26, 2020 Share Posted January 26, 2020 @ J. B. :- Is it me or are the wheels on the older version in the photo smaller than the photo of the newer version??? The wheels on the front pony truck are smaller, the driving wheels are the same size. They look smaller overall because in the good old days there was a broader and bigger steel tyre fitted on smaller and chunkier plastic inserts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LCDR Posted January 26, 2020 Share Posted January 26, 2020 Hornby has been a bit clever recently, I suspect as a spin off from the 'Design Clever; phase. The latest version of the Mark 1 carriage which were introduced originally into the RailRoad range are extremely good models with flush glazing, and accurate detail. These are comparable to the models of the same vehicles made by other manufacturers which have seperately fitted handrails and water pipes and such like, whereas Hornby's are moulded on, but from 'normal viewing distance' it is difficult to tell the difference. The 9F is in the same category. Where it matters the boiler handrails and regulator rod are seperate fittings, but the other pipework and the smokebox dart for example are moulded on. You do have to look carefully to see the difference with the more expensive product from the other manufacturer. It all boils down to whether you want a showcase model or something you can run on your layout which looks right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JeremiahBunyan Posted January 26, 2020 Share Posted January 26, 2020 Hornby has to walk the tightrope between reliability and robustness and detailed accuracy, and in my opinion do this remarkably well. Their models are well proportioned and accurate. Once again I wholeheartedly agree with this. When it comes to working model trains, Hornby in my opinion have nailed the level of detail. As much as I love manufacturers trying to break barriers in terms of detail, it does end up making models more and more fragile for use. One of the reasons Hornby remains to be one of my favourite manufacturers is because of their balance in detail, varied range, availability of most things you need to build a model railway, 21 years of reliable serivce to me and excellent customer care. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JeremiahBunyan Posted January 26, 2020 Share Posted January 26, 2020 Hornby has been a bit clever recently, I suspect as a spin off from the 'Design Clever; phase. The latest version of the Mark 1 carriage which were introduced originally into the RailRoad range are extremely good models with flush glazing, and accurate detail. These are comparable to the models of the same vehicles made by other manufacturers which have seperately fitted handrails and water pipes and such like, whereas Hornby's are moulded on, but from 'normal viewing distance' it is difficult to tell the difference. The 9F is in the same category. Where it matters the boiler handrails and regulator rod are seperate fittings, but the other pipework and the smokebox dart for example are moulded on. You do have to look carefully to see the difference with the more expensive product from the other manufacturer. It all boils down to whether you want a showcase model or something you can run on your layout which looks right. IIRC the Mk1 coaches originated from the "Design-Clever" era. I was personally a fan of that. I know I am in a minority, but I prefer my locos looking right than falling apart. I believe the Mk2E is also from the same era. The Mk2F from Hornby does have a couple of etched parts. I hope Hornby can update thei Mk4 coaches and a Mk.4 DVT to modern standards with a bit of the "Design-Clever" treatment also. They are afterall fairly plain coaches on the exterior. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ruffnut Thorston Posted January 26, 2020 Share Posted January 26, 2020 There is no "main range" Hornby 9f. 😉 Apart from the 1:1 Collection Limited Edition, and the Centenary Edition, (as I did say way back at the beginning of this thread!) all are Railroad now, and all use the same tooling, which is basically a modified version of the original Tri-ang Hornby tooling. The Hornby 9f did start out as main range, but was moved to Railroad, I think about the time that Bachmann released their 9f. The main difference with the Railroad version of Evening Star is the simplified lining. The plain black version current in the Railroad range doesn't have any lining to simplify... If you have an older China made tender drive 9f, it's simple to swap the loco and tender bodies with a Railroad model, to get the DCC ready loco drive chassis. The original chassis can be fitted with the Railroad loco and tender bodies, and sold on to recoup some of the Railroad purchase price! The same applies to a lot of the Railroad Locomotives. As they use slightly modified old tools, the new chassis can be used with older, better lined, tender drive bodies. These include the Midland Compound, LNER Shire/ Hunt, GWR County 4-4-0, and probably the Railroad (not main range) SR Schools, with the earlier tender drive models. (We have done the 9f, and the first three 4-4-0 locos, but don't have any Schools locos...) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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