Re-Paint & Decals.

[Puffed Out]

I have 2 engines in Green. GWR.  I am thinking about repainting then Black(BR).

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Could you experts guide me to somewhere for the paint and appropriate decals etc.

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Thanks from @Puffed Out.

[walkingthedog]

Modelmaster and Fox to name but two for transfers etc. 

Are you brush painting or spraying?

[LCDR]

BR painted both goods and mixed traffic locomotives black, but the mixed traffic classes received lining in the old London and North Western Railway style. This was thin lines of grey, cream and red painted in a panel on the side of tenders, cab side and tank sides. Boiler barrel bands were also given a pair of thin red lines.  Modelmaster and Fox transfers amongst others make appriopriate transfers for lining.

 

Goods only locomotives were painted plain black. The buffer beam of all locomotives was painted red. 

 

The locomotive number was usually on the side of the cab, although on tank engines it could go on the bunker. Former GWR locomotives continued to display their number on cast metal plates.

 

A British Railways emblem was provided on the side of a tender, or for tank engines on the side of the tanks. You can buy transfers for these too. It needs to be as close to centrally on the tender or tank as possible. 

 

This is an example of a GWR goods engine in BR black,

 

/media/tinymce_upload/83f38c303c9dd8c925c97c79343ba7c2.JPG

 

This is an example of mixed traffic lining, but this time on a LMSR design.

 

/media/tinymce_upload/59106f92e7006dbedfb294e1c2088cce.JPG

 

[Puffed Out]

@WTD, LC&DR.

 

I'd like something in between hand painting and spraying.  Spray is preferable, and possibly work it a bit to get the desired effect.

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Now that I can see the images it makes it a whole lot easier to do the right thing.

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I've also bought a Black 5 ,a 4-6-0  LMS.  The finish on that is great.

 

Thank's very much for the hints and tips.  I'm really greatful. 😆

[Lyd 85B]

You may find it preferable to use a gloss black aerosol, especially if applying lining, which gives the ideal surface for decals to attach to, finished off with a light dusting of matt varnish for the smokebox and satin varnish for the body. If you do unlined black, you can use satin black aerosol (from Halfords) and just gloss varnish where the decals go then finish the whole panel with satin varnish. Be sure to allow the decals to dry thoroughly before varnishing (at least 24 hours). Transfers and etched cabside and smokebox plates from Fox, and aerosol varnishes from Humbrol are excellent, in my experience.   

[Puffed Out]

@Lyd.

Thanks very much for that. 😀

 

This will be a first for me, so all the info I gather, the better the job I make of it.

[walkingthedog]

I have used Humbrol spray cans. Very good but spraying improves with practice.

[LMSFan72]

In addition to the other good advice I would suggest:

• remove any existing numbers/markings - they will be slightly proud under the new paint if you leave them. If on a flat surface I would use very fine abrasive paper (3000 grit) with something like t-cut
• wash off residue (and all dust etc from the body) with warm water
• apply a light coat of primer - I too would go Halford aerosol. It doesn't need to go on thick, just enough to provide a key surface
• Let it dry
• apply a very light coat of black. Keep the can moving from a sensible distance so you don't pool the paint on detail
• let it dry
• apply another light coat
• continue until you are happy with an even coverage

note that it's very easy to hide details so several light coats from different angles.

 

make sure you blow out the nozzle between coats as per can isnstructions

[Puffed Out]

All very good advice, so thank you everyone. 😀

I'm not adverse to using spray cans, but usually on much larger items. 

[walkingthedog]

I usually use a brush.

[96RAF]

I'd like something in between hand painting and spraying. 

 

Stupidly I can only think of dipping the model in a tin of paint. No other options spring to mind.

[Simmo009]

May I suggest hunting on auction sites for some cheap spare bodies so you can practice before you have a mishap on your pride and joy.

[Puffed Out]

@RAF96.

Sounds like a case of powder coating gone mad.

My point was,(as you may have guessed), .....is Immaculate as against a rubbish finish.  Not saying either isn't hard to get, nor as simple as it seems, with brush or spray.

As an experiment, I could try your suggestion and see how it turns out. 😀

 

@null_null98.

I have enough spares to try already.  Good point though, and well recieved.

[walkingthedog]

If you use a brush it must be a good one and it must be a new tin of paint.

[96RAF]

I had brush painted a Class 37 with enalmels and it showed the brush marks whereas a rebuilt Coronation was Halfords rattle can sprayed (primer and topcoat) and was much better.

EG.

/media/tinymce_upload/491c9398cea01215a09a78c25c2a023b.JPG

 

Versus

/media/tinymce_upload/10b903b8bc620be548f1a17faee7d63e.jpg

 

You can practice on anything you have laid around. It doesn't have to be a loco. Buy a cheap plastic car from a pound shop to practice on.

[SteveM6]

@Puffed out can I suggest that you undertake as much research and reading as possible before you attempt a repaint - it is nowhere near as easy (or quick) as many think.

The right materials and decent equipment are vital for the success of the project and even the best worker will struggle to match a factory finish. IMHO aerosols are not fine enough for this work, they can apply too thickly and obscure detail.

When researching don’t restrict yourself to this forum as many of the others have dedicated techniques sections which may be of help.

Finally, I know I said I was leaving this forum but I have been watching from the sidelines and felt I had to add to this particular debate.

[Puffed Out]

Absolutely.  The more info the better. @SteveM6

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Another point, if I may say, is why leave a Forum when you have something to add.  You don't have to agree with anyone, nor everyone, nor share points if view. 

Everyone has something to contribute, however large or small. 

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As you may have guessed already, I'm an old git, and just started on the road with Hornby. (Albeit, after a 55 odd year break from a 1 year ownership). So any info I can glean, is always helpful.

[SteveM6]

Another point, if I may say, is why leave a Forum when you have something to add.  You don't have to agree with anyone, nor everyone, nor share points if view. 

Not wishing to open an old debate or take your thread off-topic but unfortunately the useful tips and advice were masked by other ‘less useful’ posts but hopefully the mods now have this under control.

 

Returning to your original question, I have some experience of repainting locos, some of it on a commercial basis, so I know how difficult it is to ‘get right’. I have a thread on another forum showing and explaining my efforts but I don’t believe it would be ethical or within forum rules to provide a link.

 

The key to anything you try as I said, is the right materials and preparation of the workpiece. It has been suggested that you practice on old locos first - that is a top tip. Make your mistakes, and you will make them, on something of limited value. Incidentally, I document my mistakes ‘elsewhere’ in the hope that we can all learn from them.

 

[Chrissaf]

Steve, As long as you are not offering a 'pay for service' on that link then it is perfectly OK.

[SteveM6]

Chris, the first page does include a price list.....that's why I haven't provided the link. I have done work for a couple of forum members who can perhaps confirm that the project the OP is looking to undertake is not for the faint hearted.

The danger of offering advice on a forum is that it is sometimes easy to miss out key advice with oversimplified responses leaving the recipient disappointed with the results. But an in depth blow by blow account with pictures may put off some from trying in the first place.

In any case, my methods are just that, my methods, gleaned from much reading and picking up various techniques from others, and blending them into something that works for me, and by definition others will do the same job with very different techniques and materials.

Don't misunderstand my reasons for posting, just trying to help the OP get the results he wants.

[LCDR]

I have undertaken painting of newly constructed kits and scratch built locomotives and repainting existing models, and I can agree it is not a straightforward process. 

 

Firstly I agree preparation is vital, removing as much old finish as possible including decals and smoothing down areas where damage and use has left a rough surface. Dismantle the model into component parts, and paint them seperately. 

 

If you spray you must mask areas where you don't want the paint to go. This is fiddly and requires great care and precision.

 

Brush painting is perfectly possible but the finish is never going to be as good. Until the 1960s real trains were brush painted and even today heritage railways brush paint, but of course the brushes used are to a very different scale!

 

Dust is your enemy, during painting and while it hardens. A good paint job can be ruined by dust aquired during the drying phase. I use a large cardboard box to cover the model whilst it dries.

 

Spray painting creates fumes which can be harmful if inhaled. Ideally spraying should be done inside a spray booth but I usually spray out doors on calm warm days. 

 

Matt paint is more forgiving than gloss or satin. However it is better to apply numerous thin coats than try to obtain complete cover first go.

 

Colour matching is exceedingly difficult, even some blacks can appear different.

 

Unless it is really essential or you are really experienced I would suggest you leave well enough alone.

[Postman Prat]

@SteveM6

 

 I'm another 'oldie' and Parkinsons Disease means I cannot be certain of success, even using decals.

 

I'll happily confirm to anyone that Steve did a brilliant job painting and lining a Black 5 for me. I'm seriously considering sending him a CORONATION to paint in a proper shade of Maroon, like Hornbys Bill Stanier because I don't like the brown/maroon used by Hornby. I suppose I ought to tell Steve how my mind is working. 

 

 In the past I've used an airbrush and also Halford products, with variable result, but my best results have been with a brush. I must stress, however, that WTD is right on target when he says New, Good Quality, Brush and a New, WELL STIRRED tin of paint. Remember it could have been on the shelf for 6 months or more.

 

😎 

[LCDR]

6 months old ??

 

I have two tins of Humbrol BR Corporate Blue and one of Corporate Grey (BR Blue and Grey era, when Humbrol still made railway colour enamels) I bought in the 1970s and last time I looked about a year ago they were all still liquid. 

[Puffed Out]

I realise I have to pick my battles to what I paint initially, but if I don't try a few times, then I'll never find out.

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'If you first don't suceed the first time'.......as they say, you'll never know.!

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I have a box of old spares that I purchased and gathered,(All fit for the bin/scrap/staging). So I'll be trying a few old trucks and wagons first, then move on to an old Loco body, IF the job I make is good enough, I'll give it go.

I guess we all had to start somewhere, didn't we.?

[LY shunter]

Test any varnish before use as a different make can melt the paint and waterslide decals.

I paint over decals with an Daler-Rowney acrylic varnish before spraying with matt laquer.

I find halfords spray paint and matt lacquer very good.