Will the HM7000 work properly with the Cavalex class 56

[ColinB]

Has anyone tried fitting a HM7000 to a Cavalex class 56. Obviously the sound will be right but it is the auxiliary functions I am more concerned with like the lighting and fans. Now looking at the class 56 function map you definitely can control all 4 auxiliary outputs, but it is whether Cavalex have used more as in the case of Accurscale.

[ColinB]

I answered my own question.

I remembered I had a LaisDCC 21 pin decoder in another loco, so I put that in to see what happens. 

F0 is front headlight

F1 is front lights

F2 is back lights

F3 is fan #1

F4 is fan #2

So no cab lighting. A HM7000 will not work properly if you want all the functions.

[96RAF]

The HM7K higher functions are on page 3 of the app, F20+.

Note that 6 function decoders - 4 functions are full voltage and 2 are logic level (21 and N18 decoders).

HM7K non sound decoders will use the lower Fkeys. See the famous manual for each decoder type and pin config.

[ColinB]

I know 96RAF, I looked at the profile for the class 56. Functions 21 thro 24 do the 4 aux functions, F0 does the front/back lights. Cavalex seem to have done a Dapol where a lot of the normally F0 lights are on separate functions, hence they need more.

[DJB61]

I emailed Cavalex and Cav came back with this information as I would want to use the TXS decoder. I have since asked if the manual I've seen on YouTube is available in PDF format as there is a DIP switch page so not sure if they also affect DCC operation.

This is the Aux list for the loco.

Front Light = Headlight Front

Rear Light = Headlight Rear

AUX 1 = Markers Front

AUX 2 = Markers Rear

AUX 3 = Fan 1

AUX 4 = Fan 2

AUX 5 = Tail Lights Front

AUX 6 = Tail Lights Rear

AUX 7 = Cab Front

AUX 10 = Cab Rear

I hope that helps, if you need any further info please ask. We do have a decoder profile for use with Lokpilot decoders though if that would suit.

[96RAF]

I know 96RAF, I looked at the profile for the class 56. Functions 21 thro 24 do the 4 aux functions, F0 does the front/back lights. Cavalex seem to have done a Dapol where a lot of the normally F0 lights are on separate functions, hence they need more.

 

 

My Electrotren Class 278 and 321 are similar in that F0 only gives direction dependant front markers and associated number box lights, and Aux 1, 2, 3 are used for rear reds, and front and rear headlamps. Aux 4 being the fan on 321.

[ColinB]

Thank you DJB61 for the information, I got the same details off a Cavalex person on RMWEB. It is nice to have them all individually controllable but you wonder if with some logic they could of made the list a bit smaller. On a lot of other locos I have the cab lights only come on in the direction of travel, but that is the way they decided to do it, so that is it.

[Pete aka Spanner]

I have both Hornby and Cavalex 56's

The Hornby 56086 is fitted with a 21 pin HM7000txs and the Cavalex 56093 has the ESU loksound 5 as supplied.

I currently use a Hornby "Select" to control the Cavalex but with its limitations I can't access functions past F8.

I went down the route of sound fitted Cavalex as I have a bluetooth dongle on pre order which I'm praying will allow me to control the Cav from the app, I've no doubt I'll have to customise the function map to suit.

I must say (IMHO) the sound profile on the ESU Cav 56 is far better than the HMDCC 56 profile which is fine when running but at idle it rather annoyingly keeps whispering "Go wash your hands" Once you hear it you can't unhear it.... EVER... :(

If the app does indeed control the Cav 56 (dongle dependant) then the Hornby 56 will be getting a loksound decoder and then the 21 pin HMDCCtxs can go in something that has a less annoying Hornby sound profile..

[ColinB]

Thank you Peter-376650 for the information, I very nearly ordered a HM7000 as the sound on all my other HM7000 is not that bad and it is about half the price of the LokSound one. Fortunately in the manual for the loco it lists the "Sound" commands and realised there might be an issue, hence this post. I got most of the necessary information off RMWeb via the Cavalex guy.

[LTSR_NSE]

@Peter - be aware that if you intend to connect the dongle into the Select, you won’t suddenly exceed/bypass the Select’s limitations.

The App sends commands to dongle, which relays them to Select/Elite, which relays them to decoder through track.

Dongle is therefore simply adding Bluetooth communication capability to Select/Elite - the controls/functions that can be operated are only those that controller is itself capable of!

[ColinB]

LT&SR_NSE has anyone actually tested that, to me it makes no difference as I have an Elite, but a lot of the limitations of the Select are because of its screen and lack of decent keyboard. So has anyone actually checked? With the dongle basically all you are doing is converting bluetooth signals to DCC, the intelligent bit is being done by the App on the phone.

[LTSR_NSE]

@Colin - please recognise that Hornby are a business… if the (free) app & (inexpensive) dongle suddenly bypassed the Select’s limitations & allowed it to perform the same functionality as the Elite (minus 1 twiddly dial) - why on earth would anyone purchase an Elite?

Also the dongle is indeed just receiving data from app & controller & passing it to the other, the controller is sending/receiving the actual DCC commands to/from decoder. If the controller is limited to communicating with a specific range of addresses & functions, it can’t suddenly communicate with more just because another more intelligent device is connected further up the chain!

[ColinB]

Sorry LT&SR_NSE what are you on about, all I said was it doesn't bother me about Select as I have an Elite. My point was that you are using the Select's communication capability. I know Hornby are a business so if they are doing it properly and cheaply, they will have used the same interface for both Elite and Select and as I also said the whole idea of the dongle is to put the user interface on the Smart Phone using the app. So the dongle I assume is just converting Bluetooth commands to DCC ones through whatever software is on the Select or Elite. From my point of view the dongle is just an interest I am more than happy with my PC end that works will my current system, I only use the Elite for programming. So when using the dongle on a Select does it put the same limitations on the data, as these would have been put there because the Select can't store much data, but now the App should be doing that. As I said for me just interested.

[96RAF]

.....

I currently use a Hornby "Select" to control the Cavalex but with its limitations I can't access functions past F8.

.....

 

 

That is because your Select is running early firmware (v1.1) and needs to be updated by return to works Hornby, then it will be able to use F0 to F28 inclusive. Be aware v1.1 has a bug that can cause R8247 accessory decoders to go into relay flutter and fail, therefore you are advice not to use it for points control until it has been updated.

[96RAF]

@colin

An analogy for you.

The Elite speaks DCC (call it Queens English). The Select speaks limited DCC (call it pigeon English).

The app whispers to the dongle in French which translates it into English for the controller.

The Select and Elite both speak DCC English to the loco which understands the gist of it but may not understand all of it (full addressing versus limited addressing).

As stated the dongle cannot alter the capability of a particular controller which is hardwired into its firmware.

[ColinB]

Yes I see 96RAF not as clever as I thought.