mytrainz Posted May 27 Share Posted May 27 With the loss of Scalespeed who else does rewinding? I have several waiting. Alistair. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rana Temporia Posted May 27 Share Posted May 27 I have so far avoided rewinding by transplanting armatures from cheap ‘parts’ locos including an armature into a Mk2 motor from an X04. There are a lot of cheap X04s about with broken brush holders but perfectly good armatures, magnets etc. There are also plenty of part bogies for the EMU/DMU/Dock Shunter/Transcontinenetal/Blue Pullman, Hymek, 31/37/EM2. Eventually the supply will run out but at the moment I’m not having any supply problems. I have a box of broken armatures somewhere, not sure what to do with them. Can they be recycled? There are parts available now that have been difficult to get for years, especially the bearings for the 31/37/EM2 armature. Places like eBay and Peter’s spares are great for newly manufactured parts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
What About The Bee Posted May 28 Share Posted May 28 Hi @mytrainz I was hopeful that you would be provided with the name of a service that rewound motors for model trains. That appears unlikely by now. There are plenty of motor rewinding services in the UK. https://www.google.com/search?q=services+motor+rewinding+uk The sticky bit will be the price. This will not be inexpensive. The services are generally provided for industrial motors. -- The thing is this. Why not do it yourself. It is simply enameled wire, with a specific number of turns for every pole. Under the assumption that your old motors are three pole, you will need 3 bundles. Arrange on the rotor in the same polarity. Solder to commutator. Pot. Voila. Of course, you are very unlikely to get the same wire density that a machine will. So your developed magnetic field strength is not going to match the original. Start with new enameled wire of the same cross sectional area as the old. Triang would not have gone with square cross sectional wire to get better density, because of cost. Therefore simple round enameled wire will do. You need a mold to wrap the wire around, such that the bundle can slide off and placed onto the pole of the rotor. Keep making trial bundles. Your aim is to get the highest number of turns in the bundle that still allows rotor rotation within the stator. Why? Higher number of turns = greater magnetic field. Once you know, make three more and use those. This ensures three pristine bundles. Your test bundle(s) should be discarded, as you may have damaged the enamel. Install and solder to commutator. Test resistance, phase to phase. The resistance values should be a very close match. If not, you likely nicked the enamel. Pot the motor by painting some more enamel on the installed bundles, fixing the bundles in place. This is only the broad brush outline. Plenty of details and videos on the internet to help you along. Bee 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rana Temporia Posted May 28 Share Posted May 28 What I would really like to see is a 3D printed adapter for one of the standard N20 motors plus gearbox with a compatible worm gear. Silly slow speeds would be available and no problem with supply as they are used in virtually everything including vehicle wing mirrors. However as I like Tri-ang motors it would be useful if they could continue to be repaired. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deem Posted May 28 Share Posted May 28 5 hours ago, What About The Bee said: Hi @mytrainz I was hopeful that you would be provided with the name of a service that rewound motors for model trains. That appears unlikely by now. There are plenty of motor rewinding services in the UK. https://www.google.com/search?q=services+motor+rewinding+uk The sticky bit will be the price. This will not be inexpensive. The services are generally provided for industrial motors. -- The thing is this. Why not do it yourself. It is simply enameled wire, with a specific number of turns for every pole. Under the assumption that your old motors are three pole, you will need 3 bundles. Arrange on the rotor in the same polarity. Solder to commutator. Pot. Voila. Of course, you are very unlikely to get the same wire density that a machine will. So your developed magnetic field strength is not going to match the original. Start with new enameled wire of the same cross sectional area as the old. Triang would not have gone with square cross sectional wire to get better density, because of cost. Therefore simple round enameled wire will do. You need a mold to wrap the wire around, such that the bundle can slide off and placed onto the pole of the rotor. Keep making trial bundles. Your aim is to get the highest number of turns in the bundle that still allows rotor rotation within the stator. Why? Higher number of turns = greater magnetic field. Once you know, make three more and use those. This ensures three pristine bundles. Your test bundle(s) should be discarded, as you may have damaged the enamel. Install and solder to commutator. Test resistance, phase to phase. The resistance values should be a very close match. If not, you likely nicked the enamel. Pot the motor by painting some more enamel on the installed bundles, fixing the bundles in place. This is only the broad brush outline. Plenty of details and videos on the internet to help you along. Bee Very Good read for newbies. Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ntpntpntp Posted May 28 Share Posted May 28 (edited) 3 hours ago, Rana Temporia said: What I would really like to see is a 3D printed adapter for one of the standard N20 motors plus gearbox with a compatible worm gear. Silly slow speeds would be available and no problem with supply as they are used in virtually everything including vehicle wing mirrors. However as I like Tri-ang motors it would be useful if they could continue to be repaired. Rather than an N20 I'd use one of the readily available open frame 5 pole skew wound motors, they're a bit more robust with proper serviceable brushes, though not sold with gearboxes as some N20s are. I have a selection I bought to replace certain N gauge motors as used in some Arnold and Brawa locos. I see someone did develop an upgrade kit using such a motor, though it's out of stock on ebay https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/144911822821 Edited May 28 by ntpntpntp Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deem Posted May 28 Share Posted May 28 4 hours ago, ntpntpntp said: Rather than an N20 I'd use one of the readily available open frame 5 pole skew wound motors, they're a bit more robust with proper serviceable brushes, though not sold with gearboxes as some N20s are. I have a selection I bought to replace certain N gauge motors as used in some Arnold and Brawa locos. I see someone did develop an upgrade kit using such a motor, though it's out of stock on ebay https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/144911822821 I just checked on ebay and it is showing more then 10 in stock, very good modification but, bit pricey though at £35.00. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LTSR_NSE Posted May 28 Share Posted May 28 Peters Spares also do 3 pole X04 & X03 alternatives: https://www.petersspares.com/p/peters-spares-ps135-x04-motor-upgrade-3-pole https://www.petersspares.com/p/peters-spares-ps136-x03-motor-upgrade-3-pole 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mytrainz Posted May 28 Author Share Posted May 28 Thanks for the ideas. I am after X112 armatures. Already have X04 in stock. I live in Western Canada which makes things a bit harder. Have run out of replacement ones. Switched all the ones I can. Might have to do my own. Old eyes and hands make that tricky. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
What About The Bee Posted May 28 Share Posted May 28 Hi @mytrainz If you do decide to rewind them yourself, there is very little downside. The motor is no longer functional without rewinding. It isn't like you are destroying a working motor. So whilst you can indeed make a bodge of your first few, understand that you can almost always try again! The laminations are unlikely to be damaged. The permanent rate earth magnets are unlikely to be damaged. It really comes down to how badly you mangle the case and bearing surfaces. So try, try again. Until you get it right. A spool of enameled wire will be hundreds if not thousands of turns. Plenty of chances to get it right! Crack on Mate! Bee Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deem Posted May 28 Share Posted May 28 3 hours ago, LTSR_NSE said: Peters Spares also do 3 pole X04 & X03 alternatives: https://www.petersspares.com/p/peters-spares-ps135-x04-motor-upgrade-3-pole https://www.petersspares.com/p/peters-spares-ps136-x03-motor-upgrade-3-pole Still expensive but if you are stuck than you don't have choice or try what "what About the Bee" suggested. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rana Temporia Posted May 28 Share Posted May 28 Lots of people make their own electric guitar pick-ups which are……..a coil of enamelled wire around magnetic pole pieces. When I used to get guitar mags there were all sorts of weird devices people came up with to wind the coils and make the process easier. Maybe check out some home-made guitar pick-up tutorials for some ideas. It might save some time! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
96RAF Posted May 29 Share Posted May 29 I used to rewind slot car motors by hand and it was a simple case of counting turns. The gauge of wire dictated the number of turns but full was the aim, noting you had to wind multiple poles thus leaving room for the adjacent coils. The whole thing after testing was potted with warm araldite to bombproof it, then it was balanced on a pair of razor blades. There used to be a hand winder that counted the turns and rotated the armature to enable winding. I presume you can still find them. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Please sign in to comment
You will be able to leave a comment after signing in
Sign In Now