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Decoder fitted but only works on DC


Deem

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I don't know if I have fried the decoder by using in DC mode for long time (around 20 minutes, on - off, not constantly) but loco works beautifully in DC mode with slight delay when changing direction, but when I connect my elite, loco doesn't move, try to read man ID and I am getting xxx. Please correct me if I am wrong, if the decoder is blown, it shouldn't work in DC mode either?

20240725_045924.thumb.jpg.878c8853c212091e5d7e3aab47698fab.jpg20240725_045917.thumb.jpg.3b86d0b9b6444255c9dbc10a1435151a.jpg20240725_045909.thumb.jpg.dc3b09628ea5b843a43a35c5dc201d9a.jpg20240725_045900.thumb.jpg.42d4eda2b0cf4262df8b381e542c217a.jpg20240725_045856.thumb.jpg.754e39bc4f7e1b4bde5dd6f6ae24aa53.jpg

Any advice will be much appreciated.

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3 hours ago, Deem said:

I don't know if I have fried the decoder by using in DC mode for long time (around 20 minutes, on - off, not constantly) but loco works beautifully in DC mode with slight delay when changing direction, but when I connect my elite, loco doesn't move, try to read man ID and I am getting xxx. Please correct me if I am wrong, if the decoder is blown, it shouldn't work in DC mode either?

20240725_045924.thumb.jpg.878c8853c212091e5d7e3aab47698fab.jpg20240725_045917.thumb.jpg.3b86d0b9b6444255c9dbc10a1435151a.jpg20240725_045909.thumb.jpg.dc3b09628ea5b843a43a35c5dc201d9a.jpg20240725_045900.thumb.jpg.42d4eda2b0cf4262df8b381e542c217a.jpg20240725_045856.thumb.jpg.754e39bc4f7e1b4bde5dd6f6ae24aa53.jpg

Any advice will be much appreciated.

I bought a secondhand Hornby 0-6-0 fitted with a Hornby 0-6-0 and it did exactly the same. I was told at the time that a lot of old Hornby decoders fail like this. The decoder looks like a Hornby so perhaps it has the same fault. That looks like a Merchant Navy, the space in one of them is very limited, that is why I moved all my decoders to the tender, so perhaps it overheated. Unusual though, normally the drivers are the first to go. You could try resetting it, it might work, I also gather from posts that some of these early Hornby decoders had issues with reading CVs. If you are going to replace it, I think the Zimo has a shorter lead and is about the same price.

Edited by ColinB
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Is it new Deem, and what is it?  Plugged into a socket or hard wired?  What address do you have it on?

First to try - remove the suppressor capacitor for a start, then write 8 to CV8 to reset it. Now try to run on address 03.

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1 hour ago, ColinB said:

I bought a secondhand Hornby 0-6-0 fitted with a Hornby 0-6-0 and it did exactly the same. I was told at the time that a lot of old Hornby decoders fail like this. The decoder looks like a Hornby so perhaps it has the same fault. That looks like a Merchant Navy, the space in one of them is very limited, that is why I moved all my decoders to the tender, so perhaps it overheated. Unusual though, normally the drivers are the first to go. You could try resetting it, it might work, I also gather from posts that some of these early Hornby decoders had issues with reading CVs. If you are going to replace it, I think the Zimo has a shorter lead and is about the same price.

Thanks @ColinB

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1 hour ago, Fishmanoz said:

Is it new Deem, and what is it?  Plugged into a socket or hard wired?  What address do you have it on?

First to try - remove the suppressor capacitor for a start, then write 8 to CV8 to reset it. Now try to run on address 03.

It's not hard wired, have proper 8 pin socket in there with decoder. I will try to reset the decoder but as far as I can tell elite can't seem to read this decoder at all.

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6 minutes ago, Deem said:

It's not hard wired, have proper 8 pin socket in there with decoder. I will try to reset the decoder but as far as I can tell elite can't seem to read this decoder at all.

96RAF did say that there were a batch that did this, well I think it was him. Was it a new one or did it come with the loco?

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Just used one of my spare tts decoder and loco worked fine with spare tts decoder. So I am certain that decoder came with the loco is faulty or I have made it faulty by using with dc controller.

Thanks everyone for your help and support, especially @ColinB.

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Hi Deem, thanks for letting us know it is plugged into a socket but so far you’ve answered only this one of the 5 questions I asked?

Also, I didn’t ask you to read it, you’ve already reported that you can’t, I asked you to write to it (8 to CV8).

Then you say the loco came with this decoder so, if it’s new, send it back under warranty if you get nowhere after resetting.

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10 hours ago, Fishmanoz said:

Is it new Deem, and what is it?  Plugged into a socket or hard wired?  What address do you have it on?

First to try - remove the suppressor capacitor for a start, then write 8 to CV8 to reset it. Now try to run on address 03.

Sorry @Fishmanoz

It's not, came with used Loco so I am assuming it's used decoder as well

Plugged in socket, not hard wired

as I can not use, can't read the address

I have used with suppressor capacitor remain and used TTS decoder, it ran without any issue, do I still need to remove suppressor capacitor?

I will try and update if I can write 8 to CV8 tomorrow, as I am out

After that I will test with address 03 and see this works

Once I can find out if this hornby or other make then I will try to contact the manufacturer to see what support they can provide

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I cannot see any other comment on this but the white dot suggests it is an early model decoder and from what I have read these have limited capability, possibly including not being readable. Red dot came later, then the R8249 had a blue dot and 4-digit addressing. This is from a few scrappy notes so please correct me if I am wrong. From recollection the hardware did not change but the firmware was enhanced. I also believe that the firmware cannot be updated. ☹️

Edited by dBerriff
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23 hours ago, Deem said:

I have made it faulty by using with dc controller.

Extremely unlikely unless maybe you gave it full power from an ancient H&M unit? The pulses from a PWM and feedback controllers may confuse a decoder but shouldn't be high enough voltage to damage one.      DCC decoders are supposed to be designed to withstand somewhat more than the usual DCC voltage (I think something like 24V for small scale and 35V for large scale decoders). 

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On 25/07/2024 at 16:25, Deem said:

Just used one of my spare tts decoder and loco worked fine with spare tts decoder. So I am certain that decoder came with the loco is faulty or I have made it faulty by using with dc controller.

Thanks everyone for your help and support, especially @ColinB.

No I doubt you did anything to it, it was exactly what happened to me. I think some of the early decoders weren't that good.

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The white spot tells me it is likely an old R8215 decoder. I don't have access to my train-pc yet due to a house move, so cannot quote chapter and verse on which revision it is but some of those decoders did not support read-back. My advice is to bin it and fit something more reliable.

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Posted (edited)
On 27/07/2024 at 07:41, 96RAF said:

The white spot tells me it is likely an old R8215 decoder. I don't have access to my train-pc yet due to a house move, so cannot quote chapter and verse on which revision it is but some of those decoders did not support read-back. My advice is to bin it and fit something more reliable.

Thanks @96RAF

I was going to bin it anyway but I thought I follow the advice of @Fishmanoz to attempt writing 8 to CV 08, here are the result. First thing I did was that I wrote 8 in CV 08, followed by the

WhatsAppImage2024-07-29at11_23_53.thumb.jpeg.d27cf7783a010d8595519e1b1190b942.jpegWhatsAppImage2024-07-29at11_23.54-2.thumb.jpeg.5ffb77652ee07d67bb45bea02bb777e2.jpegWhatsAppImage2024-07-29at11_23_54.thumb.jpeg.4e0b71959eb10e90aa585adc45a5230a.jpeg

 

 

Edited by Deem
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