Tech Specs - and skills needed

[RB51]

In the Voice Control Thread the point has been made about PC/laptop set-up and how each can run unwanted programs in the background (so unseen to the user). Does anyone else think it might be an good idea to have a place where the less skilled (such as myself) in re-configuring their machines might be able to look for instructions? Here maybe? R-

[Yelrow]

 

Roger B, high, presume you read my post to HRMS. I think we are going down the road of RailMaster only laptops. I have no problem with that, PJ, already has one.. I agree, that a specific thread would be good. If it is a pre designated machine, there would be little need for reconfiguring, just expense. At the risk of telling my grandmother about eggs, do you know how to delete your temp files, as norton engineer showed me last night. Very quick and simple. john

[Yelrow]

Roger, just read your other pos, MSconfig, is fairly simple, but i belive, my norton guy is a lot easier. You have my email address, i can supply  the how, if you want, john

[RB51]

Thanks - can't find your e-mail so have sent you PM on the MRF forum. R-

[Yelrow]

Rog, emailed you (hopefully), from me and from MRF, john

[RB51]

Yes - got that. Look forward to getting my head around this. R-

[idlemarvel]

With the best will in the world, this problem will not go away.  The IT industry faced a similar issue about a decade ago; software companies wanted to sell their product but it required an operating system and hardware to run it on, usually windows server based.  The issue they then had, similar to what Hornby face, is that many problems their customers had running their software were nothing to do with their software, but with the underlying operating system or server hardware.  This is because of the almost infinite number of combinations of software levels, fixes applied, hard disk types, processor speeds, etc. Their fix for this was to create what they called "appliances", servers pre-installed with the operating system (usually Linux based) and their software, so they knew exactly the platform their software was running on, and by and large any problems that then arose were their problems.  (Now the IT industry is moving to virtual appliances but the principle is the same, althogh that then re-introduces potential hardware differences.)  So the only way Hornby can avoid all these issues with software levels, drivers, admin rights, interference from AV scanners, unwanted background tasks, etc, is to produce an "appliance", essentially a Windows PC with preloaded operating system and software (with touch screen, maybe microphone/headphones as well?).  I can't see them doing that, and I'm not sure anyone would pay the premium for such a product, which I would guess would have to be in the £300-500 price range.

[RB51]

I am sure you are right, but until someone comes up with the bit of kit you describe (which I also think unlikely, and if it is likely then probably unaffordable) I just wondered if there was something we could do with the skill and helpfulness levels we have here to get some folk through the quagmire. I dont imagine for one moment that we sould solve everything for everyone - but all great ideas start somewhere. Not that the proposed thread is a good idea necessarily but from that might come something better. Can RM be operated "in the cloud" for instance? [before anyone shoots me down I should just say I have no idea what that means, but lots of things run from it these days]. Hornby themselves say they have already had an "Eureka" moment with loco detection. It would be great is something similar could kick start with this issue. Just a thought, I'll go back to my colouring now. R-

[Yelrow]

Idlemarvel, hi, the point i was making, is that to my knowledge, 3 people on forum so far have bought new laptops, for Railmaster. I dont know, and nor do they, that their new machines are sufficient for Loco Rec. If they, are great, but if Hornby could put out the minimum spec, to run, everything, it might be beneficial,. I,guess  , that if people are spending now £300, plus, and the minimum spec cost £50 more, in the long run, it could be money well spent. . Thats all i was thinking. john 

[96RAF]

I regularly suggest 'bright ideas' to Hornby and one idea I put forward was for an all in one device that had the hardware of a controller and the software of RM in a single black box that would (for economy) use your pc, tablet or iPad as the screen.  All you had to do was connect it to your track and plug it in. I got the usual 'your idea has been passed to Marketing, etc' and you got the eLink and RM (albeit already well down the development line when I put my oar in).

Responding to Rog maybe the bulk of the systems operating memory requirements and user custom data could be in the cloud so that the black box could remain as bare bones as possible..

Maybe in the light of current forum opinion for a stand alone model railway in a box Hornby would be prepared to undertake a feasibility study of such a system. I think the cost of such a system would be well under idle's estimate, say sub 100GBP, a sure winner - just look at eLink & RM versus RR & Co.

Now what about my integrated DCC points, with piezo legs motor (google it) and self learning DCC decoder ID. All you do is phyiscally install it into your track and it works.

Rob

Rob

[RB51]

Wow - what amazing gizmos [ the peizo legs ]. And I thought servos were pretty cool. R-

[96RAF]

Rog

There are more amazing things out there than seen in the X Files...

[PJR_slo]

Hi guys

FWIW, I bought a new PC for running RM on.  A 24" touch-screen monitor plus a Zotac Z-Box fixed to the back.

The Z-Box is a tad OTT (i7 CPU, SSD etc), but future-prof and the total package cost around £1200.

Couple of reasons for this - firstly I needed a PC for exhibitions and secondly because of the requirement to run RM as administrator, which personally, I find problematic.

PC is set up with MS defender and firewall turned off.  The essential thing here is that I bought the PC without an operating system and loaded that myself, so that I know there is no bloatware installed.

I prefer this setup to a laptop with the smaller screen and it is almost as easy to transport.  The Z-Box is available with a variety of processors and range of prices and a cheaper system can be purchased for around £300 plus monitor and O/S.

Peter

[RDS]

I am not keen at all on the direction this particular thread is heading.  

I use a Laptop that is dedicated to RM, running Windows 7 and when it ceases to be able to run my layout correctly, I am sure I will replace it with what is then the latest model.  I can imagine that an 'off the shelf' PC will be cheaper than anything that is purpose built, and I can quite well believe that there are enough people currently running RM off a standard Windows machine to show that in general this is not a problem. 

I do agree though that it would be helpful if a particular feature, eg Loco Detection, is introduced in the future that required an increased minimum spec that this should be identified sooner, rather than later.

[RB51]

I am with you there RDS. For many years quick, efficient and sometimes free fixes have been provided for newly released Windows based applications. I am one of the folk who need consistently simple, plug and play updates, revisions or full blown releases simply because I am not a computer whizz. I have been helped today by a member of this forum who called me to take me through a process on my laptop that I had never done before, frightened the life out of me to attempt but in the end was so straightforward that I could hardly believe it had happened. If we can keep that level of support for folk then I am sure all will be well. Hornby to date have been very good in this respect, they may not always get it right straight away but they sure do fix it quick, and long may it continue. R-

[walkingthedog]

How about a RailMaster laptop produced specifically for the one task. 

[Yelrow]

WTD, spot, that was the point i was trying to get across. I disagree with RDS, about off the shelf machines being cheaper, mine are always custom built, come with original windows disk, which off the shelf ones dont, and if you want a fast disc drive, you put in, on build, same as Ram etc. Take a look at PC Specialist, hornby could provide suggested specs, and they will put it together, 3 year warranty. An off the shelf comes with a lot of stuff you neither need or want. Cost, of custom built,. usually slightly cheaper, but permanent helpline. That way the component quality is superior. Also, you can have windows 7, a far superior  set up. I only raised this ,as more and more of us are having Designated machines for railmaster, and with little else loaded to interfere, may be the future. I will of course  be  probably, as normal, out of step, john

[Augustus Caesar]

Still some rather negative thoughts about having to turn off Defender and Windows Firewall etc in order to run RM... absolutely unnecessary. I build PC's for a living from servers to bog standard basic client PC's running Windows 7 or 8/8.1 depending upon what the client wants.

Prior to those O/S's I would install all versions of Windows but for this chat I will use Win 7 or later as an example.

I have stated many times on here that if you cannot run RM on Windows 7 or later, either 32 bit or 64 bit then your PC is most likely to blame. It would be quite rare to have a faulty Elite/Elink to the extent we see on here where users report faults that simply don't exist and this is proven when HRMS offer support and fix said issues.

Don't take these words as an affront though as every person has an individual level of knowledge and I understand that, for some, technology isn't their forte.

I have often thought a single new fixed thread or new forum topic altogether where HRMS or Admin can allow the likes of those experts (I use the term lightly) to offer direct help to specific issues instead of having themselves bogged down by all the repetetive issues like ports not being found and RM not finding ELink etc.

I have already stated I would do a complete step by step guide to enhance that which Hornby HRMS have already got on here somewhere. This would include ways around AV products getting the way of things, lost ports, install and uninstall of said software and much more.

During the guide at certain places different conditions of an install will arise and I would cater for that at that given point. Any points missed would be updated to that thread.

It is not beyond being easy but would take a little time to do it fully. So I put the point again to HRMS or Admin to see if such a thing is a good idea. What do you guys think?

[RDS]

John

I always specify and build my own PC as well but that is not (as far as I know) possible with a laptop.  I use a laptop to control RailMaster because it was spare, so I wiped everything off it.  The only software on it is RailMaster (and Chrome, to get on the Internet for updates).  

[Yelrow]

Rds, hi, have a look at the PC Specialist site, no problem with laptop build. from case up, you design, or take their suggestion, john

[RDS]

Hi John

Thanks but I only used the laptop because it was spare and available.  If I need to replace it, I will build a Desktop machine dedicated to RailMaster.

[RB51]

That AC - is more or less what I was saying in the first post of this thread. You have much more detail in the above but in essence I for one woudl find such a resource invaluable. R-

[Fishmanoz]

I'm with AC and Roger on this. For me, what is needed is comprehensive advice. 

We know that RM is quite demanding in terms of the communication that it needs. However I don't think that is a reason to advise that it should be run on a dedicated PC/laptop. Beyond stating the minimum hardware specification  needed, the choice should be left to the individual. And there might be more more than one specification too, dependent on whether you wish to use Voice Control and/or Loco Detection. Then leave it to the user to decide, with more advice if they ask here.  And leave them to decide whether they run other things on the same machine.

I don't know how many times I've advised people to email RM Support now. Most of the times I've done it, I've known that the problems they were having, even those insisting they had done all of the correct setup procedures, were not going to be down to RM. I think it's now clear to at least the regulars here, and 99% of others who RM Support has helped successfully, that this was the case. 

So I'd go with clearly labelled thread or threads in the RM forum which always show on top in the forum and which themselves contain clearly labelled locked on top posts with the advice. Those having trouble could then be referred to these in the first instance, then to either ask for more specific advice from the forum or RM Support. 

I think it would also be invaluable if Hornby then made reference to this source of information with the product when sold and made it clear that some fine-tuning of users' computers/operating systems may be needed to run RM reliably.  While at the same time making it clear that the non-technical user can operate RM successfully.  A couple of testimonials might even be made available with the marketing material. 

[Yelrow]

Hi, i am afraid that i am against the AC and fishy, camp, what we dont need are more paragraphs of jargon instructions, however well meant. This has been part of the problem in the first place. The RM manuel, is a great piece of detailed instructions, which  if you are technically minded, you can follow.  i am not so inclined, as are many others, and prefer trial and error. A designated Railmaster laptop, similar in price to the elite, would solve a lot of present problems. We are, i  hope all friends, and certainly, can help each other, with basic computer knowledge, but the finest way of doing that, is on the computer, not struggling to understand techy words. If somebody offered me a machine that was dedicated, met all specs for playing trains for about £300, i would jump at it. We are in a lot of cases using old machines, full of rubbish, expecting miracles from them,  john

[RB51]

Thats fine John - if you dont already have a PC/laptop. If that were the case and I was starting now then I think I would also jump at the opportunity - anything for an easy life! But the fact of the matter is lots of folk, not just here in the UK, already have their machines and I think it would be great if we could get some help on running RM on them. I also think it appropriate that forum users are the main contributors to the "guidance" rather than Hornby. After all, although it is in their interests as much as it is in ours, it is not really their core business. R-