My Local Shop Closing Down

[moawkwrd]

I think the only way a model shop can really survive these days is in scale and mostly selling online (e.g RoS, TMC, etc) to subsidise the physical shop, or by offering a USP or value add - whether that’s customer service, the owner being a “character”, being located/connected to an actual railway, or having something like a cafe that drives footfall and again subsidises the actual shop. With online shopping it’s just not possible for a local shop to survive as that alone.

Edited September 7 by moawkwrd

[SteveM6]

1 hour ago, moawkwrd said:

 ......or having something like a cafe that drives footfall and again subsidises the actual shop.

At the risk of going off piste....reminds me of a shop in Besalu, Spain.

Part one of the shop was a patisserie, second part was a cafe and the third was a chocolatier. But the thing that stood out was that every one of the cafe walls was filled with floor to ceiling display cases filled with complete model armies of every occupying army of the last 2000 years. Thousands of some of the best hand painted models I have ever seen.

Sadly even this diversity failed as the shop is no longer there.

At least my off topic moment was model related.😁

[ColinB]

I think Monk Bar in York seems to do ok, it is always busy when I go there on holiday. There again York has lots of tourists, so a lot of pass through traffic.

[AndyMac1707817969]

Even as a full time business, selling online via a portal such as eBay to drive traffic is barely worth it unless you mark-up is at least 100%. It really not worth the hassle if you are operating on a mark-up of about 50% then you can just get as good a return on your money from an investment bond and have none of the hassle and go get a real job. If you can’t make a decent living for it then there is a lot easier ways to earn money. It is still practical if you have a day job and do the paperwork and packing at night for some extra cash but then the tax man takes nearly half of that if you have any sort of descent job.

Maybe model shops should have like a taxi meter on the counter, whenever someone comes in looking ‘free’ advice they should start that and charge by the minute, could see then how much people value it if they have to pay for it. Walked out of many a model shop waiting to be served which some tire kicker stands there and wastes the owners time and eventually if they are lucky buys something for a couple of quid when you have been looking a loco.

It’s only going to go one way and that is the manufactures selling directly and the intermediates disappearing. Ultimately it makes little sense for Hornby to sell to a retailer at a trade price when they can sell exactly the same product directly to the customer at a much higher mark-up.

[What About The Bee]

 

38 minutes ago, AndyMac1707817969 said:

It’s only going to go one way and that is the manufactures selling directly and the intermediates disappearing. 

A corollary to this is that the Manufacturer's Webpages are the shop window. 

If the window is in disarray or filled with errors, it drives clients away.  A client should not have to struggle with those webpages.  

Hornby needs to get on top of this. I understand the web pages are being brought in house.  Hopefully, some of the nonsensical errors disappear.

Hornby also needs to cut out DIP.  Deceptive Imagery Persuasion.  To often the images related to a product are inaccurate.  Showing both sides of two coaches should not make the client believe that the purchase is for four coaches.  I am told to read what is written, and not rely upon the images.  That is precisely when you know you are a victim of DIP.

And whilst I feel for the Local Model Shop, times are changing.  Change with the times.  Do not be Fezziwig who tried to preserve a way of life, and went bankrupt in the process [Tip of the cap to Dickens].

Bee 

[ColinB]

1 hour ago, AndyMac1707817969 said:

Even as a full time business, selling online via a portal such as eBay to drive traffic is barely worth it unless you mark-up is at least 100%. It really not worth the hassle if you are operating on a mark-up of about 50% then you can just get as good a return on your money from an investment bond and have none of the hassle and go get a real job. If you can’t make a decent living for it then there is a lot easier ways to earn money. It is still practical if you have a day job and do the paperwork and packing at night for some extra cash but then the tax man takes nearly half of that if you have any sort of descent job.

 

Maybe model shops should have like a taxi meter on the counter, whenever someone comes in looking ‘free’ advice they should start that and charge by the minute, could see then how much people value it if they have to pay for it. Walked out of many a model shop waiting to be served which some tire kicker stands there and wastes the owners time and eventually if they are lucky buys something for a couple of quid when you have been looking a loco.

 

It’s only going to go one way and that is the manufactures selling directly and the intermediates disappearing. Ultimately it makes little sense for Hornby to sell to a retailer at a trade price when they can sell exactly the same product directly to the customer at a much higher mark-up.

 

Do you go and buy your car directly off the manufacturer, I doubt it and that is the case with many items. It may sound great selling directly to the public but for a company like Hornby it would be a nightmare. There will always be retail outlets if not physical, definitely mail order. Yes, with locos it is a good idea to buy online, but for the smaller items post and packing can make the item very expensive. Then there is the local model shop, my one is in an industrial estate, he used to have a shop but said the rates + rates etc were too expensive. His prices are reasonable. There is another one a bit farther away, I went there because I wanted some plastic rod. His prices are out of this world, even the old stuff is priced at the price of a current loco, which probably explains if you want that loco or bit rolling stock that nobody has, he probably has it. Just remember at the moment we do well on mail services they are generally cheap as we have Amazon and Evri drivers rushing around trying to make a living, but there is no guarantee that with continue for ever.  

[What About The Bee]

1 hour ago, ColinB said:

It may sound great selling directly to the public but for a company like Hornby it would be a nightmare. 

Hornby Annual Report 2024

#1 Headline: D2C sales

D2C / Gross Sales

£10M / £56.2M = 17.79%

Dunno if I would call that a nightmare. 

Bee

[ColinB]

22 minutes ago, What About The Bee said:

Hornby Annual Report 2024

#1 Headline: D2C sales

D2C / Gross Sales

£10M / £56.2M = 17.79%

Dunno if I would call that a nightmare. 

Bee

That is because they still have a retail network. If you don't have retail network you do it all. If I order a loco off Rails if it doesn't work I return it to them, without that, Hornby would be doing all of it. Try ordering something off Hornby and see how long it takes them to ship it. If you believe though that they can do it who am I to argue. Many industries have tried it and very quickly realise it is not as easy as it seems, for a start they would need a massive recruitment drive to get more staff, then there are the telephone lines. How long did it take for you to get through last time you phoned them.

[LTSR_NSE]

Colin, the logistics side of Hornby is outsourced therefore no additional recruitment necessary, also many companies (that need a larger telephone operation) outsource to call centres.

Whilst I absolutely do not advocate for outsourcing (having been ‘replaced’ I’m nearer to loathing it!) - I do however recognise that it massively reduces the recruitment/training/retention headache for management.

[ColinB]

7 hours ago, LTSR_NSE said:

Colin, the logistics side of Hornby is outsourced therefore no additional recruitment necessary, also many companies (that need a larger telephone operation) outsource to call centres.

Whilst I absolutely do not advocate for outsourcing (having been ‘replaced’ I’m nearer to loathing it!) - I do however recognise that it massively reduces the recruitment/training/retention headache for management.

And it eventually costs a shed load of money, all you end up doing is training someone else's people. Outsourcing is really cheap when you first start but eventually it gets more expensive as the years go on. Then you have the issue that you no longer understand your business, the Outsourcing company has that data, then they too have to make a profit. Anyway if it was that lucrative why did Hornby open up TT120 sales to Retailers, if by your figures they were doing quite well being the sole source.

[The son of Triangman]

Moving back to model shops, the old adage of "use it or loose it" rings very true even today.  Bricks and Mortar model shops are things to be treasured, they are a rare breed now.  Use them or you will loose them.

[AndyMac1707817969]

Manufacturer have to do a minimum production run and have to have the necessary retail outlets to handle it all without it sitting in a warehouse for years. As the number of model shops decrease so does the capacity to handle it. If the outlets do not exist to sell the stock then Hornby is left with no other choice. Obviously a separate Hornby retail company separate from the production company.

Not necessarily in the model railway retailing business but it’s getting increasing difficult to deal in an environment where people think you only exist to supply them with what they want for as little as they can get away with paying and care little even if you tell them that is less that you paid for something, they don’t care. I take my hat off to anyone nowadays who works in a customer-facing role as to what they have to put up with. if it were me there would be bloodshed

Cars are very different, one big expensive purchase every 3 or 4 years which people like to try before they buy. Remember well 25 years ago being told by one business after another ‘Internet will never take off, buying from catalogues did not replace shops so the Internet will not either’. Would not rule anything out.

[What About The Bee]

I bought my spanking new vehicle over the internet within the last year.  No test drive necessary.  100% over the internet.

I just showed up to drive it off the lot.

Bee

 

[LTSR_NSE]

Considering that not everyone drives & some who do purchase every 15+ yrs, (imho) car purchases have as much relevance to model railways as home ownership or grocery purchases - diddly squat! 😉

[What About The Bee]

Agreed @LTSR_NSE

With the one exclusion that it was implied that the internet does not apply to car purchases.  Living proof right here that it does.

The internet is altering all aspects of retail sales.  It is not a good idea to ignore it.

Bee

[Baz657]

Last week I ordered online from Rails and, because I’m relatively close, went to the shop to collect and have a look around. Best of both worlds?

[LTSR_NSE]

9 minutes ago, What About The Bee said:

Agreed @LTSR_NSE

With the one exclusion that it was implied that the internet does not apply to car purchases.  Living proof right here that it does.

The internet is altering all aspects of retail sales.  It is not a good idea to ignore it.

Bee

I can believe that people who live in a rural or isolated community may be unaware of how the internet has changed & shrunk the world even more than the jet engine.

However I can’t imagine that anyone who uses the internet can be oblivious to its (potential) affect/impact on every aspect of living.

Edited September 8 by LTSR_NSE

[dBerriff]

The Internet has transformed the electronics side of the hobby. It has never been so easy to buy the components to build up circuits that support our hobby. Or microcontrollers for nerds like me who enjoy developing software. 

Business-wise, we now have a collection of small hobby-related businesses who can operate internationally in a way not possible when customers still paid with postal orders. 

I despair at some of the unintended consequences of our rush into networked communications with insecure, cobbled together technologies. But it also creates opportunities that give me unprecedented access to toys for grown-ups, and allows me to chat to the excellent people on here. 

[Rallymatt]

I have been in many model shops and to be perfectly honest, quite a lot need to raise their game. They feel like places in terminal decline. Dirty, scruffy, half empty shelves, scatter gun approach to merchandising. Telling me that the scale I model in is doomed or that Hornby are going bust doesn’t encourage me to flash the cash. 
They would be advised to go to the likes of RoS or Gaugemaster etc and see how the successful businesses present themselves or even retailers like IKEA or Next. 

[96RAF]

Great Eastern is my local model shop in Norwich and they are totally pro-active and customer focussed. They run FB pages that engage their customers. They support local charities, help run the scouts, etc. If ever there was a template for how to run a model they are it.

[sir john]

We had three model shops in romford about 15 minutes drive from me . I was a regular visitor at weekends SWMBO would do her shopping while I browsed the shops often making a purchase until one by one they closed. First Victoria models then beatties then model zone ,now the nearest one is half an hours drive nowhere to park so two buses including the walk to the bus stop an hour only to be ignored once your in the shop ,not for me I'm afraid 

[DWhite]

11 minutes ago, 96RAF said:

Great Eastern is my local model shop in Norwich and they are totally pro-active and customer focussed. They run FB pages that engage their customers. They support local charities, help run the scouts, etc. If ever there was a template for how to run a model they are it.

I'll definitely have to stop by! And it's a perfect excuse to swing by Archers too! 😄

[Rallymatt]

@sir john ignoring customers after they have made the effort to get there is recipe for closure! It doesn’t have to be a badgering a customer, but a polite  hello is enough. 

[sir john]

 @Rallymatt quite agree, at the other end of the spectrum the chap who ran Victoria models was an ex lner engine driver so he had a wealth of knowledge and was really helpful,but retirement called as it does with all of us so the shop closed down sorely missed 

[Deem]

Because I enjoy this hobby so much I even consider opening a shop in my local area just before Covid period, but when I checked the monthly cost to run a shop (easily accessible but not on the main road, rather one of the railway arches on side road) even with online sale or advertised online I.E. Great Eastern on FB, I still could not match the expenditure from the profit. So drop the idea, I thought being retired due to medical issue's, this will give me some routine, keep me busy but when looked at realistically I thought the stress on it's was not worth the effort of me doing something about it. Unless I get things at less than half price from wholesale supplier, there was no way I could survive, also whole seller are crunching deals all the time they wouldn't sell me few items here and there at such a reduction.