The Musicman Posted January 6, 2015 Share Posted January 6, 2015 I bought a Tornado AI Peppercorn Loco which packed up after three or four days, on top of that one of the smoke deflectors fell off and both of the couplings fell off. I then orderd a Gad well and that played up after running it about three times.The thing I cannot understand with the throttlle turned right off it would run for 5 seconds then stop and run about five seconds again and kept doing it.I don't know if it is the locos or my Select controller, anyway I have sent it back for a refund. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RB51 Posted January 6, 2015 Share Posted January 6, 2015 Very unusual behaviour for sure. What have you sent back for refund one or both locos or the Select? Let us know how you get on. R- No need to reply here - I just caught up on another thread. R- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Musicman Posted January 6, 2015 Author Share Posted January 6, 2015 Very unusual behaviour for sure. What have you sent back for refund one or both locos or the Select? Let us know how you get on. R- No need to reply here - I just caught up on another thread. R- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Musicman Posted January 6, 2015 Author Share Posted January 6, 2015 I E-mailed the support department and he asked me to let him know the item number on the box which I did and he has not been back with a reply.The Dagwell started running on its own with the power nob set in the off position for about ten seconds and stopping and kept on doing it, so I have sent it back for a refund.I have spent near to £300 so far and the only loco that runs properly is the little black Somerset Belle which has no sound and set at Number 01.I have got my doubts about these TTs sound locos I think there is a problem with them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yelrow Posted January 6, 2015 Share Posted January 6, 2015 Sorry to disagree, Have CON, and Tornado, delighted with both. What controller are you running them with. john Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
96RAF Posted January 6, 2015 Share Posted January 6, 2015 TS locos are set with an acceleration and decelleration rate of 15 as anything less affects the sound qualities.Musicman - you dont talk to sound performance - whats that like. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yelrow Posted January 6, 2015 Share Posted January 6, 2015 What numbers appear on your select, when you turn it on. May be, its not been updated. john Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fishmanoz Posted January 6, 2015 Share Posted January 6, 2015 I'm glad to see you've csught up john. He did say Select. You don't have brain frostbite from standing on the Gazebo do you? unless Select is years old, it will have the latest firmware, I think showing 13 on startup. There have been no updates here in 2 years to my knowledge. something is definitely not right though and may be either Select or loco. Suggest you HCC a ring. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
walkingthedog Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 Surely if a loco runs with the power off it has to be controller whatever type or make it is. I once had a Gaugemaster controller where the loco stopped with the knob on zero but the knob could be turned about 1/8th of an inch past zero and the loco would slowly move off again. just realised that what I have said is probably rubbish because you alway have 15v on the track whether a DCC controller is on or off.............don't you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RB51 Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 Never mind - keep taking the tablets :-) R- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poliss Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 Depends on the make of the DCC controller WTD. Some cut the power, some don't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RB51 Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 I didn't realise that Poliss - I'm pretty sure the Select doesn't cut the power though does it? For sure the Elite doesn't. R- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
walkingthedog Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 Depends on the make of the DCC controller WTD. Some cut the power, some don't.But wouldn't that mean all the loco standing around with lights and sound would turn off? Thought the idea of DCC was that power was there at all times to keep things 'live'. Also any other loco chugging around another circuit would stop. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poliss Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 If you're doing an emergency stop you'd like the power to be cut, rather than the standard stop signal to be sent.I watched a video last night where the emergency stop button was pressed and the loco did the normal deceleration it was programmed for and crashed into another train.The video was specially made to compare different decoders. It was the cheapy decoder that didn't stop straight away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
walkingthedog Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 Yes I agree with the emergency stop button but not when you turn the speed knob to zero because another pre-programmed loco should keep going. Thats the problem with DC locos with flywheels they carry on under their own inertia. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2e0dtoeric Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 Im pleased that you used 'inertia', WTD, and not momentum, which is similar but not the same.For those that don't know, inertia means resistance to change, whereas momentum means it keeps on going - which in turn is affected by it's mass.So - inertia can be used for both starting and stopping movement, but momentum can only be used for stopping. Regarding the original subject, 16v ac is maintained on the track even if the Emergency stop button is used, otherwise everything would stop, including sounds.Where problems can occur is if the DC option has not been cancelled, in a chip, as it may see the ac as noisy dc, and keep the motor going. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fishmanoz Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 I think a consult with your local physicist might be in order 2e0. Agree with your definition of inertia but your momentum is a bit fuzzy. Using your terminology, momentum is about not stopping, or not starting for that matter, so quite similar to inertia in that respect. Both are proportional to mass but momentum is M x V, so proportional to velocity too, while inertia is 1/2 x M x V x V. Both properties are conserved in a perfect system (no losses) and between them explain how that little Newton's Cradle on your desk works the way it does. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
walkingthedog Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 And this explains why the loco in question doesn't work properly because............... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fishmanoz Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 .................. I'm afraid you are asking a lot here WTD because it doesn't. I can assure you that, whatever the mechanism for the loco in question continuing when it should be stopping, conservation of momentum and inertia will apply. But the system will be highly lossy and the energy in both will appear to evaporate as heat, or not to the extent that it keeps going. It certainly won't explain whatever faulty mechanism is involved, which must be either controller or decoder and is unlikely to be due to stored energy in a flywheel. Even if that is a possibility. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
walkingthedog Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 He said it moves a bit, stops, then moves a bit. Strange thing for a controller to do and definitely not a flywheel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Howbi Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 I bought a Tornado AI Peppercorn Loco which packed up after three or four days, on top of that one of the smoke deflectors fell off and both of the couplings fell off. I then orderd a Gad well and that played up after running it about three times.The thing I cannot understand with the throttlle turned right off it would run for 5 seconds then stop and run about five seconds again and kept doing it.I don't know if it is the locos or my Select controller, anyway I have sent it back for a refund. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poliss Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 I'm like Penny in Sheldon's physics class. I get lost after "It's a warm summer evening in ancient Greece". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
96RAF Posted January 8, 2015 Share Posted January 8, 2015 All the Emergency Stop command does is issue a braodcast to every decoder saying stop now. How that stop command is effected depends upon the decelleration rate set in CV4.Also to be considered is the gear mechanism for any particluar loco. If power is cut completely by say a circuit breaker, rather than a broadcast stop,then a loco with a worm drive will generally stop stone dead as you cannot turn the motor by turning the wheels. A loco with a gear pack like a ringfield motor will continue under momentum until the inertia is overcome by friction and the loco stops. In a previous life I was Design Authority for airfield arrestor gear, like they have on aircraft carriers but a bit different as they are on land. The ability to stop an aircraft was more critically dependant upon its speed rather than its weight, due to the formula stated earlier which indicates that the energy involved with a moving object is mass x velocity squared (E=MC2 - google Albert Einstein). i.e. the kit could stop a heavy aircraft at low speed much easier than it could stop a lighter one at much higher speed. The interesting thing was that the runout (stopping distance) was virtually constant regardless of weight or speed due to the clever mechanics of the system. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fishmanoz Posted January 8, 2015 Share Posted January 8, 2015 I'm like Penny in Sheldon's physics class. I get lost after "It's a warm summer evening in ancient Greece". Thats the trouble with physics, it never seems to change either. At least not until that pesky person mentioned the speed of light. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Howbi Posted January 8, 2015 Share Posted January 8, 2015 It's the decoder that's faulty, I've had similar problem so pack it in the box and send it back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.