The Doc

I was quite cynical and scathing about the "design clever" concept when it was first publicised, because it seemed to me that the models were going to go back to 1970s-80s level of detail, with far fewer separately fitted parts, particularly hand rails, but also plastic buffers. The argument was, I suppose, that these were details that many Hornby customers weren't too fussed about, and it would save on production costs, though I did wonder how much money was actually saved. However, I'm prepared to say I was too harsh and ought to eat a bit of humble pie, because in that era Hornby produced some decent (though not exceptional) models that were outstanding value for money. These are the ones I am fairly sure about that fitted the Design clever remit: P2 Cock o' the North A1 Tornado Flying Scotsman (second Railroad version) Duke of Gloucester GWR Hall class These are all big locos and were selling for a similar price to tiny superdetailed models like the Peckett 0-4-0. I have a P2 and Tornado in my collection, and they are both good models that were irrestible at the time because they were such good value. Both are good runners, though the P2 is even better after I replaced the original 3 pole motor/flywheen with a 5 pole skew wound motor - it gives a much better smooth start, but once the loco is moving is no better than the original 3 pole motor.

I took a ride on the real thing at the Severn Valley Railway yesterday. As we waited in a passing loop, a green GWR 4-6-0 went past on the other line. My elderly mother's comment was "Oh, I much prefer that green colour to purple. Green's a proper colour for a steam engine" I must say I agreed with her, but everone is entitled to their own taste.

Lest anyone think that the whole world is going to the dogs, I often get pupils saying "thank you, sir" as they walk out of my classroom (irrespective of whether the lesson I just taught was any good). I don't think that I or any of my classmates said "thank you" 40 years ago when we left the classroom, so clearly there are plenty of young people who still have good manners, and the world isn't in terminal decline!grinning

Hi Josh, Welcome to the forum. I've just tried out a Hornby tender drive A3 (exactly the same drive mechanism as an A4) and I am pleased to tell you that mine coped just fine around several circuits of my layout with 8 of the Gresley railroad style coaches, 4 of which had metal wheels and 4 plastic wheels. On about 70% power (a Gaugemaster feedback controller) the train ran at a good scale speed (I estimated 80-100 mph). The loop I was running it on is a mix of flexitrack, radius 4, 3 and 2, and I couldn't detect it slowing down as either the loco or coaches passed through the short section of 2nd radius curves. Therefore you shouldn't have a problem provided the traction tyres are in good condition. Mine are fairly new Hornby replacements, but Barrie Davis on youtube recommends Marklin traction tyres for their longevity. Incidentally, for a realistic train why not go for more sleeper coaches and fewer composites? I can't imagine (though I could well be mistaken) that there are many 8 coach trains running anywhere that had just one sleeper coach - it would either be several or, most commonly, none at all.

@Oli Bolly, That looks great. Please post more pictures when you get the time!

I'm not sure why people have raved so much about magnetic couplings. Presumably there is no possibility of automatic uncoupling, which tension locks will allow with an uncoupling ramp? Maybe we will one day see DCC operated electromagnetic couplings which will allow shunting anywhere on a layout?

Many people have reported problems over the years with the Hornby curved points. It may be nothing to do with nem standards. You may find that they work better with older stock that have coarser wheel flanges (making it harder to "jump the rails"). The Peco streamline curved points are much better, but are to a different geometry (much gentler radii).

The Pannier is also missing the separately fitted handrails that this model had along the sides of the tanks and across the front of the smokebox. I wouldn't bother trying to source all the spare parts to then sell the complete locos on. You will spend more on the missing parts (+ postage) than the extra value your model would gain, particularly if they are both non-runners.

In the R1040 set Mallard is in the early BR experimental blue, as described by GS. It is much darker than LNER Garter Blue.

Just to add to this conversation that Ultrascale also make conversion sets of wheels for old Triang locos: https://www.ultrascale.uk/eshop/products/view/CAT007/442 In case the ebay supplier is out of stock. Ultrascale also look slightly cheaper, especially if you are happy with brass rather than nickel silver wheels.

Hornby don't really make a small passenger tank loco of the right era for the LNER, if you are concerned with true accuracy, though you could use the old J52 (not currently in production) or more recent J50 (they were more often used as shunters to move coaches into position for bigger locos to pull. An alternative would be a small tender loco. The Hornby J15 is an excellent model, and quite often hauled passenger trains, so one in LNER livery would be a good choice. As an alternative, Bachmann make the J72 which is a small tank loco of the correct era, and, in my opinion, looks good pulling my rake of LNER four wheel coaches.

@Topcat "...but this Railroad model seems to have plain gold lettering..." All the Railroad range tend to have very simplified liveries - so don't be confused, as the Railroad range is not likely to be correct. My Railroad Cock o' the North just has plain gold lettering.

As Colin says, R3173 is a Railroad model, but an extremely good one - I am pretty sure that the early Hornby Railroad Mallard had a 5 pole motor in the loco (same as the superdetailed range) as well as tender pick-ups. However, the tender is based on the old tender-drive version (but without motor), which is wider than scale and has a rather unrealistic coal load. The loco body doesn't have separately finished cab handrails. R2339 is the superdetailed version, with finer valve gear and more separately fitted parts such as cab handrails, and a more accurate tender. My early Railroad Flying Scotsman has an almost identical mechanism to R3173 (I think the only differences are colour of wheels and different cylinders) and is an excellent runner.

The Gresley coaches are now complete and have had their first run on the mainline. The Brake third kept derailing - turns out the back to back measurement on one of the wheelsets was way out. A bit fiddly to widen it without damaging the bogie (Ian Kirk bogies are rather fragile) but all sorted now. The J69 needs some bufferbeam detail!

@ morairamike Lovely work - I particularly like the shot of the level crossing.

I am currently completing three Ian Kirk Gresley coaches which I bought going for a song off ebay. They needed bogies (I had some in my spares box, including a couple from Hornby Railroad Gresleys. Buffers came from some scrapyard Triang coaches, and the underframe truss rods were made from thick brass wire and split pins. various other fittings came from my spares box.

I still buy frequently and sell less frequently. Ebay is still very useful as far as I am concerned, as most of what I buy is secondhand, and often no longer available, such as Ian Kirk coach kits. I have only occasionally bought new items such as locos off ebay, as I prefer the guarantees that well established retailers offer, since they have a reputation to maintain. For new locos and rolling stock you will often find the prices better direct from the large retailers (such as as Rails, Hattons, Kernow etc.), or your local model shop, than you will see from over-optimistic sellers on ebay. Over the years I have had two or three bad experiences buying off ebay, but several hundred good ones, so for me it hasn't had its day yet.

When our children were young and using up almost all our disposable income, I could fit all of my locos and rolling stock on the layout. Now that they have flown the nest and are self-sufficient, the layout has expanded but so has the rolling stock (out of all proportion), so most stuff not on the layout is in an old glass-fronted bookcase - ideal for keeping the dust off, and much quicker to swap things around on the layout. However, there is yet more stored in boxes, which I am toying with selling, as sometimes it doesn't see the light of day for years.

Having only made a couple of brass chassis before, I'm guessing the different width spacers are for 00 gauge (16.5mm) and EM gauge (18.2mm) or even P4 (18.82mm). Essentially most UK models have an incorrect gauge of 16.5mm for their scale of 4mm to the foot. So those who want something more accurate opt for EM or P4 gauges. You don't have that problem with your HO gauge American kits because they are 3.5mm to the foot.

Prototype Deltic (Dapol kit, Lima chassis): Stanier Mogul:

My pleasure - be my guest! A few others I did before Bachmann produced their rtr versions were: A prototype Deltic (same principle as 86A's above) using a Dapol ex kitmaster/Airfix body on a Lima chassis A Stanier Mogul based on a Hornby black five body, Fowler 2-6-4 chassis and Triang tender from the 2P/3F A Peppercorn A2 using the long out of production Liliput/Trix body (Dapol made a few spares back in the early noughties) on a Hornby Britannia chassis with LNER tender drive. I still have all of them bar the Stanier mogul which got sold when I had to downsize and sell my LMS stock. I'll post more pics soon.

If the track is placed on cardboard, then at least the APT will tilt - hopefully more reliably than the real thing!

I have made an LNER P1 (2-8-2 tender freight loco) out of various bits and pieces, including: Flying Scotsman loco body + Cartazzi truck + cylinders Stanier 8F loco chassis, partly reversed Shire/Hunt valve gear B17/Hunt tender drive Great northern tender top. Here are the components: And the final result:

One possibility would be a second hand Fleischmann (or Piko) 0-8-0 tender loco with the front drivers removed (don't know how easy this would be). I used to own one - it had the excellent Fleischmann tender drive but it had a six wheel tender. However, there were also 8 wheel tender drives made by them as well. I can't recall the driving wheel diameter but they were small. I have a Liliput 2-6-0 tank loco whose driving wheels are 15mm diameter. However, being a 2-6-0 the con rods are shorter, and if you used this chassis you would find the cylinders were covering the second set of bogie wheels, rather than in between them.

@going spare, Your calculations are based on OO scale. G12's model is in HO scale (3.5mm to the foot), so 53.5" diameter drivers are about 15.5mm in HO gauge.